Can The US still be an Economic SuperPower (tier, creditor, buy)

[randian]

Originally Posted by crystalblue

so, our trade deficit with the world doesnt matter?

we know import a TRILLION dollars more than we export per yr.

No, it doesn't matter. It's utterly irrelevant.

The total unimportance of the trade deficit

[Philip T]

Originally Posted by randian

We're the wealthiest country on Earth. Why shouldn't we be buying stuff? Your negative judgments smack of envy, not sound policy.

geeeezzzz. Try "Largest Debtor Country on Earth."

But while we are doing call-outs -- your judgments smack of some goofy Sophomore Econ class. Is that about right?

Reality will have a date with you later in life.

[randian]

Originally Posted by Philip T

geeeezzzz. Try "Largest Debtor Country on Earth."

Americans have both the highest incomes and highest net worth of any country on Earth. Why should I care if they also (assuming the truth of your statement) have the highest per-capita debt?

Originally Posted by Philip T

But while we are doing call-outs -- your judgments smack of some goofy Sophomore Econ class. Is that about right?

Sophomore Econ? Try "hates meaningless assumptive phrases". You trot out "rampant consumerism" as if it were self-evidently meaningful. I don't accept such lax thinking from adults. If you want to make the case that Americans should voluntarily impoverish themselves you'll have to use more than 2 words.

Originally Posted by Philip T

Reality will have a date with you later in life.

During my lifetime, not once have predictions by the "reality based community" about our inevitable economic doom come to pass. I won't be holding my breath for yours.

[GregW]

randian - you will only have to hold your breath a couple of more years. We are as a nation like a family where the father died without insurance and the mother cannot work, that is living on credit cards paid off with new credit cards. The creditors will eventually confiscate the assets. They are already doing it to the US.

[Lethal_Poison]

Originally Posted by randian

1) Manufacturing is no more important than buggy whips. Move on. Change or die.
2) The US never stopped being an economic superpower
3) Most manufacturing is low value added. Design is where real value is created.
4) What manufacturing that remains is setting record highs in revenue, profits, and wages.
5) In policy terms, loss of manufacturing jobs is irrelevant and unimportant.

Except if for some reason the US loses all of its sources of manufacturing.....what would we do then?

[tallrick]

The deficit is a symptom of energy dependance. How much longer will the rest of the world work to give the United States the benefit of cheap credit? We did not become #1 by borrowing money from the world, we did it through farming, manufacturing, mining and chemical production. Our oil powered the world and our machinery built it and destroyed it in wars. We were the country that produced 50% of the goods. We are now living on the accomplishments of our forefathers. Our Government has become socialist/fascist and our innovation has been decreasing year by year. The only industries we still lead are in entertainment and other select niches. Technology is becomming more global and we are losing our edge there as well. Unless things change, and soon we will be in deep trouble. And what happens when other countries stop accepting dollars? We get hyperinflation and hungry Americans revolt. No wonder the Government has changed laws to deny our freedoms. They know that things are going to get worse.

[crystalblue]

i just dont see how the US can stay on top when most of what we do can be done somewhere else, and much cheaper.

seems like most companies are more interested in lowest cost than keeping americans wealthy.

[randian]

Originally Posted by crystalblue

i just dont see how the US can stay on top when most of what we do can be done somewhere else, and much cheaper.

seems like most companies are more interested in lowest cost than keeping americans wealthy.

How? Comparative Advantage.

You have it backwards. Low cost makes us wealthier. More of us can thus afford to be Early Adopters, bringing higher-cost goods earlier than ever to mass production, economies of scale, and lower cost, further increasing our wealth and economic output. This virtuous cycle is repeated, forever and ever.

[crystalblue]

Originally Posted by randian

How? Comparative Advantage.

You have it backwards. Low cost makes us wealthier. More of us can thus afford to be Early Adopters, bringing higher-cost goods earlier than ever to mass production, economies of scale, and lower cost, further increasing our wealth and economic output. This virtuous cycle is repeated, forever and ever.

your assuming that we still have high paying jobs here. for upper management, yes, thats prob the case

for the lower levels, thats not as true.

[randian]

Originally Posted by tallrick

The deficit is a symptom of energy dependance.

Which deficit? The trade deficit? As I said, it's irrelevant. Why should we impoverish ourselves by refusing to buy energy from others?

Originally Posted by tallrick

How much longer will the rest of the world work to give the United States the benefit of cheap credit?

As long as we can pay. If I owe you five hundred dollars, I have a problem. If I owe you 500 billion dollars, you have a problem.

Originally Posted by tallrick

We did not become #1 by borrowing money from the world, we did it through farming, manufacturing, mining and chemical production.

That's the past. We have grown beyond that and become wealthier by doing so. Living in the past guarantees poverty.

Originally Posted by tallrick

We are now living on the accomplishments of our forefathers. Our Government has become socialist/fascist and our innovation has been decreasing year by year.

We can't both be abandoning the industries of our forefathers and living on their accomplishments. Yes our government is becoming more socialist. Vote for people who won't do that.

Originally Posted by tallrick

The only industries we still lead are in entertainment and other select niches. Technology is becoming more global and we are losing our edge there as well. Unless things change, and soon we will be in deep trouble. And what happens when other countries stop accepting dollars? We get hyperinflation and hungry Americans revolt.

Why would they stop accepting dollars? Who has a better currency?