Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Apparently Berranke thinks we are still in danger of we woud be seeing at least a slow rise in rates. We are not and saw a peek at how markets wil react to just a rumor just a week ago.
I am amazed how many comments seem to support the endless money printing and unpayable debt. You do realize that the only reason for suppressing interest rates is to allow government debt to grow exponentially? The debt will technically default when taxes no longer meet interest payments. Desperate investors flock to the risky stock and commodity markets in search of returns. Now we have record gas prices strangling the economy and stagnant incomes due to globalization. Where is this economic reCOVERy people speak about? Seems like a COVER up to me.
I'm sure folks like you will rationalize the outcome either way so it will all come out in the wash anyway.
No need to rationalize outcomes. We all saw where we were 5 years ago. And we now see where we are today. None of us know where we will be in another 5 years. Anyone who pretends to know the outcome in advance is fooling themselves and likely making poor choices as a consequence!
I am amazed how many comments seem to support the endless money printing and unpayable debt. You do realize that the only reason for suppressing interest rates is to allow government debt to grow exponentially? The debt will technically default when taxes no longer meet interest payments. Desperate investors flock to the risky stock and commodity markets in search of returns. Now we have record gas prices strangling the economy and stagnant incomes due to globalization. Where is this economic reCOVERy people speak about? Seems like a COVER up to me.
I am amazed how many comments seem to support the endless money printing and unpayable debt. You do realize that the only reason for suppressing interest rates is to allow government debt to grow exponentially? The debt will technically default when taxes no longer meet interest payments. Desperate investors flock to the risky stock and commodity markets in search of returns. Now we have record gas prices strangling the economy and stagnant incomes due to globalization. Where is this economic reCOVERy people speak about? Seems like a COVER up to me.
You know there is actually quite a bit of ground between the two extremes. Some people accept that desperate times call for desperate measures. The gradual recovery and eventual unwinding are not a desirable situation, but most believe it is better than the alternatives. That is hardly a blanket endorsement of "endless money printing and unpayable debt". Many shades of grey, not just black and white. If you cannot see signs of improvement in the last 4-5 years you are not paying attention. Same with understanding the challenges we still face.
Desperate investors have done the exact opposite of flocking to the stock market, they have pulled $550 Billion from equities since 2007. Folks who hung in there, rebalanced and rode it out are doing very well right now.
I'd address your question "Where is this economic reCOVERy people speak about?", but I think you have your mind made up.
I can't help but chuckle every time I read something that refers to Ben Bernanke as someone who really has the economic ship in firm control. Truth be told, the captains on Wall Street are giving Ben the orders, all that which encompasses the transference of our governments collective wealth to those in the private sector, Banks, investment houses, insurance industry biggies, and a host of other hangers on with sufficient political clout to get on that dole are all beneficiaries of Ben's work.
The incessant talk of a "recovery" is the result of a huge dose of media-speak that insists we would WANT to recover to past levels of over the top indulgence in unsustainable growth through the magic of an irresponsible credit/debt orgy. From the days that marked the end of world war two the United States financial markets were shored up by this construct of central bank policy regarding debt. Prudent banking practices were seen as outdated, laws to provide restraint were established and then disestablished, the party was on and it was considered to be the best thing since sliced bread.
Keynes's notions aside we all knew the risks were there when government became "partners" with those on the investment banking side of the equation. Central bank theories were supposed to kick in at some point and offer a level of restraint that allowed a balance between too much and too little. Now we see the end result being an economy that is rapidly becoming another two tier affair with those in the upper reaches doing fine and those on the low end suffering. America had a pretty good run through those years of our miraculous rising economy, but, like most of those nations that have taken this path, we see the problems of unmitigated greed coupled with a corrupt political system creating a pile of discontent. Sooner or later we'll see that this isn't about the health of markets, it's about the imbalance between market performance and the day to day reality of the middle and working classes......
No need to rationalize outcomes. We all saw where we were 5 years ago. And we now see where we are today. None of us know where we will be in another 5 years. Anyone who pretends to know the outcome in advance is fooling themselves and likely making poor choices as a consequence!
I am amazed how many comments seem to support the endless money printing and unpayable debt. You do realize that the only reason for suppressing interest rates is to allow government debt to grow exponentially? The debt will technically default when taxes no longer meet interest payments. Desperate investors flock to the risky stock and commodity markets in search of returns. Now we have record gas prices strangling the economy and stagnant incomes due to globalization. Where is this economic reCOVERy people speak about? Seems like a COVER up to me.
LOL once again, we have a honeypot here for conspiracies. I almost spit out my drink reading the bolded print. It's like you think our leaders want to run the country into the ground. How does that benefit them again? What's next - are they really terrorist infidels?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jertheber
I can't help but chuckle every time I read something that refers to Ben Bernanke as someone who really has the economic ship in firm control. Truth be told, the captains on Wall Street are giving Ben the orders, all that which encompasses the transference of our governments collective wealth to those in the private sector, Banks, investment houses, insurance industry biggies, and a host of other hangers on with sufficient political clout to get on that dole are all beneficiaries of Ben's work. [...]
You too. I think we need a conspiracy forum, because it never stops.
Wall Street doesn't give Ben any orders - in fact, they almost fear him ("Don't fight the Fed" is a common 'Street maxim). Institutions are hurt by low interest rates, not helped. If your cute little myth was true, Wall Street would be ordering him for higher interest rates.
Oh well. I guess you guys can take solace in the fact there's NOT a conspiracy to ruin the world economy.
LOL once again, we have a honeypot here for conspiracies. I almost spit out my drink reading the bolded print. It's like you think our leaders want to run the country into the ground. How does that benefit them again? What's next - are they really terrorist infidels?
You too. I think we need a conspiracy forum, because it never stops.
Wall Street doesn't give Ben any orders - in fact, they almost fear him ("Don't fight the Fed" is a common 'Street maxim). Institutions are hurt by low interest rates, not helped. If your cute little myth was true, Wall Street would be ordering him for higher interest rates.
Oh well. I guess you guys can take solace in the fact there's NOT a conspiracy to ruin the world economy.
I hope you weren't thinking that Ben has an actual audience with those guys who really run America, he doesn't need to, it's all in the way things work on any given day in America. The entire notion of a democracy needing a "central" private bank should be your first clue as to the outright control of our economy and who does that controlling. Yes, it's absolutely true that Bernanke is simply a shill for those whose that are never elected, who are never newcomers on the scene, and who seldom are in the news or interviewed by the likes of Charlie Rose. How does serving the interest of one class over the other benefit the political leadership? Political leaders around the world have been "running their countries into the ground" for centuries, the Russian aristocracy lived very well while millions starved, Chinese upper class folks have enjoyed their perks while their people starved, the early day colonial planter class that eventually ended up running the American government did so while disallowing those on the low end the right to vote, they also openly advocated for human slavery. The upper class IS the class that gets the representation from corrupt governments, read some history, it's always instructional.
A conspiracy is usually defined as something of a secretive plot, there is NO SECRET CONSPIRACY in this relationship between those who command capital and those in government who are supposedly governing in the name of the people. Everything they do is right there for us to see, IF we're not busy watching Dancing With the Stars. Do you not read those weighty journals of our lofty private institutions that actually create policy for OUR government? Haven't heard of the WTO? How about "Foreign Affairs", that rag produced by the Council on Foreign Relations? Who are these people who sit in on our government's high level policy discussions in order to "lend a hand"? Well, "they" happen to be the top public people in banking, manufacturing, technical enterprise, insurance, etc, and they are working for others, they are not the end of a long chain of controlling capital that runs around the world, "they" are simply functionaries. Is there a real Doctor Evil in all of this? No there isn't, but there IS plenty of players who have a disproportionate amount of power because of their wealth, and these folks have nothing to fear from the likes of Ben Bernanke.
Higher interest rates? The power players are trying in vain to stave off the inevitable international regurgitation of all that heavy bad debt they created that now is weighing down most of the developed nations on the planet. When I say "Wall Street", I don't mean those who are functionaries there, I'm defining Wall Street as being those who control it. Anyone who thinks the ostensible media supplied picture of today's "markets" or "government" is the real deal needs to do some research into the matter. Our government is sworn by the democratic tenets spelled out in the documents that caused this government to have life in the first place, it's job is to govern in the name of the citizenry not SOME of the citizenry.
I'd say it's a fair statement to say that our government and the banks aren't the least bit interested in doing anything for those whose lives have been ruined by their actions, neither party has anything of substance to offer those suffering on the low rungs of the economic ladder. And THAT should be evidence enough to answer the question of who rules America...
So, you are claiming on average we are worse off today than five years ago (employment, housing, credit, equity markets...) ? Or that you have a crystal ball and can foresee the future? Feel free to make your case, if you are capable. So far all I've seen from you are drive-by quips. Where's the beef, Clara?
Last edited by shaker281; 03-15-2013 at 12:36 AM..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
