Relative lack of normal snowfall so far this year (Detroit: homes, school)

[Jomz]

Originally Posted by Coldjensens

this is why I am always skeptical of "science" based on statistics. There is probably some explanation for this data being so obviously and totally wrong, but data always seems to get twisted to show something that is simply not true.

Well it says about 8 inches over 24 hours in Detroit.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Blizzard_of_1978

I don't know. I was not even born yet. Stuff like this makes skeptical of all the old timers stories. Now the maximum snowfall is Muskegon was 4 ft ( ~52 inches). I don't think Detroit ever had a 4ft snowfall, ever!!!

More links

https://web.archive.org/web/20100213.../82723922.html

and quotes

"The Blizzard Warnings were allowed to die across Michigan during the forenoon hours of Friday, the 27th. Record 24 hour snowfall totals from the storm included, 16.1 inches at Grand Rapids, 15.4 inches at Houghton Lake and 12.2 at Dayton, OH. Snowfalls for the entire storm (25-27th) included a whopping 30.0 inches at Muskegon (some of which was Lake Michigan enhanced), 19.3 inches at Lansing and 19.2 at Grand Rapids. Snowfalls were less over Southeast Lower Michigan (mainly because of the rain that fell for a period) and included 9.9 inches at Flint and 8.2 inches at Detroit."

[North 42]

Originally Posted by Jomz

Well it says about 8 inches over 24 hours in Detroit.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Blizzard_of_1978

I don't know. I was not even born yet. Stuff like this makes skeptical of all the old timers stories. Now the maximum snowfall is Muskegon was 4 ft ( ~52 inches). I don't think Detroit ever had a 4ft snowfall, ever!!!

More links

https://web.archive.org/web/20100213.../82723922.html

and quotes

"The Blizzard Warnings were allowed to die across Michigan during the forenoon hours of Friday, the 27th. Record 24 hour snowfall totals from the storm included, 16.1 inches at Grand Rapids, 15.4 inches at Houghton Lake and 12.2 at Dayton, OH. Snowfalls for the entire storm (25-27th) included a whopping 30.0 inches at Muskegon (some of which was Lake Michigan enhanced), 19.3 inches at Lansing and 19.2 at Grand Rapids. Snowfalls were less over Southeast Lower Michigan (mainly because of the rain that fell for a period) and included 9.9 inches at Flint and 8.2 inches at Detroit."

Wow! I must have imagined those snow drifts over the roof of our school back then, thanks for clearing things up

https://windsorstar.com/life/from-th...lt-storm-of-78

[Jomz]

Well, I don't know. I'm just telling recorded snowfall in inches.

As far as I know 8 inches of snow all is 8 inches. I've been through a few 8 inches snowfalls in my life. Old timers stories are overrated is my takeaway here. Maybe 8 inches is what it takes to put snow drifts on your roof, I don't know. But the scientifically recorded snowfall in that blizzard at the airport was 8 inches

Does anybody have a picture of the so called " snow drifts on the roof of my school"

Edit, found some.

https://www.mlive.com/weather/index....lizzard_t.html

Having lived in the Keewenaw, this looks normal to me.

[Bondurant]

My dad was just talking about the '78 storm last night. My parents were moving out to Arizona for 6 months. They left Garden City ahead of the storm and managed to stay ahead of it until Amarillo, TX where they encountered thick ice everywhere.

I'm currently staying in Livonia while visiting family. We're headed to the Wings game today. Happy to miss the snow. Typically it follows me. In '16 the first major snowfall began when I arrived. Friday and Saturday were okay but Sunday was hectic. I went for a Lions/Wings doubleheader and it snowed all day. We almost were stuck in Warrendale. Streets were terrible and after helping a woman getting into her driveway we almost couldn't get going again.

[lpranger467]

I too remember building deep snow forts and snow lasting all winter long, I think its foolish of some people to ignore climate change and atleast consider that we're causing it.

[canudigit]

Originally Posted by Jomz

Does anybody have a picture of the so called " snow drifts on the roof of my school"

Well, you know, since I was twelve years old and we didn't have Smartphones back then to record every single life event, yes, I there is a picture somewhere in a big box of pictures at my Mom's house that shows a snow drift up to and partially covering the roof of our one story home. Do I have pictures of the snow drifts covering the front of our middle school that went up to the roof and didn't melt until April? No, I don't. Does that mean that they didn't happen? No, of course not, I was there.

I realize that since you weren't born yet that makes anyone who witnessed the Blizzard of '78 an "old timer", but honestly, some of us still have our full mental faculties and heck, some of us even still have our own teeth. (fast fact: you will be in your early fifties before you know what hit you and I hope that when that happens you realize that you are not an "old timer" and that your memories are clear and yes, accurate).

Because you found a few pictures that you don't think look all that bad does not mean that it wasn't, it was. It just means that you didn't find pictures that showed the full extent of the effects of the storm. 51 people in Ohio died as a direct result of that storm and 5,000 National Guardsmen were called out to help. The Ohio Turnpike was shut down in its entirety, something that hadn't happened before and hasn't happened since.This was not just another winter storm.

Just sayin'.

[scorpio516]

Detroit is almost exactly normal this year. As of 12/20, DTW has gotten 6.8" of snow. Normal as of 12/20 is 7.2".
Grand Rapids is 4" below normal.
Ann Arbor, Flint, and Lansing are all above normal.

I'm 2" below normal. Boston is way below normal. They've gotten 0.2" of snow so far this year. Usually they have about 10" so far.

[f5fstop]

I lived in Michigan 1982 and 1983, 82 had a record warm Christmas while 83 had a record cod Christmas. We played ball in short sleeve shirts. Weather in MI and most other states change drastically from year to year.

https://fox17online.com/2012/12/24/a...1982-and-1983/

[Jomz]

Originally Posted by canudigit

Well, you know,......


.... since.This was not just another winter storm.

Just sayin'.

I agree, That is why there is a wikipedia article on it. And it is called a great blizzard. But as far as i understood, it was not a great blizzard because of snowfall, it was the great blizzard because of ~100mph winds with it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Blizzard_of_1978


And to contribute to this thread, the snowfall during the great blizzard of 1978 is comparable with once in a while snowstorms in the midwest. Well, I think Indianapolis (where I lived before Michigan) had a similar magnitude snowfall this year.

https://www.weather.gov/ind/jan52014snowandcold

[Geo-Aggie]

The Midwestern Region Climate Center keeps a fun little tool call the Winter Seasonal Severity Index (WSSI). It tracks and quantifies how severe a winter is based on degrees below freezing for low, degrees below for high, freezing rain, new snowfall, and existing snowpack. I don't know the exact algorithm, but it gives a pretty good idea of how rough a winter is, considering all possible variables. You can view Detroit's here:

https://mrcc.illinois.edu/AWSSI/chart.html?stn=DTWthr

Normally by this time of year our WSSI is in the 105 range. This year we're sitting at 71, but considering we were at 45 on Dec. 1 (normal is 25), yeah it has been a mild December.

To put this in perspective last year we were at a 122 WSSI by this point and the year prior at 170. What this means for the rest of the season is.. well.. really nothing, as last year was a pretty severe winter by the end (724) and two years ago was mild (420). That being said, Detroit's most severe winter in record (2013-14 @ 1277) was 170 by this point, but the highest on record by December 25 was 271.

So, don't try to forecast based on this and take it for what it's worth I guess, we had a cold November, and we're having a mild December. Here's to an unpredictable January through March!

Also, according to this the winter of 1977-78 was indeed quite extreme, for pretty much the whole Midwest and Great Plains region, with record winters across Ohio and Indiana (Michigan set new records in 2013-14):
1977-78 map: https://mrcc.illinois.edu/AWSSI/EOSmaps/eos_1977.png
2013-14 map:https://mrcc.illinois.edu/AWSSI/EOSmaps/eos_2013.png