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Old 12-16-2012, 06:29 AM
 
22,770 posts, read 27,512,562 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by treasurekidd View Post
Don't stop looking there. What do you think is happening in Washington with our Social Security and Medicare? If politicians can raid our national pension fund, then surely it's ok for a few CEOs to do it too, right? THAT'S the one we should all be scared of. Washington makes Wall Street and Corporate America look like petty thieves.
i disagree, you're comparing apples and oranges. SS and Medicare have nothing to do with this discussion about private sector pensions.

Understand I'm not a supporter of what Congress has done with payroll taxes over the years -- however SS / Medicare can survive this "raiding" perfectly fine, because the U.S. government can print more money to support SS and Medicare. Printing money for these programs (rather than taxing) might erode the value of the dollar, but the difference is major: the programs aren't going to run out of money.

Hostess cannot print more money, so it really is a completely different ballgame when CEO's squander their employees' and retirees' pensions. I agree with others who say that this is a severely flawed system; I would also reject a deferred corporate pension as a valid form of compensation, today, although it is a moot point because they've basically been phased out.

Last edited by le roi; 12-16-2012 at 06:43 AM..
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Old 12-16-2012, 06:31 AM
 
4,130 posts, read 4,042,927 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marilyn220 View Post
And these same employees will be called moochers, slouches and leeches when they're forced to apply for food stamps, welfare and medicaid/medicare when they're unemployment benefits run out.

Who would have believed that a company like Hostess would stoop so low to steal funds? Even I would have trusted that my money would be okay.

From here on out, I will never, ever participate in a company's pension fund no matter how old school established they are. I don't care if it's Microsoft, AT&T, Toyota, etc.
Exactly, it is terrible how people blame the victims after instances like this.

I think giving employers the ability to divert funds like this is a gross injustice to workers. Companies across the board have legally raided pension funds and then blame the worker for their immorality. Ellen Schultz wrote a wonderful book called The Retirement Heist detailing company after company that did the same thing and got away with it. We are allowing people to line their own pockets as the elderly are left to die.
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Old 12-16-2012, 07:07 AM
 
24,497 posts, read 37,115,655 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EmeraldCityWanderer View Post
Exactly, it is terrible how people blame the victims after instances like this.

I think giving employers the ability to divert funds like this is a gross injustice to workers. Companies across the board have legally raided pension funds and then blame the worker for their immorality. Ellen Schultz wrote a wonderful book called The Retirement Heist detailing company after company that did the same thing and got away with it. We are allowing people to line their own pockets as the elderly are left to die.
This is completely false.
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Old 12-16-2012, 07:14 AM
 
Location: Sierra Vista, AZ
16,496 posts, read 21,806,038 times
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Single Payer Health Insurance and Government Pensions will take the employer out of the mix. It's obvious you can't allow those parasites to continue bleeding us dry
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Old 12-16-2012, 07:45 AM
 
7,029 posts, read 4,235,013 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by le roi View Post
Understand I'm not a supporter of what Congress has done with payroll taxes over the years -- however SS / Medicare can survive this "raiding" perfectly fine, because the U.S. government can print more money to support SS and Medicare. Printing money for these programs (rather than taxing) might erode the value of the dollar, but the difference is major: the programs aren't going to run out of money.
They cannot print more money to support SS, only to pay back what they took out of it.

Quote:
Unlike most federal programs, Social Security cannot borrow money, it cannot go into debt and, by law, the program can pay benefits only if it has the necessary funds to meet obligations.
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Old 12-16-2012, 08:08 AM
 
882 posts, read 1,855,025 times
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Originally Posted by NJBest View Post
This is completely false.
This. The entire tale of "raided pensions" is a garbage tale told to inflame the witless...
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Old 12-16-2012, 08:09 AM
 
22,770 posts, read 27,512,562 times
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Originally Posted by LordSquidworth View Post
They cannot print more money to support SS
congress can print money and make papier maché out of it if they want.

and yes , it will be support, even if they paid back everything into the program that was ever taken.
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Old 12-16-2012, 08:21 AM
 
Location: Connecticut
1,144 posts, read 1,910,830 times
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Default I agree

Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
which is why every politician should automatically serve 2 terms.

one in office and one in prison.

Sad but true - Ethics in all facets of life has been thrown out the window. I don't have to worry about a pension I never worked anywhere I would have one. The companies I worked for had 401ks or 403bs thank goodness. I used to donate to some charities which I have stopped except for 2 animal rescues that are private and no kill rescues.
I remember a time when your word meant something, I think its horrible what has become of this country. Executives making billions - how many billions does one need to live on annually. Bankers
getting million dollar bonuses after the bailout when they put this country into bankruptcy. Just freakin amazing.
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Old 12-16-2012, 08:24 AM
 
Location: Colorado
1,969 posts, read 2,091,215 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EmeraldCityWanderer View Post

Hostess CEOS Take Pensions from Employees - YouTube

These are funds employees paid from their paycheck in order to contribute to their pensions, and the management that ran Hostess into bankruptcy confiscated it in order to run company operations. This violates their contract and the law. However, so far there are currently no plans to charge them with any crime. If there is not enough money in the company assets to put this money back the employees get nothing. The executives were paid bonuses after destroying the company and committing illegal actions.

It astonishes me that people wonder why corporate greed is hated in America. Tens of thousands of people are being robbed to line their pockets out of pure greed.
An example which perfectly encapsulates American corporate management.
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Old 12-16-2012, 08:28 AM
 
4,130 posts, read 4,042,927 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJBest View Post
This is completely false.
The book details it very well: How Employers Raid Pension Plans - WSJ.com

Including interviews with the author: The theft of the American pension - Salon.com

It's not news, you can find reports run since 1991: When you retire, will there be a pension waiting?

If you wish to call me a lair then you better be able to back that claim up.
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