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No, Harley...I've never owned a pitbull, and, frankly, I wouldn't want to.
Because your opinion sure is strong for someone who has never owned one. I myself would find it hard to have a strong opinion on something I have never experienced for myself. It's just funny that everyone on here who dislikes pit bulls has never owned one, and the people who owne them love them on here and know the real truth about them because they have experienced a pit bull full time in their homes. So everytime I read about non pit bull owners retelling what they have so called heard about this breed I just laugh.
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This 9 lb dynamic yorkie/mix is everything you make pit bulls out to be AND WORSE!
I have to carry special blood-soaking towels with me wherever we go in case she gets that wanton BLOOD-LETTING urge to unleash hery fury on random victims.
Because your opinion sure is strong for someone who has never owned one. I myself would find it hard to have a strong opinion on something I have never experienced for myself. It's just funny that everyone on here who dislikes pit bulls has never owned one, and the people who owne them love them on here and know the real truth about them because they have experienced a pit bull full time in their homes. So everytime I read about non pit bull owners retelling what they have so called heard about this breed I just laugh.
Great. Another pit bull owner with a sense of humour.
What if I've known people with pit bulls? And I had to take care of an American Staff. terrier for about a month while her owner was sick. Walking her was a real chore and a pain because she wanted to lunge and attack any small dogs in the vicinity. I would have to keep on the lookout for other dogs and try to keep them out of our path. Again, I see zero reason to ever own any such muscle bound powerful dogs. No pit bulls, no cane corsos, no presa canarios, no chow chows, no rotties, no german shepards, no belgian malinois... and there is no need to laugh at my personal taste in dog breeds.
I really don't have much to say because I've read all four pages and have laughed a ton; which I've needed. Thank you!
I've not owned a full APBT or ASBT, but I have fostered a Boxer/ASBT mix and I work with bullies everyweek. I have loved them all. All are rescues and most have been abused yet they love other animals, play with kids, and have no tye of aggression.
I own a Shih Tzu that is more aggressive than any "pit bull" I've met and I've met hundreds. American pit Bull Terriers and Staffordshire Bull Terriers are one of the most misunderstood dogs out there. And happen to be one of my favorite types of dog.
So you want to get rid of all the bigger dogs? So Chihuahuas, Yorkies, and poodles are the only breeds left? There are more large breed dogs than any other. Most Labs weigh more than any "pit bull". Are you going to get rid of Labs too? Now that seems a bit silly. It just sounds like you've done bad research and met badly trained dogs. If your "friends" dog was well trained and well socialized chances are he would not have this problem. And just because she lunged doesn't mean she would have attacked it. She probably wanted to see the dog just like every other dog on a walk.
All of my dogs pulls towards other dogs and all five of my dogs have lifted up their lips. Yet when my Malamute mix was mauled by a lab mix she did nothing. She didn't bite him back or do any kind of fighting, but when we took her home she was bleeding from her mouth and had cuts all over her face. That doesn't mean I'm going to take them out back and kill them.
I think you need to find some better resources and not get all of your information off of the internet and television. If you've done any type of right research you'd know pit bulls have jaws formed just like any other dog. They don't have a locking jaw and they don't put out 12000 lbs of pressure sq. inch. GSD and Rotties have more jaw pressure than a "pit bull". I'd get all of your facts straight before you come onto a dog friendly/ "pit bull" friendly forum and start spiting out faulse information.
If you've noticed everytime I say pit bull I put quotation marks around them because there is no such breed as a "pit bull". If you really want to talk about a breed I'd start there.
Great. Another pit bull owner with a sense of humour.
What if I've known people with pit bulls? And I had to take care of an American Staff. terrier for about a month while her owner was sick. Walking her was a real chore and a pain because she wanted to lunge and attack any small dogs in the vicinity. I would have to keep on the lookout for other dogs and try to keep them out of our path. Again, I see zero reason to ever own any such muscle bound powerful dogs. No pit bulls, no cane corsos, no presa canarios, no chow chows, no rotties, no german shepards, no belgian malinois... and there is no need to laugh at my personal taste in dog breeds.
Labs can be just as dangerous they just fly under the radar a little better. My cousin and I were attacked by a lab when we were 14. My first dog when I was a kid was a lab and he bit my 4 year old neighbor. After that we could never trust him around small children again. There is a black lab across from where I live now who tries to attack my pit bull(and everybody elses dog) everytime I take him for a walk. I'm scared one day the lab is going to get loose and attack my dog and my dog because he is a pit bull will get blamed for the whole thing. Just 3 months ago in Kailua Hawaii where I live there was a lab who attacked, mangled, and killed an 8 month old beagel. I still think in my opinion a month with a dog, that is not yours, is not enough experience to have a strong opinion like you do with pit bulls. I just laugh when people think labs naturally have a better temperment than pit bulls.
First, we'll start with a little bit of history as to how Pit-Bulls came into being. The pit-bull is a cross breed between a REGULAR bull-dog and a terrier. The American Bulldog, which is NOT to be confused with the pitbull, btw, was originally bred as a work dog, frequently used by farmers in ploughing and tilling or used in sheepherding AND for protecting the herd of sheep or cattle against marauders such as wolves, etc. If a member of the herd seemed unable to catch up to the rest, the bulldog would nip the lagging member of the herd in the ribs, and then corkscrew the herd member to the ground, hence forcing them to catch up to the rest of the flock.
They were primarily used in the rural south for this purpose. Later, however, with the advent of herding machines that were used to control the herds, the bull-dog ultimately disappeared from the scene The terrier, on the other hand, was primarily bred and designed to kill rats that ended up on board ships with immigrants who crossed over from the old world to the United States. Hence, the terrier provides the pitbull with the aggressive and combative temperament. Later, however, British bulldogs, which were much tougher and had a much more powerful jaw also came into existence. Hence, the pitbull that's known here in the United States today developed what's known as the "steel-trap" or locking jaw.
Moderator cut: please, facts only
Yesterday you said they were Staffordshire Bull Terrier and Bullmastiff. Today they are Terrier and British Bulldog.
Throughout history I have never seen nor heard of a breed known as the regular bulldog. They are a cross of bull and terrier breeds, not a bulldog and a terrier. The British Bulldog “later” came into existence…ok, I guess all those books, painting and record keeping have all been wrong about the breeds long time existence.
If the Pit Bull has a locking jaw because it has bulldog ancestors then at least a dozen other breeds should as well since they are descendants of bulldogs and some bull and terrier…lol
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The American Bulldog is a separate breed to from the APBT. What was the reason for mentioning them? American Bulldogs were used for treeing bears, driving cattle, guarding farms against predators and catching game. These dogs are descended from the same Bulldogs as the APBT. There history runs a similar course of being brought to the US from overseas. When they were used on farms they were not shepherds. They were driving dogs and holding dogs. Who would catch and hold a bull or boar with their strength and wide jaw. This was an easy task with their history as bull baiting and combat dogs and much needed for the farmer. This is similar to other breeds of dogs used as butcher dogs who would catch and hold cattle most often for slaughter. The Scott, Painter, and Margentina types in some instances look very close to APBTs at times. As well it is a known fact that strains of AB have without a doubt Pit Bull blood crossed into them. The ABA registered even full blooded Pits as American Bulldogs and bred into AB stock. Many an American Bulldog were used as pit fighting dogs as well in America. Why change the breeds history now. Casey Corturier (the founder of ABA) had both APBT and AB he likely crossbred as well. Consider many APBTs from his early dogs were larger then average, had the AB head/body and some were piebald. The same goes for his ABs he even advertised a couple of the bloodlines in an AB of his that were APBTs bloodlines I believe. People have often cross bred the AB and APBT some even still do. The AB has had a good bit of refining; there are a few different types/strains.
http://www.american-bulldog.com/fang.jpg (broken link)
This is one of Casey's prized males White Fang. He was shot to death by a neighbor after chasing the neighbors dog back to its owners home. When living he was said to like to get into trouble with not only Casey's large boar stud but also his 90lbs “Pit Bull” Which shows the AB influence in itself by size alone.
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All of this is not to say that OTHER dogs don't have a ferocious temperament, or can't inflict serious damage when they bite, because they can and they do. However, (and there are peopole who disagree with me here, which is OK), the pitbull poses a special risk to non-owners AND owners alike. Here's why: First of all, pitbulls, unlike most dogs, have been bred primarily for fighting, and as attack dogs. Their genetic breeding (a combo of Stafford Bull Terrier, Bull Mastiff and/or bulldog) gives it the kind of temperament that makes many owners and other people select such dogs to train as fighters. Drug dealers often use them to protect their stash of drugs and territory, and other people who train them for dog fights train them to fight to the death, which pitbulls often will do.
Moderator cut: editThey were never bred as attack dogs. They were bred mainly as Pit fighting dogs and human aggression culled out of them. So your statement is an oxymoron of sorts. If they were bred for “attack dogs” (guard, protection whatever), well for one they’d have to be used at such to selective the traits and temperament of such a dog when breeding. They would also be the ones with protection and guard titles or being used in this field the like GSD, Rotti, Dobie or Corso (ect). I’m sure pit dogmen were too busy conditioning their dogs and fighting them to worry about selecting a dog that would make a good attack dog. Since they also expected a dog that would allow anyone to condition, handle and vet them they needed one that wouldn’t bite a person. Dogs passed from numerous owners at times as well without problem, they most readily accept humans as their friends.
The foundation of this breed is Moderator cut: editfrom the early bull and terrier crosses. If they are being selected for fight drive in gameness then that is due to breeding, how can one say that in one breath and then say they are trained for fighting. No it isn’t too the death, not saying it can’t end that way, Moderator cut: edit Why do 2 dogs go in and usually 2 came out? If the fighting is to the death how do losers go to fight again or be retired to a stud dog? How can they do this if they are dead? Seems impossible to me. There are countless winners and just the same there are countless loser who didn’t die fighting, they died from heartworms, cancer, old age, ect. The thing most likely to kill a fighting would be shock afterward. If they went into it in the first place and if it couldn't be combated. Some might die of infection due to injury, this could even be a week after once it spreads thoughout the body. Dying from fight related injury isn't the same thing as fighting to the death. Pits can take a beating a live probably due to their past breeding. When the Pit pup I spoke about with 13 broken bones due to abuse came in the ASPCA lady/vet said if she had been another breed she probably wouldn't have survived. There are of course other miracle dogs and formidable breeds out there.
So where is the special risk? It is known that pits were used mainly for fighting (and a few other task). You still haven’t explained where the special risk is. Since the breeding shows to have a made a dog opposite of what you are saying Moderator cut: edit
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This is not to say that ANY dog, under certain circumstances, can't snap and become aggressive and combative. However, unlike most dogs, including dobermans, rottweilers, and some other species, pitbulls have what is called a "steel-trap", or locking jaw, which is actually constructed differently than the jaws of most dogs. Unlike most dogs, who will bite and immediately release their hold and back off, and then bite again if they want, and also immediately release their grip pitbulls tend to not only bite, but to clamp down and hold on to their prey, and have even been known to shake their prey around like a toy, unlike most dogs.
SCIENTIFIC evidence has already shown that Pit Bull don’t have a special jaw design different from other breeds nor do the lock. This is based on facts and not something a person with too much imagination made up.
Other breeds bite and immediately release their hold and back off? Where did you get that tid bit from? The GSD which was shown attacking on film wouldn’t let go of the suspects leg. They told the dog to out several times, tried physically stopping him. The dog continued to hold and shake and even pulled the guy a couple feet by his leg. When Rottweilers attack they generally grab on and pull down. In no way do they quickly bite and release, none of the Rotts I’ve watched ever did this. Again some probably do, depending on the bite. American Bulldogs being bred for catch work they certainly don’t bite and let go. They have competitions for American Bulldogs called “hang time” in which the dog must hang suspended from the ground for a certain length of time and also shake tenaciously. The dog has to meet a min. time and then they are judged by how much they shake and such. They use this same method when catching a boar or attacking a human. There are many other breeds which probably do this by default such as Dogo Argentinos and other breeds still do it even without being bred for fighting, catch or baiting. I’ve seen Jack Russells and Boston Terriers which could hang for a long time, don’t tell me they have locking jaws too? The Golden that attacked was being beaten by his owner and still didn’t stop. Moderator cut: edit
I would also like to know since only Pit Bulls attack, do such bad damage and don’t let go why that Rottweiler ran out of the house and grabbed an 18 month old out of the stroller and was shaking him around (i.e. not letting go) and had to be beat off by a cop? The dog obviously didn’t let go and didn’t just bite and release, it intentionally grabbed that kid out of the stroller and I don’t think the kid provoked him.
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More to the point, unlike other dogs, the bite of a pitbull actually penetrates deeper into the musculature, and crunches the bones of their prey, therefore inflicting even more horrific damage.; Babies and small children have been attacked without provocation and even killed by pitbulls. There was a horrific story last fall of a 12-year-old boy in San Francisco who was killed when two pitbulls that were not muzzled by the owners, attacked, mauled and killed the boy in a San Francisco park. A few years before, a woman was attacked and killed by two pit-bulls in her San Francisco apartment building, also without provocation, when the owners did not keep them under control and muzzled.
No they don’t bite like that specifically. Most large breeds can break bones including Pit Bulls, but that’s including. This isn’t like a regular occurrence anyway. When people are attacked by Pit Bulls or other breeds it isn’t broken bones that is a danger but lacerations that lead to nerve damage and possibility of bleeding to death, especially if arteries are hit.
DH had no broken bones are deep penetration when bit. The dog didn’t bite and hold on, they bit and stopped right away. Moderator cut: edit Its not about breed its about the individual dog, why they attack, how they attack and such plays a part on whether it’s a quick bite or a full blown attack in which they won’t stop or let go.
Moderator cut: edit
So the reason that Pom killed the baby is because it provoked the dog? The Doxie which chewed the boys genitals off was provoked by this child. The Huskies which killed the small boy was provoked? I doubt any of that. It doesn’t matter what breed a baby doesn’t intentionally provoke the dog. So they attacked without provocation? Unless you honestly think a 6 week old baby is a threat! The problem is owners who are not responsible, no training, no human alpha leader. The dogs attack because they are the alpha, they are scared/threatened or jealous. Of course that includes Pit Bulls but having restrictions for them isn’t going to stop the serious attacks and deaths caused by other breeds so it seems pretty pointless.
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Moreover, even a pitbull who has supposedly been "bred to be gentle" can and will snap, and attack out of the blue, with horrific results.
Moderator cut: edit If Pits WILL snap out of the blue can you please explain how they die at 12-19yrs old and never snap or turn out of the blue and attack? Including those put in situations of not only being around family members but also being around many strangers and different environments as therapy or service dogs. I’m just a bit confused since they will go against their breeding and just attack out of the blue. Which of course makes no sense first you were saying genetic this and DNA that, but then ignore the fact they’ve been bred gentle, stable, human friendly, now they will go AGAINST breeding instead of acting as they are bred. Moderator cut: edit If the dog is not raised right in the correct household bad things will happen, from a bad habit to a seriously dangerous dog. If the dog is bred wrong and even possibly cross bred with a larger guardian breed then serious trouble can and does abound.
The fact that Pits were not even known for biting, let alone mauling and killing people, when they were used almost exclusively for fighting spoils your theory yet again. Most even pet Pits at that time were bred from pit stock. Just as Petey was bred from pit stock, so were other non fighting dogs. Even CH Jimmy Boots started out as a house pet and was also allowed to freely roam the neighborhood along with the rest of town dogs. Children were also more likely to be playing outside alone then they are now, yet they were not being maimed and killed by Pit Bulls or others breeds even though the dogs roamed free. There are certainly a significant available for a Pit Bull or other breed to attack these unsupervised children. Yet they were not harmed.
and there is no need to laugh at my personal taste in dog breeds.
Just as there is no need to criticize another for their personal preference for a breed you don't care for.
My sister had a pit who was the best dog ever. I would take him over my mother's Bischon anyday!!! He had great coloring and was sometimes not recognized as a pit. She would take him out sometimes and would judge by the person's demeanor how to answer, "He's gorgeous. What kind of dog is he?" Sometimes he was a pit, sometimes she answered a hawaiin bull dog. A lot of times the pit answer got, "Oooo-I don't like those dogs" and the person would walk away. Every time, the hawaiin bull dog answer got, "Oooo-I've never seen one of those. Can I pet him?" And Shadow would get a nice scratch behind the ears.
Pitbulls: These Dogs Present a Special Risk to Non-Owners and Owners Alike:
Roughly a couple of years ago; ago here in Boston, a special pit-bull restrictions law was implemented, or they at least attempted to implement it. ; Given the special dangers that Pit-bulls present, I believe that a restriction on these dogs is a good thing. Nobody is asking pit-bull owners to get rid of their pets, but the owners ARE being asked to take the responsibility that goes along with owning such a dog. Here's why I support this kind of restriction on pitbulls:
First, we'll start with a little bit of history as to how Pit-Bulls came into being. The pit-bull is a cross breed between a REGULAR bull-dog and a terrier. The American Bulldog, which is NOT to be confused with the pitbull, btw, was originally bred as a work dog, frequently used by farmers in ploughing and tilling or used in sheepherding AND for protecting the herd of sheep or cattle against marauders such as wolves, etc. If a member of the herd seemed unable to catch up to the rest, the bulldog would nip the lagging member of the herd in the ribs, and then corkscrew the herd member to the ground, hence forcing them to catch up to the rest of the flock.
They were primarily used in the rural south for this purpose. Later, however, with the advent of herding machines that were used to control the herds, the bull-dog ultimately disappeared from the scene The terrier, on the other hand, was primarily bred and designed to kill rats that ended up on board ships with immigrants who crossed over from the old world to the United States. Hence, the terrier provides the pitbull with the aggressive and combative temperament. Later, however, British bulldogs, which were much tougher and had a much more powerful jaw also came into existence. Hence, the pitbull that's known here in the United States today developed what's known as the "steel-trap" or locking jaw.
All of this is not to say that OTHER dogs don't have a ferocious temperament, or can't inflict serious damage when they bite, because they can and they do. However, (and there are peopole who disagree with me here, which is OK), the pitbull poses a special risk to non-owners AND owners alike. Here's why: First of all, pitbulls, unlike most dogs, have been bred primarily for fighting, and as attack dogs. Their genetic breeding (a combo of Stafford Bull Terrier, Bull Mastiff and/or bulldog) gives it the kind of temperament that makes many owners and other people select such dogs to train as fighters. Drug dealers often use them to protect their stash of drugs and territory, and other people who train them for dog fights train them to fight to the death, which pitbulls often will do.
This is not to say that ANY dog, under certain circumstances, can't snap and become aggressive and combative. However, unlike most dogs, including dobermans, rottweilers, and some other species, pitbulls have what is called a "steel-trap", or locking jaw, which is actually constructed differently than the jaws of most dogs. Unlike most dogs, who will bite and immediately release their hold and back off, and then bite again if they want, and also immediately release their grip pitbulls tend to not only bite, but to clamp down and hold on to their prey, and have even been known to shake their prey around like a toy, unlike most dogs.
More to the point, unlike other dogs, the bite of a pitbull actually penetrates deeper into the musculature, and crunches the bones of their prey, therefore inflicting even more horrific damage.; Babies and small children have been attacked without provocation and even killed by pitbulls. There was a horrific story last fall of a 12-year-old boy in San Francisco who was killed when two pitbulls that were not muzzled by the owners, attacked, mauled and killed the boy in a San Francisco park. A few years before, a woman was attacked and killed by two pit-bulls in her San Francisco apartment building, also without provocation, when the owners did not keep them under control and muzzled.
A year ago (I saw this on the 11 o'clock news), a 16-year-old girl in suburban Belmont, MA., was walking her dog one evening when they were attacked by an unmuzzled pitbull.; The pitbull bit, clamped down and started to shake the girl's dog around like a toy.; The 16-year-old girl bravely went and pried the pitbull's jaws off of her dog.; Both she and her dog sustained some rather nasty-looking injuries, which left some deep scars; they were treated, and were OK.
Another horrific case occurred in one of Boston’’s neighborhoods, where a woman's dog was severely mauled and seriously injured when an unmuzzled pitbull attacked them.
A neighbor who happened to be walking by came to the aid of the woman and her dog, rescuing them by clubbing the pitbull to death with a baseball bat. The dog who was attacked barely survived. In yet another horrific incident, in downtown Boston, an out-of-controll, unmuzzled pitbull attacked a police officer, who ended up having to shoot the pitbull in order to get the pitbull to let go of him. This occurred in broad daylight, and there were many people around. There was a potential danger here too--the unmuzzled pitbull could've also resulted in an innocent bystander getting hurt or killed.
Contrary to what many people believe, it's not just "the owner". Pitbulls are not like any other dog. Not only are their bites more dangerous and inflict much deeper, more serious injury than the bites of most other dogs, but pitbulls are even more likely than other dogs to attack just out of the blue, without any provocation whatsoever, which in all the above-mentioned cases, the pitbull did.
Moreover, even a pitbull who has supposedly been "bred to be gentle" can and will snap, and attack out of the blue, with horrific results. I know a woman whose family had a dog who was a pitbull mix when she was growing up When she was quite small, the dog turned and attacked her out of the blue, biting her in the face, clamping down on her nose and holding on, until the father finally got the dog off, and, ultimately got rid of it. The woman has a deep scar on her nose because of that incident. Not surprisingly, pitbulls have also been known to turn on their owners in a number of cases
Here's what the pitbull restrictions law entails (or would entail):
All pitbull owners are required to have their pitbulls on a leash AND to have them muzzled when taking them out in public. Owners are also required to put warning signs outside their property to warn guests, clients, meter readers, etc., of the presence of pitbulls on the property. I believe that, since pitbulls DO present a special danger, not so much because of their temperaments, but because of their bites, that this is not so much to ask of the pitbull's owner. The owner is NOT being asked to get rid of his/her pet, but to take the responsibility that goes along with owning a pitbull
Having said all of the above, I believe that if and when the owner of a pitbull refuses to complly with this law s/he should be prepared to take the responsibility for the consequences.; If, for example, the owner of a pitbull refuses to muzzle his/her pitbull when s/he takes their dog out in public and the dog seriously injures or kills a person, or another person's pet, the pitbull's owner should be prepared to pay the doctor's and/or veterinary bills that the injured person or the owner of the injured or dead pet would ordinarily end up paying, OR, be faced with a stiff fine, and/or short imprisonment by the city if the pitbull owner doesn't complay, AND, be prepared to pay the cost of the funeral/burial/crematorial processes that would ordinarily be paid for by the injured or dead pet's owner.
All of the above having been said, I believe that the pitbull restriction is perfectly moderate and reasonable, and a way to address what is a real public safety issue without putting undue hardship on pet owners. To reiterate my position on this subject, while it's important to keep dogs on a leash when taking them out in public, and to train and control them, it's especially important that pitbulls be kept under forceful control, due to the special risks that these particular dogs present.
While there are many people who argue that it’s how they’re raised by the owners, I firmly believe that the DNA of pitbulls definitely makes them a much more prime choice for breeding for the purpose of illegal entertainment/sports such as dog-fighting. If people are the root of the problem, the root of the problem lies with the people who insist/persist on breeding, importing and selling pitbulls in the first place. This being said, I believe that animal control and law-enforcement people should work together, at the state, local and national levels to halt the breeding, import and sales of pitbulls altogether. That way, guys such as Michael Vick and others like him would never have the opportunity to get involved in the disgusting business of dog-fighting in the first place.
None of this is based on any facts, just your media obssesed opinion. Your history of the breed is dead wrong. Your generalzation of breeders is dead wrong. Your storys of pitbull attacks on people are twisted around to make your point. You forgot to add about these storys and yes I did research that the dogs were neglected, beaten with bats, never taken out for walks, and tortured. I'm sure your temperment would be a little differant if I beat you with a bat and left you locked up in a one bedroom apartment all day. All you know about this breed is from what you have heard or seen on tv and 95% of the time is it's not even a pitbull. Please stop watching the news or reading articles to get all your facts. And stop generalizing about this breed.
Because your opinion sure is strong for someone who has never owned one. I myself would find it hard to have a strong opinion on something I have never experienced for myself. It's just funny that everyone on here who dislikes pit bulls has never owned one, and the people who owne them love them on here and know the real truth about them because they have experienced a pit bull full time in their homes. So everytime I read about non pit bull owners retelling what they have so called heard about this breed I just laugh.
Hey listen, Harley_man: laugh all you want, but I have done my own research on the subject of pitbulls, and it's not through the news media, either. I 've personally talked to several pitbull owners and ex-pitbull owners who've agreed that their fighting propensity is definitely in their DNA, and that they're tougher to deal with and to train than most dogs, that they've gotten rid of them because they've proven to be too much trouble, and too much of a risk to keep dealing with, and others who've said that as soon as their present pitbull dies, that's it; they won't get anymore. So, that's fact enough, imo.
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Jesus criminy.
Kindly allow me to introduce my own SPECIAL RISK
