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And Detroit has had exceptionally bad management immediately following the riots and for decades after.
The Detroit Free Press presented an article that showed Coleman Young was the most fiscally conservative mayor in the last 100 years. Hate Coleman Young all you want, but he ran a tight ship government-wise.
If we're going to go down this road, at least come armed with facts. While Coleman Young was no saint, the knee-jerk reaction to his negative qualities didn't have to be to flee to 47 Mile Road to the detriment of the region's vitality. Other cities saw and planned for these problems (I.E. Atlanta and Chicago were too busy progressing), Detroiters (black and white, city and suburbs) were too absorbed in their hate and comeuppance against each other to see the forest beyond the trees. Now, we have (at best) an economically, politically and socially stagnant region with a bankrupt urban core. I'm sure that screams an attractive place to live to folks with no ties to Michigan.
Last edited by 313Weather; 12-18-2013 at 06:34 PM..
The Detroit Free Press presented an article that showed Coleman Young was the most fiscally conservative mayor in the last 100 years. Hate Coleman Young all you want, but he ran a tight ship government-wise.
If we're going to go down this road, at least come armed with facts. While Coleman Young was no saint, the knee-jerk reaction to his negative qualities didn't have to be to flee to 47 Mile Road to the detriment of the region's vitality. Other cities saw and planned for these problems (I.E. Atlanta and Chicago were too busy progressing), Detroiters (black and white, city and suburbs) were too absorbed in their hate and comeuppance against each other to see the forest beyond the trees. Now, we have (at best) an economically, politically and socially stagnant region with a bankrupt urban core. I'm sure that screams an attractive place to live to folks with no ties to Michigan.
All I'm saying is that they had the city to themselves for several decades and did very little to make it better. The government, until recently, has been plagued with bigotry (towards the suburbs) and corruption. The only people Detroiters have to blame is themselves for not being able to make it a better place. It was there's to do; they failed at it.
And yes, the way things have been run here will make it difficult to attract folks here with no ties to MI. Hence the reason for this thread. I (a person who grew up here and has family ties here) gave it a go for the past seven months and I'm happy to say that I'll be leaving at the end of the month for Colorado. Not only could I not find a decent job here, I never felt at home here.
I really hope that this place will continue to improve and get better for those who choose to live within the city. They deserve to have a safe, vibrant community to live in.
All I'm saying is that they had the city to themselves for several decades and did very little to make it better. The government, until recently, has been plagued with bigotry (towards the suburbs) and corruption. The only people Detroiters have to blame is themselves for not being able to make it a better place. It was there's to do; they failed at it.
As someone aptly described it before, blacks in Detroit have merely been feasting on an already dying corpse. The economically poorer blacks, even with the excellent administrative skills folks like Coleman Young wielded, were systematically left on their own by state and regional leaders to steer an already sinking ship. They can't be faulted (entirely) for not being able to save something that was too far gone.
Whites who control much of the world's wealth (and thus the region's wealth) took their money and left to create the "new" Detroits of Southfield, Troy, Dearborn and Auburn Hills. They obviously didn't see the value of a strong urban core if it meant living amongst people they hated and couldn't even try to reach a common ground with, and they are now just realizing how much the completely half-ass backwards way we've been doing things for the past half-century is hurting the region (thus this sudden interest in "rebuilding Detroit"), as their children and grandchildren (yourself and myself for example) continue to flee to other prosperous, growing, healthy regions.
Last edited by 313Weather; 12-18-2013 at 07:11 PM..
"Let the people and business with money downtown hire private plows to compensate for the shortfall downtown."
Detroit is a stark example of "privatize the profits, socialize the losses".
I wish more people were aware of what you're talking about. Strange to hear it from a conservative - it's mostly used in the progressive media against powerful "too-big-to-fail" banks, etc. This pertinent idea explains a lot of what's going on nationwide. Not sure you're using it correctly here.
And Detroit has had exceptionally bad management immediately following the riots and for decades after. Coleman Young did a bang up job of mending race relations. Also, many Detroiters simply adapted the victim mentality, thus exacerbating the problems initiated by the riots.
Its ironic that you use the term "victim mentality" for Detroiters/blacks while everything you say suggest that the whites who were leaving did so because they felt victimized by fear, riots, crime, corruption, incompetence and the like. If the people leaving did not have a "victim mentality" they would have never left.
Last edited by Indentured Servant; 12-19-2013 at 05:40 AM..
All I'm saying is that they had the city to themselves for several decades and did very little to make it better. The government, until recently, has been plagued with bigotry (towards the suburbs) and corruption. The only people Detroiters have to blame is themselves for not being able to make it a better place. It was there's to do; they failed at it.
And yes, the way things have been run here will make it difficult to attract folks here with no ties to MI. Hence the reason for this thread. I (a person who grew up here and has family ties here) gave it a go for the past seven months and I'm happy to say that I'll be leaving at the end of the month for Colorado. Not only could I not find a decent job here, I never felt at home here.
I really hope that this place will continue to improve and get better for those who choose to live within the city. They deserve to have a safe, vibrant community to live in.
Why the use of pronouns? What entity represents "they"? America created and accrued two realities, through its birth to now, by having different laws and treatment based upon race. That has resulted, in America, black poverty being 3 times that of whites, black unemployment being twice that of whites and black wealth being over 10 times less than whites. Thus, how does a city "get better" economically and fiscally, while morphing from a microcosm of white America to a microcosm of black America, when black Americans are so much poorer? Again, its a failure at managing expectations. The "Failure" is AMERICAS, for creating and fostering two different realities which allowed most of the wealth to disproportionately pool in the hands of whites. I mean....that was the goal anyway. Blacks were brought to this land to make money for others.....not to be given equal opportunity, wealth and parity with whites....and hence the accrued impact of this history are evidenced in the statistical skews of today.
Enjoy Colorado.......and their school shootings. Maybe your "buddy" would be interested in moving there also.
When Detroit makes its comeback, which it will, there will be a lot of unhappy people because they will not be able to say "I told you so"
Last edited by Indentured Servant; 12-19-2013 at 05:43 AM..
Why the use of pronouns? What entity represents "they"? America created and accrued two realities, through its birth to now, by having different laws and treatment based upon race. That has resulted, in America, black poverty being 3 times that of whites, black unemployment being twice that of whites and black wealth being over 10 times less than whites. Thus, how does a city "get better" economically and fiscally, while morphing from a microcosm of white America to a microcosm of black America, when black Americans are so much poorer? Again, its a failure at managing expectations. The "Failure" is AMERICAS, for creating and fostering two different realities which allowed most of the wealth to disproportionately pool in the hands of whites. I mean....that was the goal anyway. Blacks were brought to this land to make money for others.....not to be given equal opportunity, wealth and parity with whites....and hence the accrued impact of this history are evidenced in the statistical skews of today.
Enjoy Colorado.......and their school shootings. Maybe your "buddy" would be interested in moving there also.
When Detroit makes its comeback, which it will, there will be a lot of unhappy people because they will not be able to say "I told you so"
I certainly will enjoy Colorado. I'll enjoy the good-paying jobs it has, the 300+ days of sunshine, the plowed roads after a snow storm, no salt on the roads that will destroy my car's exterior, actual roads that aren't crumbling, the safety of walking around the city's neighborhoods in the evening, the beautiful landscape, the friendly nature of the people, a winning football team, world-class micro brews, a vibrant downtown with an outdoor mall, etc.
And I certainly hope Detroit makes its comeback, too. Best of luck! Maybe you'll actually live there yourself some day, since you're so proud and confident of its recovery prospects. Where is it you're living these days? Minneapolis? Chicago?
I certainly will enjoy Colorado. I'll enjoy the good-paying jobs it has, the 300+ days of sunshine, the plowed roads after a snow storm, no salt on the roads that will destroy my car's exterior, actual roads that aren't crumbling, the safety of walking around the city's neighborhoods in the evening, the beautiful landscape, the friendly nature of the people, a winning football team, world-class micro brews, a vibrant downtown with an outdoor mall, etc.
And I certainly hope Detroit makes its comeback, too. Best of luck! Maybe you'll actually live there yourself some day, since you're so proud and confident of its recovery prospects. Where is it you're living these days? Minneapolis? Chicago?
Well....Detroit was once a boom town as well. Things run in cycles. After you settle out there the cycle may turn negative after a couple of decades. I left Detroit for one reason.....and that was JOBS. I loved Detroit and still love Detroit....but love don't pay the bills. I did not see the leadership as incompetent or corrupt when I was home. I did not leave Detroit cursing and berating it for the people who remain behind and creating negative advertisement through word of mouth that only makes the situation worse. The people were I live now, in my job and circles, NEVER hear me berating Detroit. I am sure that the country is full of ex metro Detroiters, ambassadors of negativity, if you will, who salivate at the chance to tell people in their relocation area how much Detroit sucks.....which then keeps visitors, potential investors, businesses and the like away....in more self fulfilling prophecy.
I left Detroit for one reason.....and that was JOBS.
Great, so we're on the same page here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Indentured Servant
I loved Detroit and still love Detroit....but love don't pay the bills.
Word.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Indentured Servant
I did not see the leadership as incompetent or corrupt when I was home.
Kwame was a saint!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Indentured Servant
I did not leave Detroit cursing and berating it for the people who remain behind and creating negative advertisement through word of mouth that only makes the situation worse. The people were I live now, in my job and circles, NEVER hear me berating Detroit. I am sure that the country is full of ex metro Detroiters who saliavate at the chance to tell people in their relocation area how much Detroit sucks.....which then keeps visitors, potential investors, businesses and the like away....in more self fulfilling prophecy.
Well, maybe you should check my post history. I was very optimistic when I moved back here in June. Heck, I still am. I don't spend my time berating the city out of sheer pleasure. Rather, I critique the areas that need improvement. People I talk to out of state are always asking me, "Is it as bad as they say it is?" I give them the god's honest truth about the city. I give them the positive aspects and I give them facts about what needs to improve still. What they do with that information is up to them. I spent a lot of time in the city this past year. More so than any of my local friends or family that have been here their entire lives. My friends make fun of me because of how dedicated I am to the city. They tell me I'm wasting my time, blah, blah, blah. The fact is, I don't think you'll meet anyone else who's a bigger advocate for Detroit's turn around.
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I wish more people were aware of what you're talking about. Strange to hear it from a conservative - it's mostly used in the progressive media against powerful "too-big-to-fail" banks, etc. This pertinent idea explains a lot of what's going on nationwide. Not sure you're using it correctly here.
