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Old 10-25-2016, 01:03 AM
 
Location: Detroit
3,671 posts, read 4,807,839 times
Reputation: 2624

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ekman243 View Post
I stated that it is a game of musical chairs. Off the top of my head.

Blue Cross Blue Shield moved 3,000 employees from Southfield Mich to downtown

Campbell Ewald moved 1500 employees from Warren Mich to downtown

Title Source moved 1500 employees to downtown from Troy

Quicken Loans moved 3000 employees from Livonia, Mich to downtown

Compuware moved 1000's from Farmington Hills to downtown

Meridian came from the suburbs

General Motors moved thousands from Warren to Downtown

The Detroit Lions moved from Pontiac back to Detroit and left a mess in Pontiac now Detroit is going after the Pistons

All this to say, the suburbs grew at the expense of Detroit and now the favor is being returned
And I don't feel bad about it . Not one bit. Actually, I really just one them to come from Oakland County to **** L Brooks Patterson off some more. But I would rather them come from all of those other cities and states that have been talking down on Detroit for so long.
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Old 10-25-2016, 06:22 AM
 
1,648 posts, read 2,746,080 times
Reputation: 1438
The entire region is booming again - there's enough jobs for everyone to win.

Report: New Jobs Surge in Southeast Michigan During Second Quarter - Daily News - Annual 2016 - Detroit, MI
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Old 10-25-2016, 06:42 AM
 
Location: Metro Detroit
1,786 posts, read 1,935,257 times
Reputation: 3554
ekman243, Why are you making this a zero-sum game? In your world, is it not possible for a better Detroit to correlate to better suburbs? Because I'm pretty sure that's the expectation people have in just about every city around the nation. Do you see Farmington Hills, Southfield, Warren, Troy and Livonia crumbling to the ground? No, in 2015, literally every single one of those towns posted significant median household income growth and a drop in poverty rate, and 4 even posted population growth (Livonia, did not). Warren, around GM Tech Center, looks nicer and nicer every day. I think those that don't frequent the area would be surprised by the traffic and number of active storefronts in the area.

But let me guess, it's a slow process, it'll take 10 or more years, right?

Just accept that it's not all gloom and doom. After its own Private decade long recession, The Metro hit rock bottom around 2010 and Detroit soon after. Now that the Metro has rebounded to a point where it's desirable for those growing up here to stay, and sensible for those who left to consider returning, and the city is following suit. This entire topic is needlessly pessimistic, because the idea that an incredibly wealthy and generally attractive metro, which fell so far and has rebounded just the slightest bit, is going to suddenly reverse course and plunge further into the abyss of decay is just not realistic. Politically the state is in a much better place. The Big 3 have restructured to a point where their business model is sustainable and not weighted down by unfullfilable pension obligations, the city (Detroit) has done something similar, and the national narrative which surrounds Detroit is no longer "How far can this crap-hole fall." but rather "Wow, look at that crap-hole rebound!"

I'm spending way too much time on this topic. I've said what I need to say. Outside of a handful of aforementioned towns (Inkster, Ecorse, etc.) which have yet to turn things around, but were never considered desirable in the first place, I really don't see anywhere getting worse. Ten years from now someone reading this post is going to be shocked we were even having this discussion.

Last edited by Geo-Aggie; 10-25-2016 at 06:52 AM..
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Old 10-25-2016, 12:02 PM
 
1,851 posts, read 2,297,759 times
Reputation: 1864
Quote:
Originally Posted by brodie734 View Post
I think there is a little from column A and a little from column B going on here. First, it cannot be overstated how skewed the media portrayal of Millenials is... the average 29 year old is a suburban dwelling college dropout living with a partner on a relatively decent salary of $35k . The transit obsessed urbane hipster of popular imagination is largely a reflection of media concentration... a 20something journalist who went to Northwestern and lives in New York making $80k likely only associates with other upper middle income 20somethings who live in New York or went to Northwestern, their viewpoints are totally skewed.

That being said, though, I do question how much Detroit can ever truly hope to contain the stream of U-M and MSU alums who flow to Chicago and the coasts after graduation. Those are people with options and while some of them probably would stay home if they felt they could, plenty more will follow their career goals or their perceived notions of what is exciting out of Michigan no matter how many luxury condos you put up in Corktown... I am one of three people from college friend group still in Michigan and the other two are here specifically because they don't want to live in big cities. I do think the most rose colored views of Detroit's future massively overstate the potential for revitalization, but I do think people here tend to be more realistic.
Yes, people on here tend to be more realistic, except you - you are more pessimistic.

The greater downtown area, i.e. the section of Detroit contained within the Grand Boulevard loop, has great potential for redevelopment and investment, as well as a few select outer neighborhoods. With Downtown, midtown, Corktown, Eastern Market, East Riverfront, New Center, North End, Milwaukee Junction, Mexicantown, and the Villages all seeing investment, there is a momentum that is building that I believe will continue to grow if the local ecomony continues to grow and crime drops to a reasonable level. Young graduates will start looking at Detroit in a different light. I'm seeing more and more younger white adults downtown and midtown, so it is already happening.

And there haven't been any luxury condos built in Corktown.
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Old 10-25-2016, 12:03 PM
 
49 posts, read 45,008 times
Reputation: 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by ekman243 View Post
I stated that it is a game of musical chairs. Off the top of my head.

Blue Cross Blue Shield moved 3,000 employees from Southfield Mich to downtown

Campbell Ewald moved 1500 employees from Warren Mich to downtown

Title Source moved 1500 employees to downtown from Troy

Quicken Loans moved 3000 employees from Livonia, Mich to downtown

Compuware moved 1000's from Farmington Hills to downtown

Meridian came from the suburbs

General Motors moved thousands from Warren to Downtown

The Detroit Lions moved from Pontiac back to Detroit and left a mess in Pontiac now Detroit is going after the Pistons

All this to say, the suburbs grew at the expense of Detroit and now the favor is being returned
Don't kid yourself, they move downtown for tax credits, marketing, and cheap commercial space.

Sure, it seems the Palace of Auburn Hills might close down in a couple of years -- but it will IMMEDIATELY be torn down and developed by auto suppliers. Auburn Hills / Rochester is BOOMING. A space like that on 24 is worth quite a bit of coin. Silverdome's issue is it's in Pontiac.
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Old 10-25-2016, 12:05 PM
 
49 posts, read 45,008 times
Reputation: 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by usroute10 View Post
Yes, people on here tend to be more realistic, except you - you are more pessimistic.

The greater downtown area, i.e. the section of Detroit contained within the Grand Boulevard loop, has great potential for redevelopment and investment, as well as a few select outer neighborhoods. With Downtown, midtown, Corktown, Eastern Market, East Riverfront, New Center, North End, Milwaukee Junction, Mexicantown, and the Villages all seeing investment, there is a momentum that is building that I believe will continue to grow if the local ecomony continues to grow and crime drops to a reasonable level. Young graduates will start looking at Detroit in a different light. I'm seeing more and more younger white adults downtown and midtown, so it is already happening.

And there haven't been any luxury condos built in Corktown.
Once the tax credits expire the Detroit 'boom' will cease. And nobody that's spent much time in a real major city would call the development in Detroit over the last decade a boom. Zero new high rises in Detroit, just a bunch of refurbs with tax credits - Chicago and DC have probably put up 100+ new high rises in that time.
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Old 10-25-2016, 08:14 PM
 
Location: Chicago
939 posts, read 845,578 times
Reputation: 1102
I mean, if your argument relies on the fact that Corktown's luxury lofts are not technically condos then you are kind of conceding defeat from the get go.

Detroit is fine, it has momentum. People are moving there now. I just think there is a ceiling and that those who don't believe that ceiling exists are in for a rude awakening. Frankly, the CBD is so Gilbert dependent that a lot of those young white people you see could be wiped out by the next major dip in the mortgage market. That is scary and unsustainable.
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Old 10-25-2016, 11:48 PM
 
Location: Detroit
3,671 posts, read 4,807,839 times
Reputation: 2624
Quote:
Originally Posted by uchi90 View Post
Once the tax credits expire the Detroit 'boom' will cease. And nobody that's spent much time in a real major city would call the development in Detroit over the last decade a boom. Zero new high rises in Detroit, just a bunch of refurbs with tax credits - Chicago and DC have probably put up 100+ new high rises in that time.
L Brooks Patterson is that you? You almost sound just as bitter as he is.

There are new high rises being built, planned, or revitalized as we speak. And downtown Detroit's boom is just temporary because there's no newly built high rises? lmao what kind of logic is that? how about the HUNDREDS of buildings (including high rises and even skyscrapers) that have been filled to capacity in the past 10 years? How about the countless vacant spaces that are now occupied? How about there being a waiting list for the apartments downtown before their even built?

Businesses make calculated decisions, they don't just move operations, headquarters, thousands of employees, ect to a new place with the intentions of moving them again just 2 years from now. That would be a very stupid business decision.
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Old 10-26-2016, 11:13 AM
 
1,851 posts, read 2,297,759 times
Reputation: 1864
Quote:
Originally Posted by brodie734 View Post
I mean, if your argument relies on the fact that Corktown's luxury lofts are not technically condos then you are kind of conceding defeat from the get go.

Detroit is fine, it has momentum. People are moving there now. I just think there is a ceiling and that those who don't believe that ceiling exists are in for a rude awakening. Frankly, the CBD is so Gilbert dependent that a lot of those young white people you see could be wiped out by the next major dip in the mortgage market. That is scary and unsustainable.
The lone residential development in Corktown that is remotely luxury is the Grinnell Place Lofts at Michigan Ave and Brooklyn Street. That development is 10 years old. Corktown has had almost zero residential development during its renaissance. Your quote made it seem like they are throwing up condos left and right in Corktown, and contending that the development is unsustainable - but there hasn't been much residential development. That is in downtown and midtown.

The fact there has been very few new construction residential developments in the greater downtown area kind of defeats your argument (there are currently 2 in the CBD, the first since 1991). That area's growth doesn't come close to what is going on in truly thriving cities like Seattle, Nashville, LA, etc. So maybe it is sustainable.
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Old 10-26-2016, 06:06 PM
 
Location: Grosse Ile Michigan
27,767 posts, read 65,654,187 times
Reputation: 32952
Quote:
Originally Posted by uchi90 View Post
Once the tax credits expire the Detroit 'boom' will cease. And nobody that's spent much time in a real major city would call the development in Detroit over the last decade a boom. Zero new high rises in Detroit, just a bunch of refurbs with tax credits - Chicago and DC have probably put up 100+ new high rises in that time.
How long ago was this written? Many or most of the tax credits are expired
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