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Old 11-23-2012, 05:37 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
17,655 posts, read 16,206,272 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
If anything its back to bmw and nissan i go.
I like BMW, but they sure do make them difficult to work on. Excessively expensive to maintain. I can't even take Nissan seriously. Ford is not without their occasional issues, but out of the three largest American automakers, they are my favorite, and the most reliable in my opinion.
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Old 11-23-2012, 08:50 PM
 
Location: Here.
15,199 posts, read 13,821,856 times
Reputation: 17796
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandpa Pipes View Post
At least you did the right thing and looked for American made first. If we all bought American first some of the jobs might come back. I will not buy anything made in China unless there is no other choice and then only if I must have the item.
Oh, I always look for where things are made. Rarely will I find something not made in China. Even rarer are things made in the USA. Last time was when I bought car tires, I think. Of course, almost all food is made here, but everything else...good luck!

What I do try to do is at least buy products that are made by US corporations. At least some of the profit will come here. So my computer is a Hewlett-Packard, phone Motorola, camera GE, stereo GE, etc.
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Old 11-23-2012, 10:49 PM
 
18,094 posts, read 15,499,289 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Retroit View Post
What I do try to do is at least buy products that are made by US corporations. At least some of the profit will come here. So my computer is a Hewlett-Packard, phone Motorola, camera GE, stereo GE, etc.
This is baffling, why? Why do you feel some obligation to companies who show no obligation to you or any American?

For example, GE sure as heck does not feel obligated to employ an American workforce, so I wonder why you would feel obligated to purchase from them?
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Old 11-24-2012, 02:35 AM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
17,655 posts, read 16,206,272 times
Reputation: 17511
Quote:
Originally Posted by Retroit View Post
What I do try to do is at least buy products that are made by US corporations. At least some of the profit will come here. So my computer is a Hewlett-Packard, phone Motorola, camera GE, stereo GE, etc.
What do you care if a major shareholder buys another yacht? Wallstreet ain't mainstreet
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Old 11-24-2012, 03:47 AM
 
83,634 posts, read 81,199,442 times
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when i buy foreign products i do so for one reason. they represent the best value to me for my hard earned money.

each country today excells at doing things better and cheaper then everyone else. we are seeing world class products that are cheaper and better then ever before.

an 80 dollar pair of chinese shoes today from a quality company easily beats the 200 per pair i used to spend on dress shoes.

our standard of living gets better and better and the products cheaper and cheaper as others learn to do it better.

in my own company we do our castings in china and our design,engineering and assembly here in long island and ohio employing 110 people.

our products have never been a better value then the price we can offer them at today..
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Old 11-24-2012, 04:59 AM
 
83,634 posts, read 81,199,442 times
Reputation: 59603
Quote:
Originally Posted by andywire View Post
Chrysler sucks. Buy Ford
car-md ratings had ford and gm landing just above chrysler at the bottom of the heap as far as reliability. they way they collect data through scanners may not be 100% accepted or accurate but other surveys had similiar conclusions.

there are just to many issues still with gm,ford and chrysler.

i can count on one hand the number of issues my nissans and bmw's have had the last 25 years.

my daughter and son are big on infinity and toyota and have had zero issues the last decade .

most of those we know with the big 3 had far far more issues .

Last edited by mathjak107; 11-24-2012 at 05:08 AM..
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Old 11-24-2012, 10:20 AM
 
Location: Here.
15,199 posts, read 13,821,856 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boxus View Post
This is baffling, why? Why do you feel some obligation to companies who show no obligation to you or any American?

For example, GE sure as heck does not feel obligated to employ an American workforce, so I wonder why you would feel obligated to purchase from them?
Quote:
Originally Posted by andywire
What do you care if a major shareholder buys another yacht? Wallstreet ain't mainstreet
  1. If I buy from an American corporation, they pay taxes here that foreign companies don't. That helps me.
  2. Most American corporations that manufacture overseas still retain some workforce here domestically. That helps us.
  3. I own stocks of American companies, as do most Americans in their 401k's, IRAs, pensions, etc.
  4. I really can't blame US companies from manufacturing overseas. That is the only way they can compete with foreign companies who do not have to abide by our onerous regulations.
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Old 11-24-2012, 11:07 AM
 
18,094 posts, read 15,499,289 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Retroit View Post
  1. If I buy from an American corporation, they pay taxes here that foreign companies don't. That helps me.
  2. Most American corporations that manufacture overseas still retain some workforce here domestically. That helps us.
  3. I own stocks of American companies, as do most Americans in their 401k's, IRAs, pensions, etc.
  4. I really can't blame US companies from manufacturing overseas. That is the only way they can compete with foreign companies who do not have to abide by our onerous regulations.
1. American companies are holding hundreds of billion of dollars overseas to avoid taxes, and they have an army of lobbyist to influence our tax code in the US to avoid paying many taxes as well (last year GE paid zero in taxes). They are not too interested in paying taxes under the guise of some patriotic duty or anything. Foreign companies pay taxes here as well.

2. Many foreign companies employ domestic workers as well, not seeing this point.

3. Investment is totally different than purchasing, I and many people own stocks in companies they would never purchase an item from, Apple is an example. Investments and purchases are two separate entities and should be as reasons for them are distinct. I would not specifically pay more for an airline ticket just because that flight was on a Boeing though I own stock, sort of negatively impacts my goal of increasing my wealth.

4. You can blame them, they are the ones off shoring jobs. Many foreign companies operate here just fine, take the automotive industry for example. While you state you cannot blame them for manufacturing overseas, you cannot take that same logic and apply it to your purchases? As in "you cannot blame the consumer for purchasing a better value product"; is that not the same as manufacturing in a better value area?

It is your money of course, but I am still baffled by this loyalty to companies just because they are "American", yet they have zero loyalty to the US or any person in it. The free market is about choice, but in my opinion, this choice should be based upon value to foster competition, thus increasing the quality of the product. If everyone stayed loyal to Ford when it introduced the Model-T, we would still have the Model-T as Ford would never had any incentive to improve its product when competitors entered the market.
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Old 11-25-2012, 11:17 AM
 
Location: 3rd Rock fts
748 posts, read 1,001,116 times
Reputation: 304
Default I didn’t view the video

The pride of the American worker is only viable if the consumer appreciates the quality. I’m not 100% sure when the shift started, but the watered-down pride of the American worker is correlated with wage/price inflation IMHO.
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Old 11-25-2012, 01:09 PM
 
4,614 posts, read 3,685,297 times
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All the talk of American vs foreign labor usually rests upon issues such as quality, price, unions, regulations, etc, but the corporate globalist doesn't recognize America, or any other nation for that matter as a starting point for decisions made regarding location of business operations. We are in a new world now, one that levels all labor and regulatory concerns to a simple question of cost. This is the new source of profit, cost cutting, "a penny saved is a penny earned" mentality taken to an extreme. Fiduciary responsibility aside most corporate leaders feel that this obligation to cut cost is an imperative brought on by the notion that the mindless slashing of cost can be accomplished without cutting the proverbial corporate throat, but, it aint true. We can see the beginning of a large scale reversal of market demographics, no longer is the U.S. consumer able to buy at the rate that made this country the powerhouse of economics we once were.

Less working consumers in America certainly dosen't bode well for the business bottom line, less wages for those who still work means less buying, but the anti union, anti worker sentiment is alive and well in our nation. Why? Well for one we have a segment of our populace that owns and controls media, these conglomerates are themselves union haters and want their anti worker views to be disseminated throughout America, why? When labor laws come into the view of state and federal legislators the "trend" will be to disallow more power to be in the hands of workers while corporations get the upper hand in the vote on issues that are important to workers but incur cost. Again we can see the shortsighted view that dominates the business strategies in the new century, pouring money into foreign nations isn't part of the solution to American economic woes, neither is paying less wages to workers and more to investors, and the lack of environmental regulations in foreign manufacturing scenarios only means we will allow the poisoning of foreign citizens because it's a cheaper cost to business to do so.


Economics isn't about the interest of one group over another, although in practice our economy has usually been favorable to the moneyed interests to the detriment of America's working class. People are hating on unions and the environmental causes for a sundry of reasons, but, most of the vitriol is coming from those who have some skin in the game, business leaders in manufacturing, media, finance, and agriculture have feared the rise of worker power and government regulation since the early days of our republic. Of course a more scholarly approach to economic theory instantly recognizes these same workers as the much needed consumers, thus, the need for some balance is readily acknowledged. Labor history is one of the most neglected aspects of U.S. education, most of those in the working class don't know of the many milestones their class has established in a nation that once thought the buying and selling of human's was an acceptable business practice. Today we see the working class often voting against their own interest, terrified of the prospect of unemployment they side with their bosses who insist that costs must be trimmed, given that the cost of electricity, water, raw materials, shipping, etc isn't an area they have much sway over, labor is the victim when the axe does fall. This has also become the aggregate of American politics.

U.S. corporations have long been busy in the cost cutting game, ever since the fifties quality has suffered in U.S. made products. The once mighty economic machine that was Detroit auto making has been shoved offshore in the form of capital put to work in foreign plants, Mazda-Ford, Toyota-GM, Mitsubishi-Chrysler. Of course there's a lot more 'partnerships' among the global cabal that create a negative for American workers but that only adds to the dilemma for those who can't make up their mind whether this world wide spread of capital is a good thing or not. Cheaper prices and cheaper business cost, together they will be our undoing, but not everybody can see the truth of a situation that hasn't been allowed to stand on it's own and be scrutinized for it's merit, or the lack of it....
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