Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 10-28-2011, 08:25 AM
 
Location: Sierra Vista, AZ
17,531 posts, read 24,687,243 times
Reputation: 9980

Advertisements

Indeed the "Job Creators " seem to want the Government to guarantee them a profit before they are willing to risk any of the riches they have sucked out of the economy. In my eyes they deserve what is coming. As for the housing market, the taxpayers bought all of those houses when we bailed them out and again when we bailed out AIG. It should be the Taxpayers, not the banks, who hold title to millions of homes.

Tell the Eloi that the Morlocks are coming
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 10-28-2011, 08:46 AM
 
20,707 posts, read 19,349,208 times
Reputation: 8279
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boompa View Post
Indeed the "Job Creators " seem to want the Government to guarantee them a profit before they are willing to risk any of the riches they have sucked out of the economy. In my eyes they deserve what is coming. As for the housing market, the taxpayers bought all of those houses when we bailed them out and again when we bailed out AIG. It should be the Taxpayers, not the banks, who hold title to millions of homes.

Tell the Eloi that the Morlocks are coming
Why did we issue debt, give bankers the money, and still owe the bankers? Why not just buy the houses?
“But here is the point: If our nation can issue a dollar bond, it can issue a dollar bill. The element that makes the bond good makes the bill good. The difference between the bond and the bill is that the bond lets the money brokers collect twice the amount of the bond and an additional 20 per cent, whereas the currency pays nobody but those who directly contribute to Muscle Shoals in some useful way.


- Thomas Edison



Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2011, 08:49 AM
 
Location: Chicagoland
5,751 posts, read 10,372,889 times
Reputation: 7010
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwynedd1 View Post
The thing is you secured money from a bank that is created on the spot that increased the cost of the property. You paid more for it because of new money and debt. It may seem to help individually but its collective slavery.
Gwyenedd1, I understand what you're saying.... I did drink from the well of easy financing, just like many others. I, like many small business owners, have few financing options available. I am a person from humble roots, but with big ideas. I did not have a business partner, nor parents, nor friends who would personally invest in my company. My end goal has always been to create beneficial and innovative products and to be a positive influence. My goal is not to steal tons of money from tax payers to buy a fleet of Ferraris. That is not me. And I have always accepted the potential risk that I could lose everything. I have never expected a bail out from the govt. or anyone else.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2011, 08:51 AM
 
Location: Nebraska
4,530 posts, read 8,861,262 times
Reputation: 7602
[quote=jimhcom;". . . As their wealth increases, they are able to purchase political favors, to have legislation created or eliminated through lobbying"

That is the problem and it is the fault of CORRUPT politicians and bureaucrats. I have no problem with somebody making millions of dollars every year as long as they made it honestly and legally.

The CEO's of corporations that make millions of dollars while their company is going under CAN be fired if ENOUGH shareholders vote against them. The same can be done to crooked politicians.

Our biggest problem is lazy and brainwashed voters.

GL2
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2011, 08:53 AM
 
Location: Chicagoland
5,751 posts, read 10,372,889 times
Reputation: 7010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boompa View Post
Indeed the "Job Creators " seem to want the Government to guarantee them a profit before they are willing to risk any of the riches they have sucked out of the economy. In my eyes they deserve what is coming. As for the housing market, the taxpayers bought all of those houses when we bailed them out and again when we bailed out AIG. It should be the Taxpayers, not the banks, who hold title to millions of homes.

Tell the Eloi that the Morlocks are coming
Not all "job creators" want that govt. guarantee. The biggest job creator in the U.S. is small business.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2011, 08:58 AM
 
Location: Chicagoland
5,751 posts, read 10,372,889 times
Reputation: 7010
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwynedd1 View Post
Why did we issue debt, give bankers the money, and still owe the bankers? Why not just buy the houses

And when the govt. buys the houses, I'd like to bid on the the property management contract. I like shoveling snow.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2011, 09:08 AM
 
2,401 posts, read 4,682,095 times
Reputation: 2193
Tell the USA economy...
The College Bubble is coming!

Worse than the housing bubble...
Twice as scarier... and the borrowers, most do not have a job with to qualify (and may not even have the job to "pay back")... plus its a solo debt as big as a home loan (which takes1, a couple or more people's income to pay... ).

Downward spiral I tell you...

Its the people still capable of paying the tax that is paying this country's debt.

Misery looooves company, I know that as a fact.
Thus the non-tax contributors wants more blood out of the wealthy to pay for more of their debts so the "wealthy" can feel their pain, "the more fortunate should help the less fortunate" BUT the less fortunate is unwilling to help themselves for fear of losing that *free* milk the government is feeding them (all you know it is "MIC" aka our sugar daddy's / loan shark *poisons* BUT hey... its *free*)....

making the wealthy shift the labor force / employment out of this mess, even pushing their children to study abroad so their next generations can survive the mess that is to come.

And yet the "sheep" still wants the "indebted" nation (with many bankrupt states & in danger of more credit downgrade) to take on more debt... theirs (College & housing bubble)... where they will see a hike in tuition cost (since now the loan is backed by government like the housing loans that "predecessor"), = hike in the asking salary *labor cost* (so that they can payback the loan), = the hike in product prices, = lowering spending by tax payers since their taxes will now be also *hiked* to pay that debt (the government, NOT TAXPAYERS *promised*), = company profit shrinking, = shrinking wealth of money to hire = more "Job-loss" / higher unemployment = losing *income* hence losing homes & main *reasons* why most grads aren't being hired.
= *downward* spiral of that vicious cycle...

IF Mr. Obama is smart...
Instead of taking on more debt that this country should take... or promised to take on...

He should really just focused on one thing and one thing *ONLY*...

That is to generate *WEALTH* = *INCOME* for *HIS COUNTRYMAN*... not "other" countryman but "HIS" own.

When there is a strong country with wealth = wealth to feed & cloth his people = jobs to support the house payment & college debt repayment....
that is the *ONLY* way for the "upward' spiral.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2011, 09:31 AM
 
20,707 posts, read 19,349,208 times
Reputation: 8279
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoCUBS1 View Post
Gwyenedd1, I understand what you're saying.... I did drink from the well of easy financing, just like many others. I, like many small business owners, have few financing options available. I am a person from humble roots, but with big ideas. I did not have a business partner, nor parents, nor friends who would personally invest in my company. My end goal has always been to create beneficial and innovative products and to be a positive influence. My goal is not to steal tons of money from tax payers to buy a fleet of Ferraris. That is not me. And I have always accepted the potential risk that I could lose everything. I have never expected a bail out from the govt. or anyone else.
Hello GoCUBS1,

I am glad, and not surprised. You seemed like a good guy all along. Your capital improvements do have economic benefits. Its the land, air, and blue sky that is the issue.


One way it was resolved was cheap and evenly distributed land in the US where each of us canceled each other out in free rental income. Finance and consolidation are making this an issue again and creating classes as they battle against each other instead looking at the common interest. If our rental incomes cancel each other out, then the goods and services economy hums along as they once did. As of now labor, capital and even land owners are all fighting over a shrinking share.

You are certainly not the emerging member of the rentier class. Its finance. Land ownership has been co-opted by finance even as it benefits a certain few for a time. The very same thing is happening in education. Finance wins most of the economic surplus since the position everyone is fighting for will be bid up until the narrowest marginal return. As I said in another thread, they are an arms dealer in a bidding war for scarcity and monopoly power. If present trends continue, you will be forced to squeeze your tenets until there is nothing left to squeeze. Then you will be next. Even worse is a few land lords may remain and enter the lower ranks of their class as land mangers.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2011, 10:32 AM
 
Location: Sierra Vista, AZ
17,531 posts, read 24,687,243 times
Reputation: 9980
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoCUBS1 View Post
And when the govt. buys the houses, I'd like to bid on the the property management contract. I like shoveling snow.
We already bought the houses, TWICE
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2011, 03:31 PM
 
Location: Lake Arlington Heights, IL
5,479 posts, read 12,257,268 times
Reputation: 2848
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwynedd1 View Post
The highlighted portion can only be thought of as idiotic since I already explained that income is not defined by what you purchase with it. I could buy a knife to help me extort people using money earned bagging groceries. I could use extortion money for a fruit stand. See the difference?

Sweat equity cannot produce land rents because land rents are unearned income by definition. If you have no idea about economics or what all the classical economists were talking about, then why not take Mark Twain's advice and not remove all doubt that you are clueless?

Did you even understand my analogy of hand vs glove? Any income from the value of the hand is rent and any income from the value of the glove is from capital.

I put in the sweat equity to educate myself. I can hardly admire your post as anything more than a drool stain on an inherited security.
Oh pardon me oh great and mighty Oz. I should have known better than to have insulted your intelligence with my mis-guided and out of place BS. I guess my University didn't include "how to use the language of Economics to judge and insult people". Be careful not to keep your nose too high in the sky when walking- might hit a curb, fall and hurt yourself. Now back to drooling on my inherited security.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top