Absolutely shocking data!!! (Detroit: crimes, student loans, house)

[Retroit]

Originally Posted by Indentured Servant

I am just reflecting on the color of history.

So "reflecting" is allowable, but not "thinking"?

You crack me up!

[Indentured Servant]

Originally Posted by Retroit

Would you suppose those online shops are white- or black-owned?

(I agree with the anti-materialistic sentiment of the rest of your post.)

It does not matter if they were owned by Martians. The goal is to punish the local retailer in your area to the degree that they will rethink their hiring decisions.

[Retroit]

Originally Posted by maclock

As much as I enjoy a good p1ssing match, I don't know why you two bother engaging each other anymore.

Because it's fun. I consider it "exercise for the mind". Besides, Indentured Servant is one of the few black people that can carry on this type of discussion without getting offended. It's not like a white person can just walk up to a black person and start talking about racial matters.

[Retroit]

Originally Posted by Indentured Servant

No.

Edit: This was in response to my question:
So, do you think that a white-owned retail store located in a predominantly white suburb with predominantly white customers should hire a black person just because that person applies?

Please explain your reasoning to nyanna, because she does not understand why.

[maclock]

Originally Posted by Indentured Servant

Retroit speaks for a lot of people and has more courage to speak than a lot of people. I have grown to respect Retroit, despite our disagreements. he says what people are scared to say, regardless of what people might label him for saying it. Most people, white, are cowards when it comes to talking about race....that is why topics always seemed to get closed when the topic is race.

I hold no ill will or anomosity towards anyone or group. I just seek to be logical and truthful....and amazingly logic and truth seems to tick a lot of people off.

Well, I have engaged with you in the past, so I can state with some confidence that I am not afraid to tackle many of your decidedly different beliefs and opinions. Many of us are not cowards when it comes to discussing such matters. Rather, we just tire of the narrative, which has not changed much over the last century or so and which has been employed/appropriated by many marginalized groups over the years.

And despite what you may believe, IS, you do not have a monopoly on logical thought and the truth.

[Indentured Servant]

Originally Posted by maclock

Well, I have engaged with you in the past, so I can state with some confidence that I am not afraid to tackle many of your decidedly different beliefs and opinions. Many of us are not cowards when it comes to discussing such matters. Rather, we just tire of the narrative, which has not changed much over the last century or so and which has been employed/appropriated by many marginalized groups over the years.

And despite what you may believe, IS, you do not have a monopoly on logical thought and the truth.

The same can be said of left vs right politics and most everything else in America. There is nothing really new under the sun, yet, people are much more at ease to discuss politics, ad nauseam, without getting anywhere, than they are the topic of race. I mean, people do not move out of neighborhoods because liberals or conservatives start moving in or pull their kids out of public schools because of too many liberal children One being liberal or conservative does not generate the FEAR that race does. There is no fear or taboo associated with being anti-liberal or anti-conservative. However, there are fears of being seen as anti-black, by ones reasoning, which keeps MANY people out of civil discussions. They fear if they say what they really think.....they will be called, seen or exposed as racist.

I never said that I have a monopoly but I am comforted by the fact that I am never called a liar or illogical (poor speller.....yes ) .

[Retroit]

Originally Posted by Indentured Servant

Retroit speaks for a lot of people and has more courage to speak than a lot of people. I have grown to respect Retroit, despite our disagreements. he says what people are scared to say, regardless of what people might label him for saying it. Most people, white, are cowards when it comes to talking about race....that is why topics always seemed to get closed when the topic is race.

I hold no ill will or anomosity towards anyone or group. I just seek to be logical and truthful....and amazingly logic and truth seems to tick a lot of people off.

Thank you. The feelings are mutual.

I don't think that most people (black or white) are as racist as we think they are or as they might appear to be. Most people treat members of other races with respect from my experience. The differences between the "races" (I hate that term even though I use it) are fading away.

You raise an interesting point about white people being cowards when it comes to discussing race. I don't think that "coward" is the term. Maybe more like "uninterested". It amazes me how much blacks talk about race. Any black talk show host will invariably focus on racial topics. Blacks in casual conversation will often make racial references, often throwing in the n-word without shame. It seems as if black people look in the mirror and see a "black" person whereas white people look in the mirror and see a person. Blacks identify very much with their race, whereas white people don't give it much thought.

[rdub1968]

When I was in construction working for the largest masonry company in MI, we had numerous jobs downtown. We had to have 50% black employees on the job due to some quota.
It was one of the worst jobs I ever had in construction, we would find our 'workers' sleeping on the job, not showing up, or barely working to get the job done.

Some people don't want to work regardless of how many jobs are out there, I have seen it first hand numerous times.

How about roofing or residential construction? How come you don't see large black crews instead of Mexican or white? Is the work too hard?

I eventually got out of construction and worked with one of the top 4 accounting firms in the world. We had very few black employees, and the company pretty much spoon fed them so they can count them toward their diversity goals. Seeing some people get promoted over others based only on race was very hard to witness. So much for your 'white privilege' a previous poster mentioned. This was about 4 years ago.

[Retroit]

Originally Posted by Indentured Servant

It does not matter if they were owned by Martians. The goal is to punish the local retailer in your area to the degree that they will rethink their hiring decisions.

Most local retail are franchises of national chains, are they not? So shopping on-line doesn't divert revenue from "whites" (presumably whites own large corporations), it merely redirects capital from the local economy to New York or Chicago (or wherever the corporation is located).

In other words, it would be better for black Detroiters to give their money to a white suburb store owner (franchisee?) who might in turn spend it locally, then to give their money to a white New York/Chicago corporate executive.

[rdub1968]

Originally Posted by Indentured Servant

Most people, white, are cowards when it comes to talking about race....that is why topics always seemed to get closed when the topic is race.

Actually they are not cowards, but usually end up being called a racist by blacks - even though they are presenting facts in most cases.