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Old 11-21-2010, 12:11 PM
 
Location: San Diego North County
4,803 posts, read 8,748,694 times
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It's driving me crazy--to the point that I am considering putting this dog in diapers. I've already put him in a belly band to circumvent the marking behavior.

I rescued him three weeks ago. He'd been in the shelter for three months. He's fed on schedule twice a day, walked 20 minutes later, goes to dog park once a day, goes out into the back yard a couple times a day, and takes several 10 minute walks periodically throughout the day, yet he still is not making the connection between going outside (to an abundance of praise) and going indoors.

He pees, he poops, he marks....I don't really know what to do anymore. I've never had this much trouble housebreaking a dog before.

Any suggestions?
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Old 11-21-2010, 12:38 PM
 
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3 weeks really isn't that long. He needs time to settle in and adjust. And if he was never housebroken you need to start treating him like a new puppy, taking him out more often. With time and patience he will get it.
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Old 11-21-2010, 12:45 PM
 
Location: Marion, IN
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How old is he? Has he been neutered? Was he housebroken before he was at the shelter?
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Old 11-21-2010, 12:50 PM
 
Location: San Diego North County
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The shelter said that he is about two. He was a stray, so I have no idea what his former life was like. He was neutered before he left the shelter.

He goes out about six to eight times a day. I just don't know how I can feasibly up that number.
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Old 11-21-2010, 01:02 PM
 
Location: Stuck in NE GA right now
4,585 posts, read 12,364,009 times
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I don't know where it is on this forum but there is a REALLY good step by step instructions for potty training the puppy and older dog that a post put...we at one time had requested it become a sticky but for some reason it fell on deaf ears so you'll have to do a search.

Unfortunatly your going to have more patience with your new furbaby (congrats btw and thanks for saving a dog). I've had several rescues and it took a loooong time to get them really housebroken.

First step is to limit the area in the house he's allowed, when your not able to watch him like a hawk it's the x-pen or crate.

Don't give up, it will just take a while longer - remember he was in a shelter for longer than you've had him so he was proly peeing and pooing in the kennel. If he's marking he proly wasn't neutered until recently.

Poodles and Schnauzers are really smart so he'll have you trained in no time...err ummm I meant to say you'll have him trained in no time

Sooo do you have photos???
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Old 11-21-2010, 01:06 PM
 
Location: Marion, IN
8,189 posts, read 31,231,607 times
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It can take 90 days to get the testosterone out of his system. If he was just neutered 3 weeks ago he still has plenty in him.

I am going to take a guess and say that this dog has not been housebroken before. The behavior sounds like a dog that has never lived indoors.

While I am not a fan of crating it sounds like this fella is a candidate. When he is not crated, keep him on a short leash attached to your belt. Correct the behavior as soon as he begins to go and take him out.

You will also need a good bio-enzymatic cleaner like Urine Off or Urine Free to remove the urine that is already in your house. If you don't eliminate the urine it will draw him to continue peeing in the same spots. Regular cleaners will not remove urine, you need something formulated specifically for it. Urine Free is probably the best thing on the market these days. If there is a Bark Buster's near you their product, Buster's Secret, will do the trick. Get a black light to make sure you have found all of the urine.
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Old 11-21-2010, 01:13 PM
 
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Have you considered crate training? It might be a good option for establishing a firm association with outside and bathroom time.

Should you decide to try it it's important you make his introduction to the crate a positive thing rather than something he associates with punishment.

Please don't give up. 3 weeks is not a long time and it sounds like he's had a rough life prior to your bringing him home.

3 months at a shelter where he had no choice but to relieve himself in his kennel is a long time. It's not at all unreasonable to assume it could take a fair amount of time to undo the habits that his lengthy shelter stay established.

Thanks for rescuing him.
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Old 11-21-2010, 01:22 PM
 
Location: Montreal -> CT -> MA -> Montreal -> Ottawa
17,330 posts, read 33,025,722 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturningWest View Post
I don't know where it is on this forum but there is a REALLY good step by step instructions for potty training the puppy and older dog that a post put...we at one time had requested it become a sticky but for some reason it fell on deaf ears so you'll have to do a search.
This is the post that ReturningWest is referring to. It's by Viralmd who used to post here frequently:


Below is my housetraining post. IT WORKS. But you must follow it TO THE LETTER, as must EVERYONE in the house. It's good for puppies AND grown dogs. And realize that some dogs NEVER learn to signal. Neither of my dogs does.

Housetraining your dog (puppy or adult!)

The first thing you need to do is to remember that you’re trying to reinforce a new behavior. That means that the rewards for this behavior must be WONDERFUL. NOT crap from the store. Wonderful treats are poached chicken breast/turkey breast, cheese and steak. And you don’t have to use big pieces. Tiny pieces (about 3mm cubes) are just fine! I poach a whole turkey breast every few weeks, cut it into hunks when it’s cool enough to handle, wrap them well and store them in the freezer. When I need some, I’ll thaw a hunk overnight and cut off pieces and dice finely, storing them in a plastic bag in the fridge. One hunk will last about five days. Cheese is also popular, so variety is fine.

I carry these plastic bags in my jacket pockets in the winter and in a fanny pack in warmer weather. You HAVE to have these with you, or this method won’t work, because you need to reward as soon as the dog finishes pooping or peeing. It’s not going to work if the rewards are in the house.

Remember that you’re trying to change a very ingrained behavior. Some dogs like to feel certain things under their feet when they eliminate, like fabric, or newspaper. This is called a ‘substrate preference.’ What you’re trying to do is change this substrate preference, and to do that you have to make the treats SO wonderful that the dog will change this very well-entrenched behavior. Thus the chicken, cheese, steak.

I love clicker training, but this can be done without clickers. You just need a way to ‘mark’ the behavior you want to reinforce. Use the word ‘YESSSSS!!!!’ very enthusiastically – that works for some.

You’re going to need to GO OUTSIDE WITH your dog and the dog needs to be on a leash. Yes, even in winter. If you don’t reward IMMEDIATELY after the event (when dog immediately finishes pooping or peeing) and wait inside, the dog is going to be reinforced for coming inside, not for doing its business. So, leash up your dog. STAND IN ONE PLACE. Be boring. Bring a book or magazine for yourself.

Eventually, the dog will do what you’re waiting for. The NANOSECOND that the dog is finished, HAVE A PARTY – lots of loud, high-pitched praise, treats and running around. You want to make this memorable for your dog! You’ll find that once the first event is achieved, the others will come more quickly. Keep on treating (you don’t have to throw a party except for milestones – a milestone = if he only pooped outside but now peed, too, or something equivalent to that) until he’s good and used to peeing/pooping outside. Before you know it, you have a trained dog.

Regarding accidents in the house: NO SCOLDING. Just clean them up. If you scold you’ll get the dog to think it’s bad to pee or poop and he’ll do it in places you won’t see. Until you step in it. Invest in a big bottle of Nature’s Miracle or Simple Solution and use it liberally on accidents.

To quote Patricia McConnell, author of “The Other End of the Leash” and co-author of “Way to Go” (a booklet on housetraining), “Once you face the fact that you just have take your dog out every time you turn around, give them the treat immeditely after they potty, and prevent accidents in the house… well, it usually goes so smoothly.”

With young puppies, remember they have little control of the muscle that holds the bladder closed. This is something they grow into. Just as it’s not expected that a human baby is toilet trained at six months, don’t expect much from a puppy. Patience, patience, patience!!!! The nervous system in a puppy has to mature, and it won’t have much control over the sphincter (closing muscle) at the neck of the bladder until six or seven months. The same goes for the anal sphincter. Until control is achieved, both of these muscles operate on reflex: there are stretch receptors in the bladder wall. When the bladder is full, it sends impulses to the spinal cord and these, in turn, send signals to the sphincter to open and the dog pees.

In the stomach wall, there are also stretch receptors. So when the dog eats and the stomach is stretched, the impulses again go to the spinal cord, but this time the reflex, outgoing, nerve signals are sent to the anal sphincter, so the dog defecates. This operates in people, too – which is why some people rush to the ‘reading room’ after a meal – especially breakfast.
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Old 11-21-2010, 01:39 PM
 
Location: On this planet most of the time
8,039 posts, read 4,513,723 times
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First of all thank you so much for giving this baby a second chance you eventually will be rewarded more than you ever thought you could be.
Thanks to DandJ for finding the potty training post I think it should be a sticky too as those questions get asked alot but what do i know?
Now back to this topic Please be patient this life is new to the little one there are many behaviors that have to be learned or relearned. I agree Schnauzers and Poodles are very smart dogs they are extremely easy to train it does take time though. I know some are and some are not in favor of crate training but I have always crate trained all my dogs with much success. Other than that I cannot add any more to what the other posters have said just be patient and reward for good behavior. Everytime he makes a potty outside bust your fanny cheering him on and praising him highly. Above all just be patient and before you know it you will look back and think to yourself that the process was easier than you thought it would be although right now I am sure you are probably ready to tear your hair out.
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Old 11-21-2010, 04:05 PM
 
18,836 posts, read 37,357,132 times
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Don't forget to monitor the water, he does not need water 24-7, give him a short drink, pick up the water.
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