Unemployment rates not the same for everyone (union, free market, sell)

[gwynedd1]

Originally Posted by LeavingMA

I've also seen many people with PHD's and MBA's have to "dumb" down their resumes because no employer wants to pay them what they used to be making. Many people with a bunch of degrees also think they should be making more so they hold out for the more expensive jobs. The best part many people without PHD's and MBA's can do their job just as well and for less.

Hi LeavingMA,


Gleaned from an online university near you...

By enrolling in the MBA program online, students can continue to work their present jobs while completing their studies via the online student website. Students complete an MBA program one course at a time, on an open enrollment basis, which makes it possible to earn an MBA faster than you might think.

MBA certificates will soon be in fortune cookies. Do they still teach Gresham's Law and supply and demand in MBA schools?

[user_id]

The vast majority of workers, even low-skill workers are making more than minimum wage. Pretending that the minimum wage laws are a major source of unemployment is to ignore reality.

[jimhcom]

Originally Posted by user_id

The vast majority of workers, even low-skill workers are making more than minimum wage. Pretending that the minimum wage laws are a major source of unemployment is to ignore reality.

I doubt if you have the background to even know what reality is. Have you owned your own small business? I have. There is a reason 95% of new small businesses fail. It is because they do not make enough money to cover their expenses. And what is their largest expense? Payroll. Minimum wage laws are created by people who have no knowledge of business or economics. They are created by politicians who are pandering for votes, and supported by people who while probably meaning well, are ignorant of the ramifications of what they support. There are very few chess players anymore because no one has enough attention span to think two moves ahead. Minimum wage is counter productive because it limits entry level jobs. Many people in entry level jobs are learning and not as productive as they should be. Many make costly mistakes and require lots of supervision. Wages like everything else in the business world follows the laws of supply and demand. The more businesses that are able to survive, the more people who are employed. The more people who are employed, the smaller the supply of labor, and the more employers have to pay to get quality workers.

In a bad economy, forcing a small business owner to pay minimum wage simply makes the situation that much worse.

[Randomdude]

Originally Posted by jimhcom

I doubt if you have the background to even know what reality is. Have you owned your own small business? I have. There is a reason 95% of new small businesses fail. It is because they do not make enough money to cover their expenses. And what is their largest expense? Payroll. Minimum wage laws are created by people who have no knowledge of business or economics. They are created by politicians who are pandering for votes, and supported by people who while probably meaning well, are ignorant of the ramifications of what they support. There are very few chess players anymore because no one has enough attention span to think two moves ahead. Minimum wage is counter productive because it limits entry level jobs. Many people in entry level jobs are learning and not as productive as they should be. Many make costly mistakes and require lots of supervision. Wages like everything else in the business world follows the laws of supply and demand. The more businesses that are able to survive, the more people who are employed. The more people who are employed, the smaller the supply of labor, and the more employers have to pay to get quality workers.

In a bad economy, forcing a small business owner to pay minimum wage simply makes the situation that much worse.

Yet its amazing that there is absolutely NO historical evidence that minimum wage increases are positively correlated to increased unemployment, inflation, stagnant wages, or any significant business closure.

Guess this will remain a book bound theory of a right wing economics nut until it actually is shown to happen in real life.

[jimhcom]

Originally Posted by Randomdude

Yet its amazing that there is absolutely NO historical evidence that minimum wage increases are positively correlated to increased unemployment, inflation, stagnant wages, or any significant business closure.

Guess this will remain a book bound theory of a right wing economics nut until it actually is shown to happen in real life.

And how many businesses have your owned?

[Randomdude]

Originally Posted by jimhcom

And how many businesses have your owned?

As if that has anything to do with national statistics. Please, find me any historical evidence that there is any correlation with rises in minimum wage and any of the BS spouted by right wing nut jobs such as catastrophic unemployment, staganant wages, large numbers of businesses closing up shop, blah blah blah.

Then, after you fail to find any, I will explain to you how near perfect competition in most low wage industries ensures that raises in minimum wage act as a redistribution of wealth, rather than a bane on the economy. That is a reality.

[jimhcom]

Originally Posted by Randomdude

As if that has anything to do with national statistics. Please, find me any historical evidence that there is any correlation with rises in minimum wage and any of the BS spouted by right wing nut jobs such as catastrophic unemployment, staganant wages, large numbers of businesses closing up shop, blah blah blah.

Then, after you fail to find any, I will explain to you how near perfect competition in most low wage industries ensures that raises in minimum wage act as a redistribution of wealth, rather than a bane on the economy. That is a reality.

When you have actually run a company, you will understand the difference between your backside and a hole in the ground. Until then you are simply too ignorant to understand. If you try to understand real life thru manipulated statistics, you will remain in a confused fog your whole life. But then that is where most liberals prefer to be. Dealing with the hardcore facts of life has never been their forte.

[Philip T]

Originally Posted by jimhcom

When you have actually run a company, you will understand the difference between your backside and a hole in the ground. Until then you are simply too ignorant to understand. If you try to understand real life thru manipulated statistics, you will remain in a confused fog your whole life. But then that is where most liberals prefer to be. Dealing with the hardcore facts of life has never been their forte.

Sorry, but going liberal/conservative on this stuff just looks retarded. It is why there is a Polytick section for such retardation. Just saying. Gives a place for the morons to gather. Please do not draw them here.

But towards your topic . . . I have done various small business for years. Decades now, thinking about it. Mostly construction, engineering . . . and just added farming, of all things.

Anymore, I do the opposite. Always pay above minimum wage, even for "green" help. Presently start at $10/hr. Having been around the block a few times, I figure if they are not worth that, I do not want them. There is no bargain in "cheap," and "free" is even more expensive.

On the other hand, back in the day, I worked below minimum. My request. $2.00 /hr cash when I was 16. Minimum was $3 something, as I recall. It was a welding shop and I wanted to learn the subject matter. The owner is retired now, and said and still says I was the best help he ever had.

Mostly an attitude thing. Dunno if you buy good attitude, but if someone feels cheated as part of their wages, you are going to be buying bad attitude.

[Randomdude]

Originally Posted by jimhcom

When you have actually run a company, you will understand the difference between your backside and a hole in the ground.

When you actually obtain a bit of logical sense, you will understand the difference between your backside and a hole in the ground.

While you might be stupid enough to close up your shop rather then hand over your Cadillac money to your slaves, most business owners will simply eat in to their profits to stay open and price competitive.

Labor is a commodity like everything else in capitalism. If it goes up, profit margins absorb as much as possible before price is jacked up. The more competition in the industry, the less prices will go up, and more of the difference is eaten by the capitalist pig.

In practice, minimum wage hikes have proven to NOT lead to any positive correlation with unemployment, wage staganation, business closure, or inflation. However, they do lead to a very temporary shift in the gini index, depending on the scope of the raise. However, without consistant minimum wage hikes, the money will all filter back to the top eventually.

Originally Posted by jimhcom

Until then you are simply too ignorant to understand. If you try to understand real life thru manipulated statistics,

Yeah, thats it, the statistics are all manipulated, dispite being collected in the exact same manner uniformally. Not only that, but they've been being manipulated since theyve been being collected, regardless of government party in control. Amazing.

Hey, where do you get your tin foil hats?

Originally Posted by jimhcom

you will remain in a confused fog your whole life. But then that is where most liberals prefer to be. Dealing with the hardcore facts of life has never been their forte.

You mean facts like those portrayed by 70 years of data that counters your BS party line?

[Randomdude]

Originally Posted by Philip T

Mostly an attitude thing. Dunno if you buy good attitude, but if someone feels cheated as part of their wages, you are going to be buying bad attitude.

Part of this is how you view labor. Employers who view labor as a commodity could care less about the attitude or well being of an employee. They view them as highly replaceable and an anchor on their pocket.