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Really interesting thread. I grew up in areas (Chicago's Cook and Lake counties) that have some of the wealthiest and poorest classes of people in the U.S., as well as some of the most blatant corruption. I grew up with a poor single mother in a crime-ridden, poor/working class area, moved into a middle class area, and, due to my business success, eventually into an upper class area - one of the wealthiest in the U.S. It's been interesting to see the difference in mindsets as previous posters have mentioned.
One of my first impressions of my town was that everyone was so good-looking, and fit, and talented, and well-dressed, and well-connected, and happy. Since then, I've learned that some of it is keeping up with appearances as a lot goes on behind closed doors, and you have to watch your back wherever you go. I could write a book on the crimes of some of the people I know - people you've seen on the news. I have lived the life of all 3 social classes and it has been an interesting ride.
Everyone has their own history and view of the world but in my case little or none of the points made by the OP apply. From very modest beginnings (no resources, education, guidance, or breaks) I went from minimum wage and school at night to my own business and later retired as a corporate middle manager. I consider myself middle class but the OP description of working class traits do not fit for me or most of my associates.
Working class, middle class America is a very broad category and does not easily fit into a one description.
Some of us poor working class saps find out that they are welcome at the colleges around the nation. Some of them even go on to earn one of those fancy degrees that those colleges offer. A few of them continue on to complete graduate degrees. Some of those people may even leave the working class world for good. Who knows. I could be one of those people who did just that.
Hmm... Well, I will proudly define myself as blue collar "working class". I guess I buck the trend though. I started investing in my teens and have an adequately funded 401K for a 20-something. I love imported beer, particularly Warsteiner, Okocim, Murphy's stout... I love my job and find it interesting to no end. I love the smell of cutting oil and freshly sharpened tools have a certain romantic appeal. It also pays a pretty middle class income as well. At the end of the day though, I realize I am no better than anyone else.
The problem in America is, the primary focus for many has been to continuously "one-up" their fellow citizen. Why do you think houses continuously got bigger even though our paychecks stagnated? The folly of our society is our collective ego. It really got out of hand, especially when Americans themselves thought themselves and our country superior to every other. That bred complacency instead of competitive drive. Now our kids suck at math, everyone is overweight, and much of the globe has achieved a competitive edge. So while everyone was busy remodeling their houses and trying to emulate a middle class lifestyle, it has continued to shrink, while growing in many other nations. Prosperity must be earned, no way around that, even if you're an American.
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Originally Posted by SOON2BNSURPRISE
Some of us poor working class saps find out that they are welcome at the colleges around the nation. Some of them even go on to earn one of those fancy degrees that those colleges offer. A few of them continue on to complete graduate degrees. Some of those people may even leave the working class world for good. Who knows. I could be one of those people who did just that.
And some of those working class folk also earn good incomes. Some of them master complex and in demand skillsets that can earn good money. Some of them decide to start their own businesses, and can afford to live in the more affluent neighborhoods. Some of them even buy the biggest house on the block. You can go to college and buy your ticket. Nothing wrong with that at all. There are other ways to achieve success and climb the social ladder in America though. I believe that's one of the features that makes this country so great.
Everyone has their own history and view of the world but in my case little or none of the points made by the OP apply. From very modest beginnings (no resources, education, guidance, or breaks) I went from minimum wage and school at night to my own business and later retired as a corporate middle manager. I consider myself middle class but the OP description of working class traits do not fit for me or most of my associates.
Working class, middle class America is a very broad category and does not easily fit into a one description.
Agreed. Aside from the visuals, I was raised in a virtual insane asylum and went on my adventure of rags to riches to rags,... repeat ad nauseam. My bio is replete with all the crazy, creepy, weirdos to make it interesting. I've settled for the luxury of indoor plumbing & electricity, and if its not too much to ask, I'll keep my fingers crossed that the crack-house and tweekers stay at least a couple blocks away. Meanwhile, the million dollar homes are up on the hill. I make a trip up there twice a year to see the view and that half of them are for sale.
I moved from a upper-middle class neighborhood to a poorer rural community for my job and noticed that many problems are someone else's fault. Growing up in my nicer neighborhood, when a kid failed a class, was overweight, did poorly at sports, etc, the parents taught him how to improve for next time. Down here in the same situation the blame is on the teacher, the doctor, the other team, etc. This isn't something a few people have shown me - it's a nearly universal aspect of this town.
I don't have quantifiable data, but in my experience, upper-middle class people tend to have a more positive attitude about life in general.
For the record my dad never had a college degree but managed a division in a medium-sized company, my mom was a part-time nurse, and education and lifelong learning was pressed hard upon my sister and I.
The obvious is being stated here, of course the upper class has a lot going for them and that drives a more positive attitude. Blaming someone else for ones problems isn't a mark of the poor as much as it is a mark of those who can't seem to get it together, period. America's rural poor aren't the same poor as those in the cities, they are for the most part the working poor, and seldom take a handout without some accompanying social pain. Rural poor means that you are those people who get pushed aside by the local uppers AND the authoritative types from government. Yes, they do feel as though they get the short shrift from those who are supposed to be helping them, and in fact they usually are. Many upper class kids are failing to connect the dots because their parents are there to prop them up at every turn, but, of course they "do better" in life because of this constant attention they receive...
Interesting responses. Of course, I wouldn't imagine my experience to be universal, even among other people from a similar background.
And it's funny to observe how coming from a working class (or poor) background sometimes makes a person resigned to their lot and passive, maybe a bit envious of the people "above" them, whereas in other types it spurs them to action, and pushes them to be more ambitious and successful.
The obvious is being stated here, of course the upper class has a lot going for them and that drives a more positive attitude. Blaming someone else for ones problems isn't a mark of the poor as much as it is a mark of those who can't seem to get it together, period. America's rural poor aren't the same poor as those in the cities, they are for the most part the working poor, and seldom take a handout without some accompanying social pain. Rural poor means that you are those people who get pushed aside by the local uppers AND the authoritative types from government. Yes, they do feel as though they get the short shrift from those who are supposed to be helping them, and in fact they usually are. Many upper class kids are failing to connect the dots because their parents are there to prop them up at every turn, but, of course they "do better" in life because of this constant attention they receive...
I actually agree with all of your post.... The last sentence is what I often think about - how to best raise kids who are in an upper class system that props them up with the best educational/support systems, while also instilling the hardwork ethic, accountability, drive to succeed, and fire that is often developed in a working class/middle class environment, like where I grew up.
Social status in America, as in every society, is complex... it doesn't necessarily strongly correlate with money, let alone with possessions. However, it is precisely the accumulation of "stuff" that many people in the lower and middle classes regard as the path to upward mobility. This is a major contributor to why our middle class feels so strained and is so indebted.
Consider, for example, how odd it would be to regard having read Aristotle in the original Greek as being a mark of class; or to achieve a master-rating in chess; or to be able to pinpoint the national origin of the orchestra (and maybe even the conductor) from listening to a recording of a Brahms symphony. Such things, in the popular imagination, are regarded as recondite fripperies, the silly stuff of nerdy idleness.
Imagine a dinner-party held somewhere in America, where perhaps the food isn't particularly delectable and the diners serve themselves, but where the conversation seamlessly shifts from English to German to French. Would this be an "upper class" gathering, or a bunch of vain academics flaunting their useless sophistication? I assert that one's reaction to such a scene is itself a marker of class. Would one judge the quality of the gathering on whether or not servants are present? Then one is probably middle-class. What if the criterion is the quality of the beer? Probably lower middle class. And if by the quantity of beer? Certainly lower-class.
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