U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Covid-19 Information Page
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 09-04-2012, 07:57 AM
 
Location: San Diego California
6,797 posts, read 6,643,799 times
Reputation: 5180

Advertisements

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...kCQzXzv3ZyOQTg

If you look about a two thirds of the way down in this link, you will see a chart that shows food stamp use in the US taking a dramatic upswing about the same time as China's admittance into the WTO.

My question is whether it is coincidence, or is there a tangible correlation between Chinese imports and US poverty?
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 09-04-2012, 08:12 AM
 
Location: The Triad (NC)
31,388 posts, read 69,894,293 times
Reputation: 37499
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimhcom View Post
My question is whether it is coincidence, or is there a tangible correlation between Chinese imports and US poverty?
The correlation is the ever expanding raw number of US population...
relative to the ever declining raw number of US jobs.

Too many people and too few jobs that need doing.
People still need to eat. Feeding them costs less than the revolution would. Maybe.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-04-2012, 08:36 AM
 
Location: San Diego California
6,797 posts, read 6,643,799 times
Reputation: 5180
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrRational View Post
The correlation is the ever expanding raw number of US population...
relative to the ever declining raw number of US jobs.

Too many people and too few jobs that need doing.
People still need to eat. Feeding them costs less than the revolution would. Maybe.
Logic would dictate that a growing population would facilitate the need for more goods and services to support that growth, the problem occurs when you outsource the jobs to provide those goods and services.
It is not that there are fewer jobs that need doing; it is that we are exporting those jobs in order to create more profit for the corporations supplying those goods.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-04-2012, 08:59 AM
 
Location: The Triad (NC)
31,388 posts, read 69,894,293 times
Reputation: 37499
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimhcom View Post
Logic would dictate that a growing population...
in the face of a declining industrial base and efficiencies
implies a basic ignorance about the value that $50 of latex can have in our lives.

The exporting of scut work, no education needed, industrial jobs happened a generation ago.
Today's problem is that we have too many people... not that we aren't making our own socks.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-04-2012, 09:16 AM
 
19,346 posts, read 16,995,582 times
Reputation: 7519
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrRational View Post
The correlation is the ever expanding raw number of US population...
relative to the ever declining raw number of US jobs.

Too many people and too few jobs that need doing.
People still need to eat. Feeding them costs less than the revolution would. Maybe.

Complete Malthusian myth. Where do you think markets come from? They come from people who demand goods and services.

Environmental externalities is where I do see a problem, but it has nothing to do with employment.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-04-2012, 03:45 PM
 
Location: San Diego California
6,797 posts, read 6,643,799 times
Reputation: 5180
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrRational View Post
in the face of a declining industrial base and efficiencies
implies a basic ignorance about the value that $50 of latex can have in our lives.

The exporting of scut work, no education needed, industrial jobs happened a generation ago.
Today's problem is that we have too many people... not that we aren't making our own socks.
Not only are we not making our own socks, but we are not making our furniture, our appliances, our TV's, our computers, our tools, or most of our autos and parts. The list goes on and on and on.
But hey, if you support a system that screws the people of America in order to keep a few elite filthy rich, then I just hope you are willing to accept the consequences. Like when some desperate person bashes in your skull for your wristwatch.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-04-2012, 03:53 PM
 
Location: The Triad (NC)
31,388 posts, read 69,894,293 times
Reputation: 37499
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimhcom View Post
Not only are we not making our own socks...
Who is making them? Do you propose to put them out of work?
Can you see what the next step is after that?

Quote:
Like when some desperate person bashes in your skull for your wristwatch.
Like who? What the US calls a poor person?
Or do you really think they'll take those jobs making socks?

Look past your own nose sometime.
TRY to see the larger picture.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-04-2012, 09:28 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
18,092 posts, read 16,568,665 times
Reputation: 18036
No is no coincidence here. More people, and more jobs going elsewhere. Fewer Americans actually needed. They still gotta eat though. A lot of our population growth has also been driven by immigration, who are keeping labor rates nice and low for the basics...
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-04-2012, 09:50 PM
 
81 posts, read 105,192 times
Reputation: 100
Yes, there is a 100% correlation there. Over hundreds of years of economic history anytime a nation runs a prolonged trade deficit, that nation ends up bankrupt. We successfuly had a trade surplus coming out of WWII that helped the nation become the preeminent power in the world. Since Japan first employed the model of trade mercantilism to develop their economy in the 1980s, we've relied on debt to maintain our economic momentum until it crashed down on us in 2008. Now, we rely on massive federal decifits and quantative easing to keep us afloat.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-04-2012, 09:56 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
18,092 posts, read 16,568,665 times
Reputation: 18036
Quote:
Originally Posted by fitz99clem View Post
Yes, there is a 100% correlation there. Over hundreds of years of economic history anytime a nation runs a prolonged trade deficit, that nation ends up bankrupt. We successfuly had a trade surplus coming out of WWII that helped the nation become the preeminent power in the world. Since Japan first employed the model of trade mercantilism to develop their economy in the 1980s, we've relied on debt to maintain our economic momentum until it crashed down on us in 2008. Now, we rely on massive federal decifits and quantative easing to keep us afloat.
The only thing we have going for us is many nations, especially China, can't afford for us to go belly up. China depends on strong consumer demand in Europe and North America to fuel it's growth. Hence, our slowdown has translated into a slowdown in China. Just wait... It's about to get interesting
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2021, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top