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Where are they fleeing from now?
Germans, Italians, French. Are they coming here now in significant numbers?
I'm no socialist but the western Europeans have it better than we do. When you say that we are the greatest country in the world some European is laughing at you.
I was referring to current immigration today which is not western, for America it is mainly China, Africa and South and Central America.
Western Europe is massively hemorrhaging today with not only an influx of non working illegals that are collapsing the system along with unsustainable tax rates, the European unemployment rates are skyrocketing. The Socialist workers party got a hold of Europe a decade before America which started at this administration (God help us if Hillary wins), check Soros Europe for starters.
They are too busy figuring out how they will sustain over the next decade. I will assure you there is no laughing.
Look at unemployment rates throughout Europe, look at massive foreclosure rates weekly in prior stronger markets such as Ireland and England. I believe they are not fleeing to American because most cannot afford to at this point.
I've done well like you and I am well educated partly because of my father partly because of me. I was an insensitive bigoted conservative in my twenties and into my thirties. Then something happened. I started going grey and the job offers stopped. At one point after Y2K I was out of work for two years. And know this. If you have a skill that is no longer needed, you will see capitalism's uglier side. I was and am a computer programmer. Even with a MBA in hand I couldn't change professions to finance or accounting because there was always someone with experience in those profession that edged me out.
I've seen that ugly side too. I really think that not enough people have had *experiences* (not just debate or studying) that challenge their beliefs.
Western Europe is massively hemorrhaging today with not only an influx of non working illegals that are collapsing the system along with unsustainable tax rates, the European unemployment rates are skyrocketing. The Socialist workers party got a hold of Europe a decade before America which started at this administration (God help us if Hillary wins), check Soros Europe for starters.
They are too busy figuring out how they will sustain over the next decade. I will assure you there is no laughing.
Look at unemployment rates throughout Europe, look at massive foreclosure rates weekly in prior stronger markets such as Ireland and England. I believe they are not fleeing to American because most cannot afford to at this point.
I'll take capitalism any day.
No, Europe isn't ideal economically, and parts of the EU have suffered terribly since 2008. But foreclosures? I think the US has had its fair share, has it not?
Due to an impending job loss, we left Metro Detroit in 2011 when Michigan was one of the states that led the nation in foreclosure rates. Leading up to that mess, there were years of high unemployment in what was a one-state recession before it hit nationally in 2008. The value of our house had plummeted (and we didn't live in a large house), and we took a significant loss when we sold it (and we were lucky that we were able to sell it at all, when many others couldn't sell their homes).
So, plenty of us here in the US have felt that pain, as well.
I'd say 6 years ago is "recent," historically speaking, especially considering the economy has still not fully recovered from that near collapse. Did you forget about that?
I'm using the term capitalism as a synonym for free market. The free market is defined as the voluntary exchange of goods or services between two people, wherein both people benefit. I.E., if you have a hat, and I have $10, and we exchange my money for your hat, I obviously valued that hat more than my money, and you valued my money more than that hat.
So, how exactly was the free market responsible for the housing collapse? Alan Greenspan, more correctly, could have more than a few fingers pointed at him. And the Fed is about as non-free-market as any entity on planet earth. So... please... elaborate. How did the free market cause the housing collapse?
And I would suggest that if you're going to make a case, you should be well-armed with the facts. This is an area of expertise in my field of study.
Western Europe is massively hemorrhaging today with not only an influx of non working illegals that are collapsing the system along with unsustainable tax rates, the European unemployment rates are skyrocketing. The Socialist workers party got a hold of Europe a decade before America which started at this administration (God help us if Hillary wins), check Soros Europe for starters.
Socialism started with this administration?
Both Bushes, Clinton, Reagan, Carter.... literally all of them were pro-big-government socialists. They just used rhetoric to make it seem like they weren't.
And "God help us if Hillay wins"? Really?
So if Jeb Bush or Ted Cruz or Rick Perry or Ben Carson or Chris Christie or Rick Santorum or Marco Rubio win then we'll somehow be saved from the throes of big government socialism?
Please. They'd all fly the hammer and sickle in public if it would get them elected.
First, NO ONE has said anything about communism, let alone suggested the US should be a communist country, so don't be ridiculous.
That IS what they're saying. They just don't realize it. It's couched in different terms to make it palatable. We have been gradually led down the path of centralized power and control in all aspects of our lives for many generations. We don't see it because it's gradual. As one of the previous posters said, the wheels of centralized power and control have been turning since the Civil War. Actually, I'd argue they've been turning farther back than that.
Proofs of a Conspiracy, published in 1798, outlines some of the plans that were laid down over 200 years ago to break down the sense of family, community, and self sufficiency in order to make people dependent on a global dictatorship. The elites operate with a much longer time frame in mind than the vast majority of the populace.
A constitution is only as good as those who enforce it. Thomas Paine wrote, "when planning for posterity, we ought to remember that virtue is not hereditary."
Fascism and communism are the extremes of right and left. Libertarianism is a fairy tale of those who won't face the real world. Capitalism is not a system of government. It's a system of economics, which depends on good government for its existence. Where will we get that good government, which would make it possible for capitalism to exist? Is there such a thing as good government? When people say we presently have capitalism, they really mean fascism.
We need something to protect us from communism and fascism. Presently we have a bad mixture of them. The constitution won't protect us from them. If it would, we wouldn't have our present bad mixture.
What we need is something in the middle, that can work for everyone, and remain stable, with no encroachment by fascism or communism. It has to be something everyone can live with. Something that can remain stable forever, and not give people a lot of motivation to move us towards fascism or communism.
Our present system of government is not stable because it relies on a combination of populism and plutocracy. In populism, the general public excercises its political power to obtain free stuff from the government, which makes it lean towards communism. In plutocracy, the 1% find ways to control the government to make it lean towards fascism. Major disruptions are coming, and we're likely to end up with total fascism or communism, or swing violently between them, or get an even worse mixture of them than we already have.
What can we do? Even if we could invent the perfect system of government, to replace fascism and communism, and protect us from them, how would we convince people to vote for that system of government? The populists want something closer to communism, and the plutocrats want something closer to fascism. It's an aggressive tug-o-war. How can we prevent the inevitable breakdown when the rope in the middle of that tug-o-war breaks?
Did you say a system that works for everyone? There is no such system. What America is facing is that we don't even have a system that works for the obvious majority. We are split about 50/50.
Intuitively we all want to eliminate waste such as needless tests for the other guy but when it comes to ourselves and our loved ones, we usually want that extra test "just to be sure."
You have just described, in very minute detail, the concept of an inelastic demand.
If my life is in grave peril, the amount of money that I'm willing to spend is "all the money in the world" and my timetable is "ARRRRGH! Help me right now."
That is an inelastic demand. We're never going to get better as a nation until we sort this out. And so many other countrys have already blazed this trail for us. For once, America doesn't need to innovate. We can simply imitate and have the same fundamentally-decent system the rest of the developed world enjoys.
And here's the thing, rich people still get to have their concierge doctors and private hospitals. Everybody wins.
That IS what they're saying. They just don't realize it. It's couched in different terms to make it palatable. We have been gradually led down the path of centralized power and control in all aspects of our lives for many generations. We don't see it because it's gradual. As one of the previous posters said, the wheels of centralized power and control have been turning since the Civil War. Actually, I'd argue they've been turning farther back than that.
Proofs of a Conspiracy, published in 1798, outlines some of the plans that were laid down over 200 years ago to break down the sense of family, community, and self sufficiency in order to make people dependent on a global dictatorship. The elites operate with a much longer time frame in mind than the vast majority of the populace.
The only thing that book proves is that conspiracy theorists have been around a very long time.
The devil is in the details. Have we been led down the path to central control? Or is increased regulation simply inevitable with an exploding population that is increasingly intertwined and living closer and closer every day?
I cannot fathom the (additional) anarchy that would ensue in a crowded city like New York or LA or Paris if we attempted to exist like it was the old west!
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