U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Covid-19 Information Page
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 09-23-2011, 05:39 PM
 
Location: Near a river
16,042 posts, read 20,046,065 times
Reputation: 15719

Advertisements

Are American Infrastructure Jobs Being Shipped to China? - ABC News

Rebuilding U.S. roads and bridges...

Way to go, bringing jobs to America.. giving the work to Chinese government-owned contracting firms...and the rebuilding jobs to Chinese workers, despite U.S. law to keep this kind of work in the U.S. I guess we don't have enough welders. What's behind this? How much worse can it get?

"When we subsidize jobs in China, we're not creating any wealth in the United States," said Scott Paul, executive director for the Alliance for American Manufacturing....
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 09-23-2011, 06:06 PM
 
Location: Vallejo
16,231 posts, read 18,179,307 times
Reputation: 14483
Well, is the point of the infrastructure spending jobs or is it to build infrastructure? If the Chinese bid is $7.2 billion and the lowest American bid is $10.2 billion, was it really worth it to spend $3 billion dollars on creating those 3,000 jobs? A million dollars for each temporary job, worth it? Or would the community be better served saving that $3 billion dollars and investing it somewhere else? Maybe you could employ 3,000 people at $50,000 a year to dig a whole and fill it up again. You'd get the same multiplier effect, the same number of employed people, and it'd cost a lot less money. Maybe you could give Twitter tax breaks (estimated cost $22 million, kept 350 and expected to bring in another 2,000 jobs in San Francisco, or $9,000 a job ). Lemme think about this one. $9,000 a job or $1,000,000 a job. I'm going to go ahead and say send the bridge contract to China. More bang for the buck to be had elsewhere.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-23-2011, 06:36 PM
 
Location: Near a river
16,042 posts, read 20,046,065 times
Reputation: 15719
Quote:
Originally Posted by Malloric View Post
Well, is the point of the infrastructure spending jobs or is it to build infrastructure? If the Chinese bid is $7.2 billion and the lowest American bid is $10.2 billion, was it really worth it to spend $3 billion dollars on creating those 3,000 jobs? A million dollars for each temporary job, worth it? Or would the community be better served saving that $3 billion dollars and investing it somewhere else? Maybe you could employ 3,000 people at $50,000 a year to dig a whole and fill it up again. You'd get the same multiplier effect, the same number of employed people, and it'd cost a lot less money. Maybe you could give Twitter tax breaks (estimated cost $22 million, kept 350 and expected to bring in another 2,000 jobs in San Francisco, or $9,000 a job ). Lemme think about this one. $9,000 a job or $1,000,000 a job. I'm going to go ahead and say send the bridge contract to China. More bang for the buck to be had elsewhere.
Exactly. We've rather painted ourselves into a corner, haven't we?
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-23-2011, 06:44 PM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
7,090 posts, read 11,165,994 times
Reputation: 4118
People can't complain about every cent spent by the government, then complain when they go to the cheapest option. That's psychotic.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-23-2011, 07:01 PM
 
Location: Near a river
16,042 posts, read 20,046,065 times
Reputation: 15719
Quote:
Originally Posted by subsound View Post
People can't complain about every cent spent by the government, then complain when they go to the cheapest option. That's psychotic.
Except, um, we have a little problem with jobs...
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-23-2011, 08:52 PM
Status: "Enjoying the winter" (set 5 days ago)
 
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, originally from SF Bay Area
33,885 posts, read 61,653,883 times
Reputation: 37765
Quote:
Originally Posted by newenglandgirl View Post
Except, um, we have a little problem with jobs...
True, but the high priced union workers with benefits, OSHA safety regulations and high price of materials here compared to China makes it a no-brainer when they are broke. It's a catch-22 situation. Can't afford to hire US workers, due to no tax money coming in because the US workers have no jobs.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-23-2011, 08:58 PM
 
Location: Sinking in the Great Salt Lake
13,145 posts, read 20,358,230 times
Reputation: 14041
Quote:
Originally Posted by newenglandgirl View Post

"When we subsidize jobs in China, we're not creating any wealth in the United States," said Scott Paul, executive director for the Alliance for American Manufacturing....
We are bringing wealth to certain individuals who keep a legislator or 3 in their back pockets, though. Why we continue to let lobbyists and "party contributions" infect our government is beyond me
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-23-2011, 09:11 PM
 
5,409 posts, read 10,329,247 times
Reputation: 4478
That 30% or so difference is returned in various taxes to the .gov if all done in the US.

So by the mandate that the .gov should choose the Best Value -- NOT the Lowest Price (that is Wal-mart's claim, not the .gov), $10B spent here would be of better overall value that $7B spent in China.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-23-2011, 11:14 PM
 
Location: Vallejo
16,231 posts, read 18,179,307 times
Reputation: 14483
Quote:
Originally Posted by Philip T View Post
That 30% or so difference is returned in various taxes to the .gov if all done in the US.

So by the mandate that the .gov should choose the Best Value -- NOT the Lowest Price (that is Wal-mart's claim, not the .gov), $10B spent here would be of better overall value that $7B spent in China.
True of wages, not true of corporate spending. Not even close, especially on construction where most of the costs are materials. For example, Sterling construction had revenues of 460 million, IBT of 36 million. So 8.84% of less than 10%, or less than 1% would return to California. Plus you'd get some more in personal income taxes, sales taxes on personal income. But with each temporary job costing roughly a million, there's not much of that that's going to salaries which is typical of heavy construction jobs.

newenglandgirl, I don't see how its painted ourselves in a corner. Send the bridge contract to China and spend $40 million or so on Twitter tax breaks. You've just achieved the same job growth for a few peanuts. Plus you've still got another probably $2 billion (or whatever the savings from sending the contract to China was). I like that corner. Lots of good options.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-24-2011, 07:31 AM
 
Location: Near a river
16,042 posts, read 20,046,065 times
Reputation: 15719
Quote:
Originally Posted by Philip T View Post
That 30% or so difference is returned in various taxes to the .gov if all done in the US.

So by the mandate that the .gov should choose the Best Value -- NOT the Lowest Price (that is Wal-mart's claim, not the .gov), $10B spent here would be of better overall value that $7B spent in China.
Yes, esp when you consider the cost of the welfare and unemployment rolls, food stamps, rent assistance, etc etc for the un/underemployed.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:50 AM.

© 2005-2021, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top