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Old 07-13-2014, 11:56 AM
 
Location: TN/NC
34,864 posts, read 30,962,553 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Costaexpress View Post
Well this is the result of the battles liberals fought. From free love movements in the early 20th century, we have come a long way. Socialism ultimately is one big community. Instead of each family taking care of their own kids, the society has decided to take care of one another's kids. America is getting there.
Many of us feel like we are being forcibly taken there and do not like it.
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Old 07-13-2014, 12:57 PM
 
6,822 posts, read 6,605,519 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Costaexpress View Post
I disagree on several points. It doesn't have to be a husband and a wife. What about gay parents? They can also have children.
NATURE teaches us it is supposed to be a Man with a Woman. << period BIOLOGY teaches us it is supposed to be a Man with a Woman. Penis and Vagina... must I elaborate?

Whatever Mankind concocts attempting to justify their behavior is just that.. attempting to justify their behavior.

The CHILDREN are who are hurting ultimately.. which ultimately hurts society at large.

Sure point to the study or two with two Men smiling on camera holding hands with an adopted child demonstrating how great it is...

Two wrongs don't make a right. Studies can easily be manipulated to further an agenda without presenting accurate conclusions based upon one's bias.

But this is not a "pro gay"/"anti-gay" thread.. It's about how our society has embraced being single. which my opinion about it is noted. It's supposed to be a Man with a Woman raising children... this forms a healthy family.. which ultimately helps form a healthy society.

Last edited by Mikelee81; 07-13-2014 at 01:01 PM.. Reason: typo
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Old 07-13-2014, 01:02 PM
 
2,485 posts, read 2,207,406 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikelee81 View Post
NATURE teaches us it is supposed to be a Man with a Woman. << period BIOLOGY teaches us it is supposed to be a Man with a Woman. Penis and Vagina... must I elaborate?

Whatever Mankind concocts attempting to justify their behavior is just that.. attempting to justify their behavior.

The CHILDREN are who are hurting ultimately.. which ultimately hurts society at large.

Sure point to the study or two with two Men smiling on camera holding hands with an adopted child demonstrating how great it is...

Two wrongs don't make a right. Studies can easily be manipulated to further an agenda without presenting accurate conclusions based upon one's bias.

But this is not a "pro gay"/"anti-gay" thread.. It's about how our society has embraced being single. which my opinion about it is noted. It's supposed to be a Man with a Woman raising children... this forms a healthy marriage.. which ultimately helps form a healthy society.
It is about being single, so let's not talk about another issue.

Being single is a personal choice. Are we in trouble if many people choose to be single?
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Old 07-13-2014, 01:07 PM
 
6,822 posts, read 6,605,519 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Costaexpress View Post
It is about being single, so let's not talk about another issue.

Being single is a personal choice. Are we in trouble if many people choose to be single?
The anti-thesis of being single is being married. As pointed out, the economics are a bit more complicated with society embracing single status than being married.

Wealth distribution.
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Old 07-13-2014, 01:30 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,339,185 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Costaexpress View Post
It is about being single, so let's not talk about another issue.

Being single is a personal choice. Are we in trouble if many people choose to be single?

Being single is the human default, being not-single takes work and the consent of another person.
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Old 07-13-2014, 02:02 PM
 
Location: Vallejo
21,678 posts, read 24,855,074 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikelee81 View Post
NATURE teaches us it is supposed to be a Man with a Woman. << period BIOLOGY teaches us it is supposed to be a Man with a Woman. Penis and Vagina... must I elaborate?
Why?

Lots of species in nature have homosexual relations as well. So nature really doesn't tell us anything of the sort.

Quote:
Whatever Mankind concocts attempting to justify their behavior is just that.. attempting to justify their behavior.
Yes, that's a good one-line summary of religion and psychology. Nothing particularly against the human construct of religion or the nuclear family. It's a pragmatic concoction that was developed for a reason. It's less relevant now in modern society and has its own strains with most women now working full-time jobs presenting the same dilemmas that a single-parent household has albeit it's still much easier with two sets of hands than one.

Quote:
But this is not a "pro gay"/"anti-gay" thread.. It's about how our society has embraced being single. which my opinion about it is noted. It's supposed to be a Man with a Woman raising children... this forms a healthy family.. which ultimately helps form a healthy society.
Why is your concoction the way it's supposed to be? Many societies children were raised more communally. It doesn't work well with large groups though, which is why it's mostly been abandoned nowadays. My parents separated when I was about five. I was still raised by my mother and father. They worked well together, just weren't in love anymore.

I also don't really see how society has embraced being single, especially with children. It's very difficult for one person to both provide for the family and raise the children. Those that pull it off well generally have a strong support system. My grandmother was very instrumental in my upbringing even before my parents' separation. Without her, I would have been much more of a latchkey child. Both my parents worked long hours both before and after separating.
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Old 07-13-2014, 02:10 PM
 
30,871 posts, read 36,796,993 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eddiehaskell View Post
I guess this brings up the question of how do we make marriage more appealing to people? With the financial safety net that exist today, I'm not sure if getting/staying married for the kid works too often. Also, 50+ years ago there may have been a social/religious stigma toward being unwed parents, but that doesn't exist at all today. Heck, to many the whole concept of marriage now seems too traditional or a bit old-fashioned.
I think you're asking the wrong question. The question should probably be: "How do we get people away from such a big focus on being comfortable at the expense of everything else?". Unfortunately, I think it will take a very bad crisis before that changes.

The social stigma toward unwed parenting needs to come back. It is harmful to the kid. All the research supports that.

The idea of marriage being old fashioned has been deliberately promoted by the entertainment media. The whole goal is to keep people divided and not cooperating with each other because that way we're more easily controlled, and more dependent on the government. It's all about power and control and we're the one's being played. But to get people to see this? It will probably take a crisis. That is the only way humanity ever seems to learn.
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Old 07-13-2014, 02:13 PM
 
30,871 posts, read 36,796,993 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Costaexpress View Post
What about gay couples who still can't marry? Can they not have kids?
I'm gay myself, but I still give preference to kids being raised by 2 biological opposite sex parents. I do think a gay 2 parent family beats a single parent family though, all other things being equal.
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Old 07-13-2014, 02:18 PM
 
30,871 posts, read 36,796,993 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Costaexpress View Post
[The way this discussion has derailed shows exactly the problem. Singles who are childless are being targeted. But they are the wrong targets.
Single & childless can do as they please if they're not breaking the law or bringing kids into the picture.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Costaexpress View Post
It's the people who have children and are not married that are what you are describing.
I definitely have a major issue with people raising kids without being married. The kids just don't do as well. People will always cherry pick their examples to support their own point of view...but the big picture research by secular researchers says over and over again that kids who spend time in single parent families just don't do as well in life on a variety of measures from life expectancy, how much they earn, how well they do in school, trouble with the law, teen pregnancy, etc. Kids from single parent/divorced families do worse on all of these measures.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Costaexpress View Post
But deep down, there seems to be stigma around being single in general.
I don't notice this. Maybe because I don't care or maybe because I live in a liberal area.
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Old 07-13-2014, 02:25 PM
 
30,871 posts, read 36,796,993 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
Surprise! Marriage is now a luxury good.


As a battle rages over the rights of gay and lesbian couples to get married, experts say the share of heterosexual Americans who are married has fallen dramatically compared to decades past. What's more, the demographics of who is walking down the aisle also have shifted substantially.


In recent years, people with a college degree have become more likely to get—and stay—married than their less educated counterparts, and those who stay married also tend to be much wealthier than unmarried adults.


"Some people have talked about marriage as a luxury good," said Susan Brown, a sociology professor at Bowling Green State University and co-director of the National Center for Family and Marriage Research.



The class divide: Marriage as a
Yes, I agree that marriage is becoming a luxury good. I think we need to reverse that trend in perception.

Scholar Kay Hymowitz, author of Marriage and Caste in America: Separate and Unequal Families in a Post-Marital Age, turns the argument around and says it's not that harsh economic conditions lead to women having children without fathers, but that the decision to have children without fathers leads to harsh, and self-perpetuating, economic conditions.

Forget Juno. Out-of-wedlock births are a national catastrophe.
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