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Old 06-20-2017, 08:11 AM
 
Location: Chicago
944 posts, read 849,731 times
Reputation: 1121

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BayAreaHillbilly View Post
A BA in Basket Weaving can be the foundation of an MBA. Just saying.
An MBA is a poor example as they have notoriously low ROI. Grad school is really only worth it if you are going into something very career-driven or your degree is being funded.
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Old 06-20-2017, 08:58 AM
 
2,173 posts, read 2,825,466 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brodie734 View Post
An MBA is a poor example as they have notoriously low ROI. Grad school is really only worth it if you are going into something very career-driven or your degree is being funded.
Completely false.

If you go to a top-25 school, you're pretty much guaranteed a high starting salary in consulting or finance and a fast track to upper management (if you perform).

If you combine several years of experience in your field with an MBA -- even from a no-name school -- you have an excellent chance of jumping into management. I did this and accepted a director level position with a 30% pay bump 2 weeks before graduating from a local, no name program.

The only time it has a low ROI is if you have little to no experience and go to a no-name or unaccredited school.

Again, looking at the degree in a vacuum is pointless. An MBA needs to be combined with experience for it to be a valuable tool.
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Old 06-20-2017, 10:33 AM
 
Location: Chicago
944 posts, read 849,731 times
Reputation: 1121
A degree in underwater basket weaving is probably not going to be a springboard to a top 25 MBA program, though. Yes, by all means go to Harvard Business School. But for the average person, a Wayne State MBA is just going to be a decently expensive credential on top of their existing college debt. It's like a law degree in that way, if you're not good enough to go somewhere incredibly prestigious then you probably shouldn't be entering the field. If you are like my friend who got a useless German degree at Michigan with a 2.5 GPA and now works in a call center, taking on more debt that you can't really afford to get a U of M Dearborn MBA in the hopes that you can one day get promoted is a hell of a gamble... the whole point of economic insecurity is that you're insecure.

Graduate degrees that cost money or don't come with the guarantee of a job are really not worth doing unless you really are the real deal who can get into top 30 programs. These things are much more stratified now than they were 20 or 30 years ago, the days of any master's degree being enough are long since passed. This is perhaps especially true in hard sciences where a master's in biology or chemistry probably gets you the exact same job as a bachelor's degree and is only worthwhile if you need it to get into a PhD program.
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Old 06-21-2017, 09:49 AM
 
1,861 posts, read 2,305,012 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brodie734 View Post
A degree in underwater basket weaving is probably not going to be a springboard to a top 25 MBA program, though. Yes, by all means go to Harvard Business School. But for the average person, a Wayne State MBA is just going to be a decently expensive credential on top of their existing college debt. It's like a law degree in that way, if you're not good enough to go somewhere incredibly prestigious then you probably shouldn't be entering the field. If you are like my friend who got a useless German degree at Michigan with a 2.5 GPA and now works in a call center, taking on more debt that you can't really afford to get a U of M Dearborn MBA in the hopes that you can one day get promoted is a hell of a gamble... the whole point of economic insecurity is that you're insecure.

Graduate degrees that cost money or don't come with the guarantee of a job are really not worth doing unless you really are the real deal who can get into top 30 programs. These things are much more stratified now than they were 20 or 30 years ago, the days of any master's degree being enough are long since passed. This is perhaps especially true in hard sciences where a master's in biology or chemistry probably gets you the exact same job as a bachelor's degree and is only worthwhile if you need it to get into a PhD program.
If your local job market as at least decent, and you know that you will put yourself in the driver's seat to for a hefty promotion or pay raise with your current or a future employer, then it is not necessary to go to a 30 top program. Basically what your saying is that only 30 universities should have Graduate Business Schools. A Wayne State MBA might be fine for a company like Campbell-Ewald.

For a working professional with a family, it is not practical to uproot your family, or temporarily leave your family, to go out of state to a top 30 program.
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Old 06-21-2017, 10:30 AM
 
Location: Chicago
944 posts, read 849,731 times
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WSU's MBA program might be decent for a 50 year old middle manager who needs a boost to get a promotion, but at a cost of $25,744 and with no national reputation (it's an unranked b-school), it is a poor choice for an underemployed college educated millennial.

Which, again, was how this diversion got started in the first place. The question was not whether an MBA is ever a useful degree (although it has been horribly oversold and now the market is over saturated with MBAs, even the Economist thinks they aren't worth it) but whether millennial college grads sold a bill of goods by their parents about following their dreams in college could use an MBA to become more economically secure and thuse more interested in the real estate market.
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Old 06-21-2017, 12:07 PM
 
2,173 posts, read 2,825,466 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brodie734 View Post
WSU's MBA program might be decent for a 50 year old middle manager who needs a boost to get a promotion, but at a cost of $25,744 and with no national reputation (it's an unranked b-school), it is a poor choice for an underemployed college educated millennial.

Which, again, was how this diversion got started in the first place. The question was not whether an MBA is ever a useful degree (although it has been horribly oversold and now the market is over saturated with MBAs, even the Economist thinks they aren't worth it) but whether millennial college grads sold a bill of goods by their parents about following their dreams in college could use an MBA to become more economically secure and thuse more interested in the real estate market.
The problem is making broad generalizations about people in a particular age group.

There are millennials that are the stereotypical unmarried snowflakes living in urban areas, eating out every night, drinking kale shakes and using ride sharing for all their transportation.

There are working class millennials starting families that want the home in the suburbs, but can't afford it.

There are professional educated millennials taking the traditional route of buying existing and new builds in the suburbs and exurbs.

There are combinations of these three groups and everything in between.
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Old 06-21-2017, 12:28 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit
1,786 posts, read 1,941,009 times
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Can confirm. Am millennial with kids and an existing suburban home who loves avocados, $5 lattes, video games, and Bernie Sanders. No MS - didn't seem worth the added investment to find the same work I could score with a BS. More of a product of a system which markets additional degrees as the answer to everything. Definitely frowned upon by some coworkers (especially the 2 with PhDs), but the plus side is no student loan debt, so that's cool?

How this relates to the topic is that someone with a BS can afford a house, but they can't afford a 3,000 sq.ft. one in Oakland TWP, because that's just not a thing in my generation unless your wealthy parents "assist" with a 40% down payment (which happens far more often than I want to admit..). This is why young families are moving to areas considered "undesirable" by our parents. Seriously, how many college educated young adults do you think would've bought a house in Bagley back in 1995? Forget that, they'd have built a house in Rochester Hills. Today we can't afford out of control real estate costs and the mortgage crisis scarred us, so we're sticking to either renting or buying existing homes where we can afford them.
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Old 07-08-2017, 04:50 AM
 
Location: On the brink of WWIII
21,093 posts, read 24,829,756 times
Reputation: 7812
Over 38 million American households can't afford their housing, an increase of 146 percent in the past 16 years, according to a recent Harvard housing report.

Under federal guidelines, households that spend more than 30 percent of their income on housing costs are considered "cost burdened" and will have difficulty affording basic necessities like food, clothing, transportation and medical care.



Americans Who Can’t Afford Their Homes Up 146 Percent
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Old 07-08-2017, 02:34 PM
 
4 posts, read 3,643 times
Reputation: 14
Maybe I can give some perspective here.

I'm 27. I'm a "snowflake". Engineering degree from a top university. Job in automotive. Been looking at houses for years, telling myself things will slow down and constantly kicking myself for still not buying anything.

I've experienced the recession in 08. Saw people lose it all. Payed for school when times were tough for my family and there were no jobs, praying that things would rebound by the time I graduated in 2011. I got lucky and engineering jobs were coming back by the time I graduated.

For the past few years, educating myself more on markets, the economy, retirement, real estate, etc.. adult stuff... I see all these problems. I see the ever increasing cost of living and poor wage increases. I know I can't rely on social security or the stock market. I would rather work hard, play hard, vacation, LIVE while I'm young and die early rather than retire broke when I'm old and useless. I am well under the impression that unless I climb into a mid executive role to have a good future, as I see it, I HAVE to save and build assets now as making $150-200k salary in 20 years might not be enough to live on then. (this might by a stretch but you get the point...)... (the thought to not have kids and see how long I can last blowing all my money on hookers and cocaine gets more appealing by the day....... lmao, I kid, I kid...)

I CAN buy a $200-250k home by myself. However my savings would drastically decrease and I don't even have student loans. Now factor in bleak future finances, even with maintaining "good" employment, a hot housing market, past lessons learned, potential child care, increases in tuition and uselessness of it, and you can see how millennials aren't happy with what's out there for what they want to spend. The smart millennial is looking to live cheaply and spending 30% of your income on something that is largely now understood to NOT be an asset is ridiculous.

It's a different time than the past. Regardless of inflation and equivalent salaries, people are more educated with more concerns than they had 30 years ago in the same position.
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Old 07-10-2017, 12:29 PM
 
Location: Southeast Michigan
1,292 posts, read 1,081,504 times
Reputation: 1628
Sounds like you are in a very good position to buy a house. If you are too nervous about the expense, though, don't do it. It sounds like worry is all that is holding you back. One of my children bought a house here at your age, in recent years and in a similar situation. He has had absolutely no regrets and loves having left apartment life. He is very handy, though, and doesn't mind making improvements.
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