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It is sad about these poor babies. They are doing an investigation but the question I have is this, they said the temp was 85 or 86 but do they factor in the heat index which can reach up to 10 more degrees or better? So say if it was 85 degrees and the heat index was 5 degrees that would make the temp at 90 degrees. I have tried to find out just how old the puppies were if they were not old enough to travel that could have been a factor and I also haven't seen anything reported on just exactly how many puppies were in a crate somehow I don't think they loaded 14 crates. Everyone here in Tulsa has been suspiciously guarded about the whole situation. Also there has been no mention of the breed of dog. As has been mentioned before Pugs, Bulldogs, Boxers any dog with a smushed nose (I know the name of the type but can't spell it so won't even try) simply cannot tolerate extreme heat.
It is sad about these poor babies. They are doing an investigation but the question I have is this, they said the temp was 85 or 86 but do they factor in the heat index which can reach up to 10 more degrees or better? So say if it was 85 degrees and the heat index was 5 degrees that would make the temp at 90 degrees. I have tried to find out just how old the puppies were if they were not old enough to travel that could have been a factor and I also haven't seen anything reported on just exactly how many puppies were in a crate somehow I don't think they loaded 14 crates. Everyone here in Tulsa has been suspiciously guarded about the whole situation. Also there has been no mention of the breed of dog. As has been mentioned before Pugs, Bulldogs, Boxers any dog with a smushed nose (I know the name of the type but can't spell it so won't even try) simply cannot tolerate extreme heat.
Good points! BTW, I call the one I can't spell, "Pekes".
tookey, they don't use heat index or wind chill because those are two of several temepearture adjustments that don't always relate to real tempearture but human perception. There is a long explaination with DOT why they have a hard time using these adjustments so, they set the actual temperature as the guide.
I would think Tulsa is clamming up because that's where the focus of this is aimed. There was no tempearture issues in Chicago because they were removed well within the initial minutes of arrival and the hold was still cool. So the investigation is now looking at the events from tendering for shipment until the aircraft took-off. That's the primary airline investigation.
The airline won't release info on the shipment, that's the call of the shipper. If the shipper wants to talk about it, they can all they want, but the airlines generally won't. As for the number of animals in a crate, generally it's one animal per crate unless puppies, but the inital reports indicated one puppy per crate as they were going to different destinations. I would say, under normal incidents, individual pet owners whould have been on the 6 o'clock news and am talk shows since day one. Silence says something.
If the necropsy shows some underlying health issue, or worst, an overdose of medication or some other pre shipment neglect, that would change the airlines role. Animals have died from being overdosed, from having food and water withheld to keep their crates clean, or had health problems that made them unsuitable to travel even under perfect conditions.
tookey, they don't use heat index or wind chill because those are two of several temepearture adjustments that don't always relate to real tempearture but human perception. There is a long explaination with DOT why they have a hard time using these adjustments so, they set the actual temperature as the guide.
I would think Tulsa is clamming up because that's where the focus of this is aimed. There was no tempearture issues in Chicago because they were removed well within the initial minutes of arrival and the hold was still cool. So the investigation is now looking at the events from tendering for shipment until the aircraft took-off. That's the primary airline investigation.
The airline won't release info on the shipment, that's the call of the shipper. If the shipper wants to talk about it, they can all they want, but the airlines generally won't. As for the number of animals in a crate, generally it's one animal per crate unless puppies, but the inital reports indicated one puppy per crate as they were going to different destinations. I would say, under normal incidents, individual pet owners whould have been on the 6 o'clock news and am talk shows since day one. Silence says something.
If the necropsy shows some underlying health issue, or worst, an overdose of medication or some other pre shipment neglect, that would change the airlines role. Animals have died from being overdosed, from having food and water withheld to keep their crates clean, or had health problems that made them unsuitable to travel even under perfect conditions.
Now we sit and await the investigation results.
Thank you for explaining the temp. situation I was wondering about that. You are right silence does say something. Honestly I would not blame the airline in my opinion I would say the blame lies at the feet of the shipper but again that is just my opinion. Also I wasn't aware that food and drink is sometimes withheld although I have heard that sometimes a tranquilizer is given to pets prior to travel. It does raise the question were these pups sedated by the shipper prior to travel. There are sure alot of questions that need to be answered and I do hope someone gets to the bottom of this.
tookey, food and drink is often withheld but most times its an innocent misunderstanding by an owner. they think that the pet would be uncomfortable sitting in it's waste but not understanding that food and water is important for the pets health. Breeders and mills do it to avoid messy cages. They want to present the best foot forward so they withold food and water to keep the puppy clean and it makes them look better.
Tranqs are another issue. I was just reading a report on a dog that died. The necropsy showed no physical anything and it looked like the healthy dog just upped and died. The vet who examined the dog was a governement vet tasked with ensuring any death was not due to some biological or viral issue. The report indicated that the vet and police questioned the owner who finally admitted they gave the dog a tranq. When asked what it was or how much, they didn't know what they gave the dog or what was the dose. They got this from some friend who said it will calm the dog. they didn't even know if it was ad og drug or human, they just gave the dog some pills.
there was another where it turned out the vet refused to issue a health certificate on the dog because it was unhealthy and suffering from respitory and intestinal issues and was unhealthy to fly. The owner went to another vet and managed to finegal a health certificate saying it was incase they were stopped while driving to visit the next state.
Most owners are responsible and obey the rules, but there's about 5 - 10% that try to get around the rules. They will lie, cheat and put their pets at risk. Considering that the total animal incidents (lost, injured, deaths) account for only .01% of all animals shipped by air, the airlines have done a decent job of protecting pets from their owners. Can you imagine what the numbers would look like if owners had to report deaths, injuries, or lost animals on their personal car travels? It's easy to jump on airlines because all these events are public information, but I bet car travel is just as or more dangerious to pets in the hands of bad owners.
Is that an established fact? I am curious where and by whom this was published.
It's public information, just ask for it! (or if you subscribe to a flight operational planning service, they can provide it on any flight anywhere in the USA and all major foreign airports.)
It's public information, just ask for it! (or if you subscribe to a flight operational planning service, they can provide it on any flight anywhere in the USA and all major foreign airports.)
do you have access to the reports as the iinvestigation progresses?? I, for one, would like to know the actual facts once they have been established.....
and fwiw .... i transported a little dog to the airport monday morning.... he was supposed to fly to seattle (on American Airlines) on a 9:30 AM flight..... the employee checked the hour-by-hour temp (it was about 7AM when we got to the cargo depot) and refused the dog.... it was going to be about 85 or 86 by 9..... and as it turned out, was already 87 by 9:15 ....
so, nothing to do but turn around and take him back to his foster, over 50 miles away..... just REALLY wish i had thought to call the cargo office when we were on our way... could have saved me some miles that day.....
do you have access to the reports as the iinvestigation progresses?? I, for one, would like to know the actual facts once they have been established.....
and fwiw .... i transported a little dog to the airport monday morning.... he was supposed to fly to seattle (on American Airlines) on a 9:30 AM flight..... the employee checked the hour-by-hour temp (it was about 7AM when we got to the cargo depot) and refused the dog.... it was going to be about 85 or 86 by 9..... and as it turned out, was already 87 by 9:15 ....
so, nothing to do but turn around and take him back to his foster, over 50 miles away..... just REALLY wish i had thought to call the cargo office when we were on our way... could have saved me some miles that day.....
ahhh well, live and learn.....
Better safe than sorry. Too bad you had that extra drive, but it was the right thing to do and I'm sure you are glad you didn't ship him. Call it a lesson learned and you won't forget to call ahead next time, right?
Better safe than sorry. Too bad you had that extra drive, but it was the right thing to do and I'm sure you are glad you didn't ship him. Call it a lesson learned and you won't forget to call ahead next time, right?
yes .... ABSOLUTELY right on ALL counts..... problem is, the cargo office doesn't open until 6AM and I was out of my house by 5:15 to go get the dog and then get him to the airport...... even so, had i thought of calling, i could have turned around before we got all the way to the airport.....
i know that thousand of animals are shipped without incident every year, but i am one who just would not feel comfortable subjecting mine to the stress of flying cargo..... particularly my 2 quirky, scaredy, chicken dawgs.... and because of that, I was already a little uncomfortable taking this little foster fella to be flown..... but, it was what the rescue group wanted and in this situation, i was nothing but the transporter..... without the cool car and great clothes and awesome physique....
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