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Old 06-23-2012, 08:22 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
18,207 posts, read 16,645,567 times
Reputation: 18192

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Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilVA View Post
...Pull the benefits and FORCE people to work.

This is actually what needs to be done. Force people to take jobs that are not in their fields. Force people to take pay cuts in other fields. If they refuse, then cutoff the benefits. There are numerous jobs out there. Look on-line 10,000s. Look in a newspaper 100s to 1000s.
Yes, but for many of those lower paying positions, employers would much prefer to hire an illegal over an actual legal American citizen. The illegal won't jump ship for something better, because there is nothing better, except going back home when this ship really starts sinking.
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Old 06-23-2012, 10:12 PM
 
Location: The Ranch
23,433 posts, read 26,829,814 times
Reputation: 9740
Quote:
Yes, but for many of those lower paying positions, employers would much prefer to hire an illegal over an actual legal American citizen. The illegal won't jump ship for something better, because there is nothing better, except going back home when this ship really starts sinking.
Then we need our gov't to make e-verify mandatory and not voluntary. We need to make the fines so high that employers will not even have a passing thought of hiring an illegal. There is a a Visa program for hiring migrants, yet is barely used. Why? Because the fines are based on the incidents rather than being multiplied by the amount of illegals on their worksite. The fines are all less than hiring legal employees. The fines need to be tripled and paid out to the places they would've gone if this were a legal employee instead of probably ending up as some programs slush fund. Hit the employers where it hurts. Rounding up illegals does nothing if a quick replenishment is available. If employers state they will have to raise the prices of items they sell, then fine. If they state they will go out of business if they raise their prices, then fine again. All that proves that they should not have been in that business to start with. At least people who are legally here will have jobs.
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Old 06-23-2012, 10:51 PM
 
18,094 posts, read 15,811,311 times
Reputation: 25191
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilVA View Post
...Pull the benefits and FORCE people to work.

This is actually what needs to be done. Force people to take jobs that are not in their fields. Force people to take pay cuts in other fields. If they refuse, then cutoff the benefits. There are numerous jobs out there. Look on-line 10,000s. Look in a newspaper 100s to 1000s.

Many employers will not hire overqualified people. My company does not do it, and no company I know of in my field will do it. Why would a company hire a guy they know (and is qualified) to jump ship when the first opportunity comes?
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Old 06-23-2012, 11:22 PM
 
Location: The Ranch
23,433 posts, read 26,829,814 times
Reputation: 9740
Quote:
Why would a company hire a guy they know (and is qualified) to jump ship when the first opportunity comes?
Even before the economy went into this slump, people jumped ship barely giving any notice. So there is no real comparison between now and pre-2008. The companies hire based on need. They rarely tell the employee on how long that need will be. Some hire on contract basis. On one of my 6-month contracts, I'm in year 5. They are a crappy employer but the benefits are excellent.

Quote:
Many employers will not hire overqualified people.
It depends on the need and the quality of applicants in the pool.

Quote:
My company does not do it, and no company I know of in my field will do it.
Too general of a statement. Too many variables to deal without enough informatiom.
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Old 06-23-2012, 11:45 PM
 
Location: Ohio
3,441 posts, read 5,538,613 times
Reputation: 2690
Forget stopping unemployment, lets fix the economy the same way it was in the 40's.
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Old 06-23-2012, 11:50 PM
 
Location: The Ranch
23,433 posts, read 26,829,814 times
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Quote:
lets fix the economy the same way it was in the 40's.
Another World War?
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Old 06-23-2012, 11:51 PM
 
706 posts, read 1,962,899 times
Reputation: 904
Quote:
Originally Posted by StealthRabbit View Post

When traveling internationally, I see A LOT of 'previously' unemployed people sweeping streets, pulling weeds, and mowing grass on freeways BY HAND.
What, exactly, is gained, by putting ten people to work by hand doing what can be done by one man with a machine? How would that be better than having each one run the machine for one day and take nine days off, and achieve the same result, for the same pay?

If your ONLY objective is to force people to expend their time doing some kind of work instead of leisure, then you have an excellent idea. Otherwise, your idea has little advantage.

The reason machines have, throughout history, been constantly invented and revered, is because they deliver a constant output for less work. But you want to fly in the face of it all, by proposing an ideal in which there is imaginary or superfluous output for constant work.

Constant Work just doesn't strike me as an ideal in the post-Egyptian Pyramid culture. If it is true, as you seem to imply, that Work is such a wonderful thing that it ought to be the central focus of civilization, I have no doubt that the rich and privileged will discover that wondrous principle, and keep all the work for themselves, and not let the rest of us do any.
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Old 06-24-2012, 02:35 AM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
18,207 posts, read 16,645,567 times
Reputation: 18192
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilVA View Post
Then we need our gov't to make e-verify mandatory and not voluntary. We need to make the fines so high that employers will not even have a passing thought of hiring an illegal. There is a a Visa program for hiring migrants, yet is barely used. Why? Because the fines are based on the incidents rather than being multiplied by the amount of illegals on their worksite. The fines are all less than hiring legal employees. The fines need to be tripled and paid out to the places they would've gone if this were a legal employee instead of probably ending up as some programs slush fund. Hit the employers where it hurts. Rounding up illegals does nothing if a quick replenishment is available. If employers state they will have to raise the prices of items they sell, then fine. If they state they will go out of business if they raise their prices, then fine again. All that proves that they should not have been in that business to start with. At least people who are legally here will have jobs.
The problem is some states, like mine, see value in having illegals. This is essentially a "sanctuary state". We get work done here that could be done in any state. The difference is, while COL is high, we have plenty of illegals around that can allow companies here to get the work done cheaper. This hurts other states who have tougher policies regarding illegals. Illinois loves it's illegal workforce, and they aren't ashamed of it. Corruption = money. Always has and always will. No place does corruption quite as well as this state.

And I've often described the very methods used to acquire cheap, illegal labor. Where there is a demand, there will always be those around to provide the supply of course. Temp agencies basically provide the local companies with all the illegals required. If the company get's busted, no big deal. It is the temp agencies job to check the papers. The temp agency bares the brunt, closes their doors, and reopens down the street, providing the service all over again. Very flawless and bullet proof system. No body blinks an eye.

I have seen this with my own eyes. I was appalled at first, and even felt a bit betrayed. But then I realized... Most of us Americans working for these types of companies don't much care. I work in manufacturing. There wouldn't be a manufacturing base in this state if it weren't for the illegals. I hate it. I hate the fact that in my home state of Michigan, you can never count on a manufacturing job to provide stability. I often wondered why that was so, until I came here to the Chicagoland area. Then I realized... Ultra cheap, low skill illegal labor en mass. Works out great as long as you're not fighting for a low skill job. The work will just keep flowing in. Job security will be the last of your concerns. Sucks for everyone else though.

I hate it. I hate it with a passion, and with every bone in my body. I gotta eat though. I would love nothing more than to see every last illegal rounded up, and given a good swift kick in the butt back to their own country. Improve your own damn country, quit ruining mine for all of my fellow Americans. Our politicians are cowards, crooks, and outright criminals though. It couldn't be more obvious and in your face, yet they do absolutely NOTHING. It couldn't be more obvious that they want to see this country FLOODED with illegals. They want to race this country down so hard that your kids will have no choice but to fight for illegal immigrant wages. Lets see... Dream act... Educate the illegals and they can even start attacking the wages of post secondary degree holders! Brilliant!

Did I mention, learning basic Spanish improved my marketability by leaps and bounds? It's an absolute disgrace. Pass the word. Get the people angry. Your politicians are NOT on your side. They want you on your knees. Are they going to assume the position are demand some sort of response??? Oh wait, American idol is holding their attention... Yup, we're doomed...
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Old 06-24-2012, 09:42 AM
 
Location: Ohio
3,441 posts, read 5,538,613 times
Reputation: 2690
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilVA View Post
Another World War?
Post WW2 saw the largest world wide growth in history.
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Old 06-24-2012, 07:27 PM
 
8,142 posts, read 4,623,532 times
Reputation: 7535
Because everything got blown up in much of the world.
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