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Having such a large number of young people in so much debt is a huge drag on the economy in general. People with a bunch of student loan debt are less likely to buy houses (and when they do it's at a later age), less likely to buy cars, more likely to live at home, less likely to get married or settle down, less likely to make any big purchases, more likely to have messed up credit, etc.
Certainly not everyone can be an engineer, but I assure you engineering classes will prevent the hacks from making the degrees a dime a dozen. Hard sciences are not just about putting in the time. But people with the aptitude would do well to pursue such fields as that's where a good portion of the college to career jobs are.
As far as sending the other 20 million odd children to college, is it really wise to sell college as the end all be all of education. At 20 I made more than 90% of Americans, having never stepped foot into a college. Not saying college is bad, or that liberal arts degrees are bad, but let's use that critical thinking thing you were talking about and apply it to student loans. If you don't have a clear cut way of paying for the degree, maybe you should find an education that will pay for the degree. It's great that you earn so much, but that's not the norm for someone with a liberal arts undergrad degree, heck that's not the norm for some doctors depending on where you draw the 95% line.
I don't understand the need for the personal attacks, but I guess that's how you Internet 5%ers roll.
BTW when did Duke and Stanford become Ivy League?
You keep setting up straw man arguments. No one is saying engineering courses are a bad thing. Why do you think you need to use that as some sort of response to me? There are only so many jobs in hard sciences, period! The world needs artists, psychologists, music teachers, etc. Your derision of those who choose a different path is what leads to the sarcasm, you deem as "personal attacks"
"Find an education that will pay for the degree"? As I have shown from the link you have posted, those are generally small lioberal arts colleges or targeted to the very gifted. How is getting a degree in bible studies or music at an institution that is willing to pay (if you are gifted) any kind of solution for the other 21 million? You also, overlook the fact that not everyone is suited for a life of doing math in a cubicle or writing computer code. Some people would rather put a gun to their head.
Of course, everyone doesn't need to go to college. But, that is another straw man as it has nothing to do with whether or not everyone who desires further education (for themselves or their children) can get it without going into debt. People desire that their children have advantages when going out into the world and not knowing what else to do, they choose college. They haven't got the means to pay up front, and as we have now determined, not everyone is going to get a free ride. Even the brightest. The very idea is absurd! Posting up a list of tiny liberal arts, Ivy League and private institutions is only evidence that the gifted and elite have a serious advantage over others. Your experience notwithstanding, it is not the norm! At age 20 I made more than most Americans too and had never set foot in college either. Which is also irrelevant, as I chose to go to college later for many reasons. I assure you, lack of college is most certainly a barrier for most! Especially, those who are not privileged or gifted.
The federal and state governments have cut off the flow of money for education drastically over the past 10 years. No one is arguing that taking on debt with no long term plan to leverage that into an income stream is a solid plan. But, people are scared and desperate and want the best for their children. Saying that if they were bright, they wouldn't have to pay sounds pretty darn condescending and is entirely off the mark! And really not helpful in any way. And it is insulting to anyone who has to pay (via debt or otherwise) in hope of a better life. Can you understand that? Or are you going to float more arguments about things I am not even saying?
I will, however, apologize for being sarcastic, as it was frustration with your many straw man arguments that resulted in my being unnecessarily insulting. I will give you that point.
I think the fundamental nature of student loans nowadays is outright immoral. What sort of people seek to saddle their own children with usurious debt right as they are starting out in life? That makes little economic sense - as we are increasingly seeing - and it just strikes me as a cheap and hucksterish thing for us to do. It's like we're so desperate for every possible bit of money that we're willing to mortgage the future of our children to squeeze out a few more bucks.
And the benefits accrue to a handful of university administrators, for the most part.
I certainly think the federal government should be able to "claw back" its money from them, and from university endowments if their graduates aren't finding work capable of repaying the debt on schedule, and end up on programs such as PAYE or IBR.
I think the fundamental nature of student loans nowadays is outright immoral. What sort of people seek to saddle their own children with usurious debt right as they are starting out in life? That makes little economic sense - as we are increasingly seeing - and it just strikes me as a cheap and hucksterish thing for us to do. It's like we're so desperate for every possible bit of money that we're willing to mortgage the future of our children to squeeze out a few more bucks.
I agree. For a country supposedly founded (as some claim) on Judeo-Christian and "family values", it seems like a very un-Christian system. Almost Satanic really...akin to "child sacrifice", at least in the financial sense.
Other countries look at how we run higher education and have a good laugh.
I think the fundamental nature of student loans nowadays is outright immoral. What sort of people seek to saddle their own children with usurious debt right as they are starting out in life? That makes little economic sense - as we are increasingly seeing - and it just strikes me as a cheap and hucksterish thing for us to do. It's like we're so desperate for every possible bit of money that we're willing to mortgage the future of our children to squeeze out a few more bucks.
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I must say I agree with this. Anyone who does not start a college fund when their children are born is basically throwing throwing them to the wolves. I personally know a lot of folks who took expensive yearly vacations, bought nice cars a bit too frequently, and never gave a moments thought about how to fund their children's future. It's pretty basic, unless you intend to relegate your children to a life of mediocrity, they need more than a HS diploma. Been that way for many years!
A couple years at community college before making the jump to university? Fine. Trade school? Fine.
Some reasonable amount of debt to the child (skin in the game)? Fine.
There are plenty of ways to go to school and not have debt, or have the debt paid off quickly. Just have to get creative.
I went to both undergraduate and graduate school (I have my masters). I stayed at home with my parents for both. My undergraduate school is a state school and is fairly cheap. I simply bartended and had a side business. I paid tuition as I went and didn't need to take out loans. My graduate school was much more expensive, but I did a lot of research and went for a degree with a lot of upside and demand. The demand opened a lot of doors. I ended up getting a full military scholarship and ended up taking out very little money in loans (which I easily paid back right when I finished school). Currently, I have 1 year left in my active duty military commitment. I will leave the military at age 28 with no debt and a significant stack of cash saved up.
As I said, there are ways, but you have to get creative.
It will definitely have a direct impact on the housing market. With increasing tuition and debt younger professionals will not be able to afford a house or even be approved for a loan.
I don't see why anyone would argue against enough inflation to restructure our debts as a nation.
I suspect China, a nation that holds a lot of our debt, might have a thing or two to say about that. China is a substantial contributor to political campaigns in the USA, even though it is not legal (they funnel money through Chinese nationals in the USA), and as we all know, campaign money is the lifeblood of politics.
I agree. For a country supposedly founded (as some claim) on Judeo-Christian and "family values", it seems like a very un-Christian system. Almost Satanic really...akin to "child sacrifice", at least in the financial sense.
Other countries look at how we run higher education and have a good laugh.
But yet they have much higher gas prices and universal healthcare. We got lower gas prices and unbelievable cost for college and high semi-universal healthcare.
But yet they have much higher gas prices and universal healthcare. We got lower gas prices and unbelievable cost for college and high semi-universal healthcare.
Yep. And that's why people in other countries laugh at us. We have more freedom here, all right...freedom to go into massive debt for education, and freedom to be forced into bankruptcy because of medical bills.
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