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Old 02-01-2012, 08:00 AM
 
Location: Brooklyn New York
16,391 posts, read 27,264,128 times
Reputation: 22733

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ringo1 View Post
This sounds like the life of a single person - not 'married with children'. Quite a different lifestyle from those raising c hildren, participating in community activities; volunteering at a school . . . .

THANK YOU !!!

I have 3 sons, and was single father at that, so yup, I was plenty busy. I am now lucky my sons are all grown now.

You can do all the hours when you are single, so I get that, but when you get married and have a family, working 70 hours a week does not, will not, cut it for the rest of the family.

might as well stay single all the time then, besides working all those hours does, and will, get tired after a while.

When you are in your 20's you have the stamina, the will, the eagerness to do all that, but when you turn 50, trust me, it ain't all that...............
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Old 02-01-2012, 08:22 AM
 
8,265 posts, read 11,219,882 times
Reputation: 4788
Quote:
Originally Posted by hnsq View Post
That means you will be a software developer your whole life. In our post-industrial information based society, the job such as a software developer is the new factory worker. You show up, do what you are told, and go home.
Not my whole life, probably 2-3 more years. If I'm content with being a software developer as a career, earn a relatively stress-free decent living, and can actually sleep in weekend mornings where is the problem? Still not sure what you believe I need to solve here.
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Old 02-01-2012, 09:09 AM
 
Location: The Wild Wild West
54 posts, read 63,767 times
Reputation: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by hnsq View Post
It is call wall street. Corporate America. You DO realize that most doctors work 60-70 weeks, apart from a very select few specialties? And I said investment bankers, not traders. You are so out of it you don't even know what an investment banker does!
http://jama.ama-assn.org/content/290/9/1173.full.pdf (page 2)
53.9 hrs/wk is the average.
Specialties with uncontrollable schedules make that very tough, though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hnsq View Post
And I said that anything above 70 hours is a rough schedule. is 80-85 hours more than 70? Good lord, reading comprehension is pretty low, isn't it? You are right, hours do NOT equal efficiency. The converse is also true. Every efficient worker does not necessarily only work 40 hours per week.
I still want to know what you call 'efficient' in this context.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hnsq View Post
I am sorry some people are so bad at managing their lives that they feel the way you do, but I have no incentive to lie to strangers. This is my life. Why is it so hard for you to believe that someone can work 60 hours/week and still have a great social life? It is as if you can't admit that I might be telling the truth because your fragile ego can't handle being wrong for once.
You may have missed my last post, so I will repost it:
"I don't consider your schedule a priori unreasonable.

Your schedule does marginalize all activities other than work by delegating them to specific times (usually night) with far less total time than is allotted to work.

Loving your job is good. But you have to love your job more than everything else in your life to an extent proportional to the amount by which other activities are marginalized.

Do you?"

Basically, I dispute that loving a job makes long hours acceptable. The marginal pleasure from that last hour worked needs to be >= the marginal pleasure from the best alternative activity.
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Old 02-01-2012, 09:28 AM
 
Location: Bothell, Washington
2,800 posts, read 5,020,298 times
Reputation: 3971
Even people with good jobs don't always work more than 40 hours a week. Most places I have worked, in IT helpdesk, most of the staff works an almost strictly 40 hour work week. A large majority of the staff in all of these places were hourly employees, and the companies would not want to pay OT, and management wanted people to keep a good work/live balance, so OT was relatively rare (unless something crazy happened like a system outage or something). My shift would end at 5:00, and if I was at my desk at 5:15 yet when the manager was leaving for the day he'd say "come on, wrap it up, it's time to go home!" That has been the case at most places I have worked- and that is how it should be. No job is worth having to work 60, 70, etc. hours as many have said they do.
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Old 02-01-2012, 10:20 AM
 
Location: 3rd Rock fts
749 posts, read 1,006,478 times
Reputation: 304
Default Tags: efficiency, time with family

I worked in a 6 man machine shop years ago & the owner's son said that I was working myself out of a job because of organized multi-tasking. I told him that I would be willing to work less hours. The next day the owner (his father) said, "We like to keep the shop open/employees working for 50-55 hrs/week."

In the aggregate, this is the mindset of WORK in America: the more cars in the parking lot & the more hours you work, is the litmus test of a humming, successful business.

This concept of having more of a social life with your co-workers than your family is not good for society! People need to realize that a company lets you pace the workload because they're getting tax breaks for BODIES &/or their parent company wants to see growth/illusion of growth--this is counter-productive & creates a gumming of the workforce.

Kudos to everybody who does work hard/efficiently for long periods of time; it can be done.
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Old 02-01-2012, 10:26 AM
 
Location: Woodinville
3,185 posts, read 4,339,424 times
Reputation: 6282
I still say the best thing a company can do for the health of its employees and overall productivity is to try to stick to right around 40 hours on the salaried positions. A healthy well-rested workforce is extremely productive. I know that if I only had to work 8-9 hours every day that I'd have no problem getting to the gym and getting a good night's sleep every night.

When people are working 50+ hours/week the following things get cut back: sleep, exercise, healthy eating/home cooking, etc. Give the employees their lives back and watch their health, productivity, and enthusiasm skyrocket. Certainly won't work for EVERYONE in the workforce, but I'm betting a good number would see significant improvements. And yes, even those among us who enjoy our jobs would see dramatic improvement.
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Old 02-01-2012, 10:29 AM
 
Location: Brooklyn New York
16,391 posts, read 27,264,128 times
Reputation: 22733
Quote:
Originally Posted by hnsq View Post
I definitely don't have kids. I am not single though.

Look - I don't know why this is so hard for you people to believe. Every single person in my office works 50-70 hours/week, and most of them have kids.

When you have kids, you leave earlier (after 40 hours), and then put in another couple hours at night after they go to sleep, or on the weekend. The life I am describing is normal for corporate/fortune 500 type jobs. No one at the type of job I have has the attitude of "I am going to show up, punch a clock, put in my time, take my paycheck and go home". That is an attitude that I see as lazy, and so do the vast majority of my coworkers, friends, family.

Maybe I just run in different circles than you guys, but trust me when I say that I am telling you the truth. People with my attitude have great lives, we are very happy. I don't know why that is so hard for people to believe.


OH YEAH, that sounds like exactly what i want to do with my life.

Hunny the kiddies are sleeping, lets go back to work.


oh yeah, I really see the fun in that...


people in my 9-5 circle with very active social lives are just as happy, slick....................


Bro, you need to stop preaching to everyone about working 70 hours a week, we get it, you love it, you can't think of anything else or better to do with your time, you are going to save corporate America. It is OK, as long as you do it, and not me.

we get it, it is ok.......
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Old 02-01-2012, 10:30 AM
 
Location: Texas
44,257 posts, read 56,964,209 times
Reputation: 73543
I don't understand.

Even in the 1970s, people like my dad would work their 40 or 50 hours a week at the office. And whatever needed to get done beyond that would be a Saturday in the office or brought home to finish.

To me a job is the job. Not how many hours you put in. That has always been my impression of how a professional works. Work till the work is done. Invested in the outcome. That is how I work. I might leave early if there is nothing to do, or I might stay hours afterwards...or I may come in on a day I was never supposed to be there to cover for someone. We make it work and keep on working.
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Old 02-01-2012, 10:35 AM
 
Location: DFW
6,874 posts, read 12,780,765 times
Reputation: 5301
Quote:
Originally Posted by ragnarkar View Post
Just some random thoughts..

If everyone only worked what they enjoyed even if a less enjoyable but higher paying job came along, we wouldn't progress as a society. What % of the population actually enjoy cleaning toilets, cleaning up nuclear waste, etc. ?

I'd personally chase quality of life.. money makes my life more enjoyable but only up to a certain point.. the enjoyability of work is almost limitless if you find the right job.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hnsq View Post
So because some people hate their jobs, you can justify not enjoying yours? Got it.

Where did I say that? My point is advocating a balanced tradeoff between liking your job, making money, and serving society. Only doing what you like or doing what makes the most money leads to a 1-dimensional life in my books..
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Old 02-01-2012, 10:37 AM
 
Location: Wherever women are
19,011 posts, read 26,973,482 times
Reputation: 11309
Quote:
Originally Posted by hnsq View Post
It is call wall street. Corporate America. You DO realize that most doctors work 60-70 weeks, apart from a very select few specialties? And I said investment bankers, not traders. You are so out of it you don't even know what an investment banker does!

Stop talking about things you obviously don't understand. Or are you just upset that some people can enjoy their job as well as have just as good of a life as you? Jealousy is an ugly thing.
I really have to spank you in my own way, but today I don't have the mood to, coz I'm celebrating.

I just placed two large trades on currency pairs, and another equity I've been bag holding for months has jumped 20%, everything is going my way and I don't have the negative energy for some fighting action.

I'll say one thing though. Look how you have dug yourself into a hole and the whole world tells you why anything more than 60 hours is mere slavery.

And dude, some of us really make six figures (double and triple of what "you" make at the moment), and guess what, it's boring. It does not add inches to the penis, coz in a world of inflated pay stubs, I always run into people who make 7 figures, and guess what their penises are longer and the best babe in the hall with the biggest of boobs goes sits on his lap.

And my whole life is littered with a professional experience right inside wall street (and I don't think anyone works more than 60, I meet millions on the train too, every day, none of these guys work more than 50, 60 is the worst case scenario, so quit making things up to prove your asinine assertions), I'm not gonna go into the details of my professional spread owing to the trolls who steal city-data info and misuse it on other "websites", but do us all a favour and get some sleep. Don't be a slave. At least play some angry birds when you take a dump. Enjoy life, working 80 hours gets you nowhere. You're just the bottom feeder who enables that 25 million dollar CEO at the top. Remember we had the bottom feeder chat when you were running your mouth once, bashing people in the unemployment board. Get some sleep. You need it.
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