Is $12/hour considered good pay? ($40k, recessions, workers, deductible)

[GraniteStater]

$12 an hour would be considered lower-middle class or working poor even in a lower cost of living state like Indiana. You need to make $15-18 an hour at least here to be in the middle class bracket.

[markg91359]

Originally Posted by mysticaltyger

No, not here in the SF Bay Area where a studio apartment on the low end costs $1K per month. Of course our core problem in this area is not wages per se, but a refusal to build new housing of any kind, thanks to NIMBYs and all the red tape they've created that prevents much new housing from being built and drives up the cost of what does get built.

I am well aware housing in SF in quite expensive. However, don't you think it has a lot more to do with other factors?

I would suggest these:

1. Almost all land is taken.
2. Property values are very expensive because of San Francisco's prime location.
3. Silicon Valley money and foreign money is buying up much of the property in SF and most people cannot compete with it.

[TheGrandK-Man]

Originally Posted by Mikelee81

Please put where you live to help with understanding cost of living.

In Connecticut? NO. Not out of college in 1996 when I was temping, and certainly not now.

[Warszawa]

Depends on the kind of job. If it's a punchout clock job at a supermarket, then yeah. If it involves getting an education, then no. I had an ice cream job that paid $8 an hour, which honestly felt like nothing. I didn't stick around for long. It was a cool low-stress job, but $8 an hour wasn't worth it, I would love to do it for $12

[reed067]

We live in Western North Carolina and it's good money here. I'll go back to what I said in another thread people live way beyond their means these days so they could make 200K and still be in debt.

[kwong7]

It depends. It depends on the work, the value added by the work, cost of living, and opportunity costs.

Here's an interesting factoid about my wife's earning history:

1996-1998: She worked at a local water park during the summer and was paid $3.50/hr, which was below minimum wage at the time.

1999-2004: She worked in the media section of Best Buy part-time at $6-$9/hr.

2002-2004: She also worked at her university computer lab at $12/hr.

2004: She worked as a summer associate at a law firm and earned $60/hr.

2005: She worked the school year at her law school's post-conviction clinic.

2006: She interned at the county's district attorney's office.

2007: She couldn't work while attending school in London…they are quite protectionist with labor.

2008: She started at her law firm starting at $80/hr.


She's come a long way from $3.50/hr.

[censusdata]

Originally Posted by GraniteStater

$12 an hour would be considered lower-middle class or working poor even in a lower cost of living state like Indiana. You need to make $15-18 an hour at least here to be in the middle class bracket.

In the region we both live in $12 an hour is the average starting wage for people with a college degree. With student loans it feels more like $9 an hour. It's not fun but I've made due thanks to my frugal upbringing. It's what I made $12 to $15 as a CAD drafter and switched to being a mail clerk to make the same money with less stress and greater potential to become a supervisor. I've worked with many people making $15 an hour with $50k to $100k in student loans they are defaulting on. They are living with their parents and unable to think about marriage or children.

[SierraCountyMtnBiker]

You'd have to live with the Indigenous people in order to make it on that wage in Hawaii

And sell your wares such as fresh fish to folks on the streets....

My BIL is extremely wealthy and owns a huge home on the beach in MAUI

He boasts of the wonderful fresh fish they buy from the vendors on the streets

[patrick85395]

Originally Posted by Mikelee81

Please put where you live to help with understanding cost of living.

Perhaps in a 3rd world country.

...yet, how do you define good? Is it salary enough to afford home ownership, owning a late model car, clothing, food, bills, taxes?

Let's do some math.

$12/hr * 2020 hrs/year = $24,240/year

Subtract taxes (I assume 24%) = .24 * 24,240 = $18,422 take home.

Let's divide that by 12 months = $18,422/12 months = $1535/month.

I live in Phoenix. Average Rent = $1,225/month, but let's say you can do it for $800/month...it's possible.

So, $1535 - $800 leave you $835.

Let's also assume that you have no car payment and carry only Liability insurance coverage:

Car insurance = $100/month
Food $300/month
Utilities $100/month
Internet $80/month
Cell phone: $60/month
Gas = $150/month
Misc = $45/month

Any other expenses and you're busted.

So, no, $12/hr is life on the edge. It's a plan to fail and stress-filled days asking questions like, "Do I eat Friskies Beef or Friskies Chicken?"

If you're making $12/hour and that's your career, then I propose getting an education or skill that society values and get above the poverty line. Avoid degrees in Psychology, Art, and the Social Sciences.

[Larry Caldwell]

$12/hr ($100/day) was considered good pay in 1970. It was average pay in 1986. It is a pay stub to the poor house today.