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Old 08-07-2012, 07:46 AM
 
Location: San Diego California
6,797 posts, read 6,640,694 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JazzyTallGuy View Post
The economy "working on it's own" at this stage probably means a global depression circa 1929. Your stance is exactly the one Herbert Hoover took at the outset of the Great Depression. As he would later learn that's not a politically viable stance to take, not to mention the amount of economic devastation it caused. The reality is that if Europe doesn't get it's act together and put a plan together to backstop the bonds of Spain, Portugal, and Italy that's probably where we may be headed anyway.

The issue isn't avoiding recessions of the effect of the business cycle. There is NOTHING that can stop the business cycle of expansions and recessions from occurring. The real issue is how to mitigate the effect of these cycles on people's lives and the economy as whole.
For 20 million Americans out of work and countless more who have been displaced from good paying jobs and been forced to accept lower paying jobs this is 1929!
QE has done nothing to help the countless millions who have lost their homes and retirement. It has only protected profits of Wall St and the banking community.
When will you people understand it is impossible to permanently borrow prosperity? Despite the lies told in history books, the communist inspired programs instigated by Roosevelt did little or nothing to end the depression. In fact they would have caused a greater economic calamity due to the debt taken on by the government had not WWII destroyed the manufacturing base on every other industrialized country on the planet.
It was the artificial economy of the 1950's and 60's that allowed the US to recover economically from the follies of the 1920's when bankers like in the 90's and 2000's ran amok creating a debt driven economy by fiat money creation and loose credit standards.
Short of another world war, which may be on the horizon, the American economy is facing a continual downward spiral as unemployment erodes wages and the governments continue to raise taxes in an attempt to make payments on unsustainable debt.
Of course that point is mute to the wealthy who have already stolen all the money and covered their tracks with the help of a corrupt government and programs like QE.
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Old 08-07-2012, 09:04 AM
 
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flooding the system with money,low rates and giving credit only works when you have a market place that wants to borrow and spend,which we dont.
the fed is out of power as the one thing they cant create is demand.

deleveraging is where its at now with corporations and individuals cutting debt , cutting spending and selling assets to pay down debt .

corporations already have record cash levels and no place to put it, they dont need more.
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Old 08-07-2012, 03:28 PM
 
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well todays news was consumer credit growth shrunk to the lowest in 8 months.... gee what a surprise.
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Old 08-08-2012, 10:13 AM
 
Location: San Diego California
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
well todays news was consumer credit growth shrunk to the lowest in 8 months.... gee what a surprise.
A decline in the growth rate is not the same as a decline in credit. The amount of borrowing is still increasing which given the ability to repay, is not good.
People at the lower tiers of income are scrambling and borrowing just to make ends meet.
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Old 08-08-2012, 10:26 AM
 
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huh? that makes no sense. if they were still borrowing to make ends meet it wouldnt be falling off.


"WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. consumer credit posted its weakest growth in eight months in June as Americans reduced credit card debt, a potentially negative sign for an economy that has struggled to create jobs.

Consumer credit grew by $6.46 billion in June, the Federal Reserve said on Tuesday. That was well below the $11 billion advance Wall Street economists had forecast in a Reuters poll."

"
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Old 08-08-2012, 11:08 AM
 
19,346 posts, read 16,982,049 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
huh? that makes no sense. if they were still borrowing to make ends meet it wouldnt be falling off.


"WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. consumer credit posted its weakest growth in eight months in June as Americans reduced credit card debt, a potentially negative sign for an economy that has struggled to create jobs.

Consumer credit grew by $6.46 billion in June, the Federal Reserve said on Tuesday. That was well below the $11 billion advance Wall Street economists had forecast in a Reuters poll."

"
Consumer credit is only one component. 30 billion a month for the last quarter was retired in mortgage debt. That's 30 billion a month that will not circulate. If consumer credit goes negative, mortgage debt continues to be retired and these dolts in da guberment want to balance the budget, consider trade with cigarettes.

http://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/g19/Current/
http://www.federalreserve.gov/econre...nd/current.htm
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Old 08-08-2012, 11:30 AM
 
85,885 posts, read 83,358,560 times
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what did increase was auto loans and student loans but like i said consumers are borrowing less and less and according to slashes in earnings estimates spending less and less. not good

Last edited by mathjak107; 08-08-2012 at 11:44 AM..
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Old 08-09-2012, 11:05 AM
 
Location: San Diego California
6,797 posts, read 6,640,694 times
Reputation: 5180
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
huh? that makes no sense. if they were still borrowing to make ends meet it wouldnt be falling off.


"WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. consumer credit posted its weakest growth in eight months in June as Americans reduced credit card debt, a potentially negative sign for an economy that has struggled to create jobs.

Consumer credit grew by $6.46 billion in June, the Federal Reserve said on Tuesday. That was well below the $11 billion advance Wall Street economists had forecast in a Reuters poll."

"
Like I said, there is a difference in slower growth, and negitive growth.
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Old 08-09-2012, 11:38 AM
 
85,885 posts, read 83,358,560 times
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thats the point... slower growth can eventually lead to negative growth and thats what is disturbing about all this. it means even if we have a qe3 its going to be tough to grow the economy when you cant get the money to be spent .

Last edited by mathjak107; 08-09-2012 at 12:30 PM..
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Old 08-09-2012, 12:29 PM
 
Location: San Diego California
6,797 posts, read 6,640,694 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
thats the point... slowwr growth can eventually lead to negative growth and thats what is disturbing about all this.
Why is that disturbing? It is simply an adjustment to lower incomes.
People are earning less and finally coming to grips with the reality that money spent on interest; especially credit cards at 20% could better be used purchasing goods for cash.
Too much of most people’s hard earned money goes to bankers in the form of interest simply to facilitate a culture addicted to instant gratification.
Saving and paying cash is more efficient use of hard earned money than credit purchases.
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