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Old 09-24-2012, 05:46 PM
 
Location: Grosse Ile Michigan
28,952 posts, read 69,087,027 times
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My daughter is planning to buy a new Ford Fiesta (at least until she changes her mind next week). Having never bought a Ford new and never any new car in Michigan, I do not know whether Gorno (the closest dealer to us) is a decent dealer or not. As far as I can tell they are pretty much all the same except a few crooks who stick in a bunch of dealer add ons and then try to charge you for them, in which case we simply tell them GTH and move on. Anyone know anything about Gorno or any other Ford dealer downriver? Is there any reason to go to some dealer in another area? I cannot imagine that any given dealer is so much better they are worth driving a long distance, but then we do not know a whole lot about dealing with dealers. If you have some particular Ford dealer you think is better than others, please say why. "I really liked XYZ dealer when I bought a car from them." is not going to motivate someone to drive an hour to go to that particular dealership.

What I know about dealers is pretty much that I do not like them much and if they try to keep me from leaving, I call the police. But from what i have seen going to Chevy and dodge delears to look at cars, they are not aggressive here like they were in California. In fact, they seem downright lacidaisical.

As far as information, She will be using an employee discout so not much negotiating I think. She will probably use financing from the credit union. No trade in (they would not want it). She plans to put about 40% down.
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Old 09-24-2012, 08:36 PM
 
1,648 posts, read 2,859,567 times
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If they try to keep you from leaving, I call the police? haha. Relax - I've bought numerous cars from dealers over the years (I'm on number four now) and none of them were ever stressful. Those are relagated to the used car lots not associated with dealerships (e.g. Sally's Motors, Tom's Auto World etc).

You'll go in there and she will say she wants to take it for a test drive. The guy will make a copy of her license and off you will go. Some dealers will let you go by yourself, others may ride in the back. Then when you're done - they ask you what you thought of it. If you're interested you just ask for the price and they give you a number. You do a little negotiating and agree on a price 2-5K less than what he first said. They do the paperwork and off you go with the car. I honestly think a dentist is more painful than a car dealership.

Then again I've only driven GM cars my entire life (Chevy's, Pontiacs, Buick's and GMC's) - but I can't imagine Ford being any different.
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Old 09-25-2012, 09:22 AM
 
2,205 posts, read 2,971,157 times
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I've driven Fords exclusively and never had an issue when buying. If your daughter has an A plan, there is zero room for negotiating -- which is actually kind of nice.

The problems I've run into with dealers is when it comes to service. I had a brake issue with a 1 1/2 year old vehicle that should have been covered under warranty. Took it to the original dealership and they said the rotors and pads needed to be replaced for a cost of $700. I said forget it and took it to another Ford dealer. They found the bulletin for the issue and fixed it under warranty the same day. Final cost: $0.

So while I think there is little difference between dealerships when purchasing a new vehicle, there is a BIG difference between dealerships when it comes to service.
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Old 09-25-2012, 01:37 PM
 
Location: Grosse Ile Michigan
28,952 posts, read 69,087,027 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by belleislerunner View Post
If they try to keep you from leaving, I call the police? haha. Relax - I've bought numerous cars from dealers over the years (I'm on number four now) and none of them were ever stressful. Those are relagated to the used car lots not associated with dealerships (e.g. Sally's Motors, Tom's Auto World etc).

You'll go in there and she will say she wants to take it for a test drive. The guy will make a copy of her license and off you will go. Some dealers will let you go by yourself, others may ride in the back. Then when you're done - they ask you what you thought of it. If you're interested you just ask for the price and they give you a number. You do a little negotiating and agree on a price 2-5K less than what he first said. They do the paperwork and off you go with the car. I honestly think a dentist is more painful than a car dealership.

Then again I've only driven GM cars my entire life (Chevy's, Pontiacs, Buick's and GMC's) - but I can't imagine Ford being any different.
When I was younger and more bullheaded, a Hyundai dealership had three salesmen stand in front of the door when we tried to leave. I told my wife "Call 911 and tell them to send the police and four ambulances, that one guy looks pretty big so I will probably need one too." She dialed and a manger miraculously appeared and cleared the way. I heard that same dealership got sued for taking someone's keys and throwing them up on the roof and saying I guess you are buying a new car now, you just traded in your car. We had other problems with overly aggressive dealers in California. One asked me for a business card when I was just browsing. Then he called me twice a day every day until I told him I was going to get an injunction. They go crazy to sell you a car. You walk in and they mob you. They do anyhtign to stop you fomr leaving. THe are open on weekends and often until midnight.

However when I have visited Dodge and Chevy dealers in Michigan it was the opposite. They seemed like they really did not care if they sold any cars. We couldn't get them to give us any attention. At Dodge, they told us we had to leave because they were closing in 15 minutes. They are rarely open except during the week and a few hours on Saturday morning.

I have done test drives, even a few since we moved, just never at a Ford Dealership. When I drove the Jeep Rubicon Unlimited, I said I thought they improved these to make them more drivable, they must have been terrible before. The salesman said "They did not improve them all that much. They are still pretty awful on the road"

Well he did score some points for honesty and I almost bought a truck from him.

I do not think we will have any negotiating. As I mentioned, she gets an employee discount. If it is the same as the GM employee discount it is a fixed price (At GM it used to be 15% off the sticker and 18% off options). They cannot sell it to you cheaper or higher period. No negotiating. I like that. I negotiate large deals as part of my job. It is a PIA. I would not call it pleasant, but necessary. I do not want to do more work when I am not working. I would rather do somethign relaxing like hanging drywall or moving a tree.

Anyway what I am wondering is not how to buy a car from a dealership, but whether there is any realistic differences in Ford Delaerhsips in metro Detroit and whether anyone knows anything specifically about Gorno.
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Old 09-25-2012, 01:45 PM
 
Location: Grosse Ile Michigan
28,952 posts, read 69,087,027 times
Reputation: 35393
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arthur Digby Sellers View Post
I've driven Fords exclusively and never had an issue when buying. If your daughter has an A plan, there is zero room for negotiating -- which is actually kind of nice.

The problems I've run into with dealers is when it comes to service. I had a brake issue with a 1 1/2 year old vehicle that should have been covered under warranty. Took it to the original dealership and they said the rotors and pads needed to be replaced for a cost of $700. I said forget it and took it to another Ford dealer. They found the bulletin for the issue and fixed it under warranty the same day. Final cost: $0.

So while I think there is little difference between dealerships when purchasing a new vehicle, there is a BIG difference between dealerships when it comes to service.
Thank you. I do not know which plan it is. She does not work for Ford, but for a non-profit that was started by Ford.They might get the B plan for all I know.

GM used to have an options for employees where you negotiated the best deal you could make with the dealership and then told them you had the discount and you got an additional __% off the negotiated brice. I always hated that program. It seems dishonest. I always just used the other option (15%/18%) Since I wanted almost allthe options, it worked out pretty well for me. Now GM has a different program. I do not know what it is.

I just learned Chevy is offering the Cruz for $1000 down $99/month for two years. THat may change my daughter's mind again, but I think she really wants a Ford Fiesta. A Cruz is nto as cute and we all know the most imortant feature a car can have is cuteness.
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Old 09-26-2012, 09:30 AM
 
Location: north of Windsor, ON
1,901 posts, read 5,214,187 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coldjensens View Post
Thank you. I do not know which plan it is. She does not work for Ford, but for a non-profit that was started by Ford.They might get the B plan for all I know.

GM used to have an options for employees where you negotiated the best deal you could make with the dealership and then told them you had the discount and you got an additional __% off the negotiated brice. I always hated that program. It seems dishonest. I always just used the other option (15%/18%) Since I wanted almost allthe options, it worked out pretty well for me. Now GM has a different program. I do not know what it is.

I just learned Chevy is offering the Cruz for $1000 down $99/month for two years. THat may change my daughter's mind again, but I think she really wants a Ford Fiesta. A Cruz is nto as cute and we all know the most imortant feature a car can have is cuteness.

That Cruze lease quote is a SCAM. Have 800 credit? A non-GM car to trade in? A GM discount? If you don't have at least two of the three, go lease a Honda. Two recent anecdotes from my life: 1. Took wife in to suburban Detroit Caddy dealer to check out a SRX. Reasonable down, $350ish a month. We qualify for none of these (not sure if Caddy needs 800, Chevy has an extra discount for it) and it was another $100-150 a month. SRX is nice but not THAT nice. 2. Took her sister into an enormous Chevy dealership in NE burbs (first time buyer) to go see the Cruze. Brought in ad claiming $16K or so for a Cruze LS. Salesman all but laughed us out of the showroom as she qualifies for none of the above. They are not cutting deals on the Cruze AT ALL. Saw an ad for a '12 in Sunday's Toledo Blade (think the dealer was in Blissfield but there was more than one) and non-GMS, the year-old model was less than $1000 off MSRP. I don't think so. I've been offered an equal deal on an incoming unit Civic. If the dealers won't discount most American cars anymore, I'm done buying them. Since I don't qualify for a family/employee discount, I'm not paying $1500 more than everyone else around here. American cars are good, but not THAT good.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Coldjensens View Post
When I was younger and more bullheaded, a Hyundai dealership had three salesmen stand in front of the door when we tried to leave. I told my wife "Call 911 and tell them to send the police and four ambulances, that one guy looks pretty big so I will probably need one too." She dialed and a manger miraculously appeared and cleared the way. I heard that same dealership got sued for taking someone's keys and throwing them up on the roof and saying I guess you are buying a new car now, you just traded in your car. We had other problems with overly aggressive dealers in California. One asked me for a business card when I was just browsing. Then he called me twice a day every day until I told him I was going to get an injunction. They go crazy to sell you a car. You walk in and they mob you. They do anyhtign to stop you fomr leaving. THe are open on weekends and often until midnight.

However when I have visited Dodge and Chevy dealers in Michigan it was the opposite. They seemed like they really did not care if they sold any cars. We couldn't get them to give us any attention. At Dodge, they told us we had to leave because they were closing in 15 minutes. They are rarely open except during the week and a few hours on Saturday morning.

I have done test drives, even a few since we moved, just never at a Ford Dealership. When I drove the Jeep Rubicon Unlimited, I said I thought they improved these to make them more drivable, they must have been terrible before. The salesman said "They did not improve them all that much. They are still pretty awful on the road"


Anyway what I am wondering is not how to buy a car from a dealership, but whether there is any realistic differences in Ford Delaerhsips in metro Detroit and whether anyone knows anything specifically about Gorno.
Only dealership I've been to in SE MI that was that aggressive was Victory Toyota, and I'm not sure if they're still around. I'm leery of a Toyota dealership that isn't packed to the gills with people on a Thursday night.

Domestic dealerships may be low-key but they don't have to be aggressive. For them it's like shooting fish in a barrel selling cars in SE MI. (Heck, suckers around here even fell for the Dodge Caliber. I drove one and thought it was made by John Deere.) However, for being low-key they are still definitely snakepits. I have very little experience with Chrysler (had a Chrysler salesman try to talk me into leasing even after I told him the car WILL have 35K on it the first year) and have only ventured onto an open Ford showroom once, but I've been GM shopping a few times, and the rebates and programs are designed to rip off non-GMS customers, IMHO. After the Cruze debacle, went to the Nissan-Kia-Honda dealership a few miles down the road and it's a totally different experience.

15 minutes before closing? Wow. I bought my Chevy truck in Rochester after 8PM on a Monday night. The Nissan salesman actually said, "No dealership ever closes with customers inside it." Michigan dealership hours suck. I'd actually consider buying my next car in Ohio, where they're open Sunday, IIRC.

Constant contact from a salesman? My wife and I also checked out a Lexus CT this summer. The salesman called and emailed non-stop for weeks after. I decided if we were actually to get one I'm not getting it in Metro Detroit. One dealer has a monopoly on sales.
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Old 09-26-2012, 10:10 AM
 
Location: Here.
15,453 posts, read 14,099,410 times
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Small cars are overpriced because there is a huge demand for them for their fuel economy. For a little more, you can move up to a mid-sized car. I guess your car buying philosophy (used big car) didn't rub off on your daughter?
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Old 09-26-2012, 10:14 AM
 
4,187 posts, read 3,254,593 times
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Gorno are good people. I've actually met their general manager last year and he struck me as a very down-to-earth, easygoing guy. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend them.
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Old 09-26-2012, 11:37 AM
 
Location: Grosse Ile Michigan
28,952 posts, read 69,087,027 times
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She said definitely no lease. Prefers a Ford. Prefers Fiesta over something bigger.

No big used car becasue this one has some money saved up. She wants something easy to drive and park. The Caravan turned her off on the used car idea (something new broke every week). Now she is driving little brother's T-bird, but she has to use a pillow to sit on because she cannot reach the pedals and the seat will not move, plus the rear view mirror fell off, she has to twist some wires together to make the heater blower motor come on, then she got a ticket because a headlight was burned out. . . between the two cars, she is compeltely fed up with old cars.

After looking for much less used Foci, Fusion and Pontic Vibe (suggested here on CD - so she does listen a little bit), she decided she would prefer to put part of her money on a down payment for a new car and keep some back to ensure she can make payments and say goodbye to Toms Family Auto for a few years except for oil changes. She is really sold on the Fiesta.

She gets the Ford X plan, but so far no one seems to know what that is. No idea if the X plan is a good plan. She could trade in the Caravan. It is not really driveable (strut/spring assembly tore through the sheet metal tower that holds it in place), but the ford dealer is almost right next door to the mechanic shop where it is sitting. Will Ford take a scrap car in trade? too bad cash for clunkers is gone. (Well too bad for her, not too bad for taxpayers).

Actually I am cosidering a 1999 Grand Marquis that we may be able to get really cheap, but that is as a back up car becase we are simply running out of cars that we can rely on. At present we have 6 running cars for 5 drivers but four of them have problems that either need attention or will likely soon need attention and could be major problems. I do not want to keep buying old junker cars that break, but I do not want somone to have to stay home because we have no car for them. And this one may cost very little. Hopefully by the end of the year we will be able to replace a few of them with new or newer cars and get rid of a few of the marginal clunkers. If wwe do get that Marquis, she may drive it until Ford has better sales to clear out the 2012s.
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Old 09-26-2012, 11:41 AM
 
Location: Grosse Ile Michigan
28,952 posts, read 69,087,027 times
Reputation: 35393
Quote:
Originally Posted by highlanderfil View Post
Gorno are good people. I've actually met their general manager last year and he struck me as a very down-to-earth, easygoing guy. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend them.

Thank you. We will go there. They are reasonably close.
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