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No, the government IS the people in a democratic society. The absence of government is the oligarchy of private capital (though, of course, capital always has its government to protect "property" and not things that actually correspond with liberty...).
The people are the government. The left is for the people, the rest are for a theoretical form of economic freedom that has proven, time and time again, to be diametrically opposed to the actual function and exercise of freedom.
You are speaking ideology, I was being realistic and looking down the road ahead. Government will never be what it was meant and we will move away from that more and more every election cycle. Corporations will have their names on government buildings just as they do sports arenas. They may as well do so now. McDonald's can put their name on the WH and BP can go up on the Capitol Building.
There will be but one party in the future - government. It never changes face - oppression - Big Brother will be watching more than he does now. It will take a couple of generations but will happen.
As Josef Mengele said "The more we do to you, the less you believe we are doing". So it is with the USA.
You are speaking ideology, I was being realistic and looking down the road ahead. Government will never be what it was meant and we will move away from that more and more every election cycle. Corporations will have their names on government buildings just as they do sports arenas. They may as well do so now. McDonald's can put their name on the WH and BP can go up on the Capitol Building.
There will be but one party in the future - government. It never changes face - oppression - Big Brother will be watching more than he does now. It will take a couple of generations but will happen.
As Josef Mengele said "The more we do to you, the less you believe we are doing". So it is with the USA.
A lot of those in America who fear government, even when acknowledging the dominance of business, fail to see that dominance as our political reality. I think Noam Chomsky was right in his observation:
In the US, there is basically one party - the business party. It has two factions, called Democrats and Republicans, which are somewhat different but carry out variations on the same policies. By and large, I am opposed to those policies. As is most of the population.
A lot of those in America who fear government, even when acknowledging the dominance of business, fail to see that dominance as our political reality. I think Noam Chomsky was right in his observation:
In the US, there is basically one party - the business party. It has two factions, called Democrats and Republicans, which are somewhat different but carry out variations on the same policies. By and large, I am opposed to those policies. As is most of the population.
Noam Chomsky
I basically said business could hang a shingle on a federal building and cited the WH and Capitol Bldgs as examples.
I wouldn't call it the business party, "The Party" is accurate and ominous simultaneously. There will be no elections later in this century as a POTUS will be selected from within the party just as they are in a corporation.
A lot of those in America who fear government, even when acknowledging the dominance of business, fail to see that dominance as our political reality. I think Noam Chomsky was right in his observation:
In the US, there is basically one party - the business party. It has two factions, called Democrats and Republicans, which are somewhat different but carry out variations on the same policies. By and large, I am opposed to those policies. As is most of the population.
Noam Chomsky
I agree with most of the quote, but not the last part. How do you know most of the population oppose those policies? Most people choose a political party and support it actively. If the two parties are not that different, why bother supporting either party?
I agree with most of the quote, but not the last part. How do you know most of the population oppose those policies? Most people choose a political party and support it actively. If the two parties are not that different, why bother supporting either party?
It is human nature to strive to be part of something bigger-to be part of a group. The political/economic system and media manipulates and uses this to their advantage to separate people into two easily managed sides in order to control dialogue and censor any outside the box thought.
A lot of those in America who fear government, even when acknowledging the dominance of business, fail to see that dominance as our political reality. I think Noam Chomsky was right in his observation:
In the US, there is basically one party - the business party. It has two factions, called Democrats and Republicans, which are somewhat different but carry out variations on the same policies. By and large, I am opposed to those policies. As is most of the population.
Noam Chomsky
There are often very substantive differences between the Democrats and Republicans today. We are extremely polarized and that is because we are more different than alike.
This is incorrect. In terms of financial policies, the two are very similar in that they are both beholden to monied Wall Street interests and almost always implement the policies demanded by that group. The two parties differ on certain social policies, but that is ok by Wall Street because it effectively keeps the American people infighting as good little lemmings and dupes, unaware of the big picture.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Emigrations
There are often very substantive differences between the Democrats and Republicans today. We are extremely polarized and that is because we are more different than alike.
Yes, be afraid -- very afraid -- all those right wing Libertarians want to take control of the government...
... and then...
... wait for it...
... just leave everyone the hell alone.
If it were just libertarianism I'd be okay with it (to some degree - I'd still like someone to look out for the general public's environmental interests, not to mention some consumer protection). However, the Republican party as it is now is beholden to two very different groups: the Libertarians and the Religious Right. As the latter group has proven again and again, they are quite content to stick their noses into everyone else's lives.
Sadly those two are in bed together; & unlike most marriages in this country, these two guys - how ironic - don't seem headed for splitsville.
There are often very substantive differences between the Democrats and Republicans today. We are extremely polarized and that is because we are more different than alike.
It would say the left and the right have very substantive differences. The two parties don't actually match left vs right structure. Namely, the left wants much more socialist leaning policies than the democrats are willing to go. That doesn't make the democrats wrong and the left right. It does however say something about us being a polarized people. Much of that is also the result of economic changes.
If it were just libertarianism I'd be okay with it (to some degree - I'd still like someone to look out for the general public's environmental interests, not to mention some consumer protection). However, the Republican party as it is now is beholden to two very different groups: the Libertarians and the Religious Right. As the latter group has proven again and again, they are quite content to stick their noses into everyone else's lives.
Sadly those two are in bed together; & unlike most marriages in this country, these two guys - how ironic - don't seem headed for splitsville.
The democrats also have strong libertarian tendencies. It is reflected in their economic and social policies, particularly immigration policies. They just have stronger lefty rhetoric. And they have to do some lefty stuff for the sake of competing with the other party. Even so, they still resemble a lot. It's not just two guys, it's a three some that sees no end in sight.
Whatever immigration has been framed and told, it has always been a libertarian phenomenon, both in terms of people actively seeking a better life sometimes by risking their life and in terms of America accepting new labor force and consumers. This is essentially how immigration has functioned. We are told a warm and fuzzy story about it because powers want us to embrace something emotionally so that they get their financial rewards.
These days you see people (including other posters here) worried that foreigners are going to drive up real estate price in California and middle class Americans may find it even harder to afford a home. On one side, your hear the "they said the something about the Japanese..."arguments that dismiss any concerns. Fair enough. But it's also the left that is now worried about affordability, not only homes but also higher education. This is the clash between the cultural narrative and the economic reality. Hostility now comes from both the left and the right. The matter of the fact is that the rules of the world have not changed. Money talks.
Last edited by Costaexpress; 07-17-2014 at 04:44 PM..
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