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there must be something more to this story that is not being told here..based on his LinkedIn profile the guy should have no problems getting a great job Or is the economy so bad that now experienced PhD's from Ivy league colleges are not getting employed?
No. Nothing funny or strange in that. It sounds about right.
But upfront, as far as the Dartmouth part -- that seems to be some perceived value? So first let me point out that feature is worth Zero.
Probably almost the same for the PhD part in Physics. He is also correct about that scaring some lesser "bosses." So on the open market that may even be a negative. Part of why I am in no rush to finish mine.
They are also correct about the Lockheed part. Just had a project with them scheduled for this Fall. Got the note last week that it is tanked, and may come up in the Spring. Not counting on it. JUST barely snagged a replacement project with someone else last Friday -- else we were looking at down-scale Christmas.
But that is all on the MSEE part. Same as he has. He needs to hit a niche in that domain. The MSEE should and could carry him some -- if he can hit a niche.
If he had woulda/coulda/shouda do-overs it might have been to snag something Renewable Energy in the Recovery domain. I have been doing those for the last year. But now you see the example that Solyndra is crashing. Others will follow. The entire Recovery Renewable Energy projects all close up this December. Projects in progress get funded through next year, but then it is game over and look for a big crash in that game.
But I would say over-all -- look for the backside of the Great Recession Hurricane to be hitting shortly. We are only half way through this thing.
There's more to being employable than a piece of expensive paper hanging on your wall.
I had a PhD Physicist from MIT with post-grad work from CalTech that couldn't hold a job in Boulder at NCAR work for me as an auto tech.
His skills were purely based in the world of academia ... he wasn't able to bill enough hours per week in auto repair to cover his hourly wage in a 40 hour week. So he was a loser in my shop.
Thankfully, he got hired for some research cryogenic project back at CalTech after one of his grant proposal ideas got funded.
One of the worse employees I ever had was a PhD that apparently was good at college but sucked at being productive in a corporate setting. I worked pretty hard to get him out of my unit. Credentials are not all there is to hiring a good employee.
I guess the surprising part to me on the mess was/is the Ivory League/Dartmouth status -- And what that is really not worth. Or more like I guess I do not follow why that aspect would have any worth?
That is more a Business School perspective thing?
As far as SS's observation of trade skills differing from intellectual skills. That tends to be the normal condition from what I see.
side note to SS -- regarding various renewable and your local folks -- if you want any of that -- GET SIGNED UP NOW. Does not look like the Grants will go beyond the end of the year.
I guess the surprising part to me on the mess was/is the Ivory League/Dartmouth status -- And what that is really not worth. Or more like I guess I do not follow why that aspect would have any worth?
That is more a Business School perspective thing?
As far as SS's observation of trade skills differing from intellectual skills. That tends to be the normal condition from what I see.
side note to SS -- regarding various renewable and your local folks -- if you want any of that -- GET SIGNED UP NOW. Does not look like the Grants will go beyond the end of the year.
I see that your intellectual snobbery has again risen to the surface with the EE degree lighting the way to assure those that don't have a similar credential are inferior mental examples.
Nothing could be further from the truth ... the same analytical and thought process, information gathering, cognitive and critical skills required for acquiring an advanced degree are required for many trades ... especially automotive diagnostics these days where computers/electronics are the standard. The productive side of my auto shop was in the diagnostic side of the ledger, although good hand skills were essential to replacing/repairing parts.
My best guys were worth $50-75,000 per year starting back in the 1980's, and 6 figures in the 1990's ... what were you making then, o' master of the EE? I'll bet that the better part of your income and worth to your company is not your EE skills, but your management skills and sales production .... because most of the "engineering" that you do is pretty basic stuff. It's the ability to bring in revenue that enhances your worth to the company.
Similarly, those social and employee skills that you have are mirror'ed in every job situation that requires bringing in revenue for the company. Auto techs aren't an overhead expense, they must be dollar productive or they are on their way down the road ....
The best surgeons I know are guys who got their start as ME's or grew up in a family auto wrecking business compared to the ones who started their educations with a liberal arts degree.
I see that your intellectual snobbery has again risen to the surface with the EE degree lighting the way to assure those that don't have a similar credential are inferior mental examples.
Good Gordies what are you going on about?
I am saying they are different dimensions. It is normal. Not anything about better, worse, smarter, dumber, or anything else.
Pondering an equation all day may make for a great PhD thingy. However, it will get one's butt kicked in a piece rate production shop. Does that not match your experience?
Quote:
My best guys were worth $50-75,000 per year starting back in the 1980's, and 6 figures in the 1990's ... what were you making then, o' master of the EE? I'll bet that the better part of your income and worth to your company is not your EE skills, but your management skills and sales production ....
My numbers? Bounce ALL over the place. We tend to live at the low numbers and not go crazy at the high ones. Real question is will a project pay? Not so much about how much.
I am saying they are different dimensions. It is normal. Not anything about better, worse, smarter, dumber, or anything else.
Pondering an equation all day may make for a great PhD thingy. However, it will get one's butt kicked in a piece rate production shop. Does that not match your experience?
My experience is that the thought processes are identical in the etherial world of that PhD to those of a production shop. The PhD gets the luxury of pondering for a day ... or months or years ... because his pay is rarely predicated upon the type of productivity which can be measured in a shop.
Doesn't matter if it's a piece rate production shop or an hourly wage shop; the management tools to assess productivity are in place and even an hourly worker must be a net asset to the shop.
My numbers? Bounce ALL over the place. We tend to live at the low numbers and not go crazy at the high ones. Real question is will a project pay? Not so much about how much.
But as far as my worth . . . .
My real value is my charm and goodwill.
We'll infer that those qualities translate into quantifiable income production for the company ... although they do run a bit counter to your candid comments about being a EE in other C-D threads.
"Will a project pay?" issues are always about the money. It's either worth the time and investment into bringing it to fruition or it's not. Given your choice between a project that's well rewarded or using your resources to do one that yields a few dollars ... I'll bet that you place a priority upon the former.
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Or is the economy so bad that now experienced PhD's from Ivy league colleges are not getting employed?
