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A degree in engineering isn't worth much until you get your LPE. A degree in accounting isn't worth much until you get your CPA. A degree in law isn't worth much until you pass the bar. A college degree is just a milestone, not a goal, and it certainly isn't the end of your education.
My generation typically reached the middle class sometime around age 40, after 15 years experience in their field and a lot of saving. Up to then it was a 10 year old car (only one, not one for every driver), beanbag chairs and a black and white TV that got three channels. My wife used to drive me to work in the mornings and pick me up in the evenings so she could have something to drive during the day. It sort of went with the brown bag lunches and the thermos of coffee. I didn't even own a TV until I got married.
That's how you live in your 20s. You don't have any new, shiny stuff, you have old, half worn-out stuff, and not much of that.
What amazes me is the attitude of entitlement that I have seen in many younger people. Not all, but many, and in some not-so-young people, too. It is as if they are born to have it all right now, and it is usually stuff that is not essential to a productive life or might be things that have usually come later in life.
I remember being told in school that having a degree is not a guarantee of any type of success in finding employment.
What amazes me is the attitude of entitlement that I have seen in many younger people. Not all, but many, and in some not-so-young people, too. It is as if they are born to have it all right now, and it is usually stuff that is not essential to a productive life or might be things that have usually come later in life.
I remember being told in school that having a degree is not a guarantee of any type of success in finding employment.
It depends on the parents and schools. Nine times out of ten it is nurture that causes the attitude of entitlement and not just out of nowhere like people think it does. Not blaming it on parents and schools but they can influence things like that.
Many are rich beyond anything boomers could image at age not seen before. Many of the jobs we loss are 1950 jobs a former peasant can now do since he has the tools; and facilities to do so.One only has to look at our education ranking to see why. So many have no skills needed at western labor prices.
You can't become an LPE without 4 years of progressively responsible work experience. The work experience is evaluated and approved by the PE board. When I was in my 20s they wouldn't let you into an engineering grad school at the same university where you took your baccalaureate. In Oregon, you can't get a CPA license without at least a year of work experience supervised by a licensed CPA. In both of those fields, just going to school won't get you there.
Law is different, but it pretty much requires a JD to sit for the bar exam, and many candidates never pass it.
Well, fine then, the 4 years or one year is part of the education. The thing is that a lot of folks these days have too narrow-minded a view of what constitutes "education" and a training job is still a job. Going through 4 more years of relatively low salary is not equal to being "screwed" (or even "broke", you just have to be frugal and manage your money well)!
Again, you didn't read my post(s). I said the average debt at $40k - $50k based on a 4 year degree AND a Master's Degree. This link is mainly for those with just a bachelor's degree. Those with a bachelor's and a master's have much higher student loan debt levels on average.
they also have much higher incomes, on average. minor detail, i guess?
Nearly half the women my age (mid-20's) and perhaps even over half of them are either in nursing or are studying to become nurses. There may be just enough of a shortage now that it appears to be an attractive career option, but I guarantee you that in just 3-5 years there will already be an oversupply of nurses in the US.
Will they still pay decently? Probably. But the jobs will be harder and harder to get and while wages probably won't go down they certainly won't skyrocket. Having any kind of degree or certification above and beyond the other people applying to the same position may be the only way to solidify your foothold.
From what I also understand there are so many people applying to nursing programs that community colleges and other programs are turning away half or more of the applicants, so just getting into the program is hard. Then you have to actually make it through (this is obviously a good thing because who wants under-qualified nurses working on their body?) for the next couple years without failing any major exams or hand-on tests while maintaining your grade point average (again a good way to skim for the cream of the crop), but these ladies tell me that a lot of the people who attempt the program were never a good fit to begin with. So what does that tell you about those who were initially turned away due to slots already being full?
Talk to some nurses that have been in the field for 5 or more years... most of them are burned out. Many go into nursing for the wrong reasons (good income instead of interest in it).
Interesting article...if I were a younger person and wanting to enter the job market, I would invest in a tech college or community college and get training in a needed field rather than spin my wheels trying to get a job with a degree in a field with few jobs.
Plumbers, electricians, Master mechanics, HVAC specialists, roofers, etc. will always be needed in our world -- and these hands-on jobs cannot be exported and done overseas.
Just my two cents worth.
I sure wouldn't go into thousands of dollars of school loan debt to obtain a degree that might not get me a job.
I agree....the trade professions such as plumbers, electricians, sheet metal workers, welders, etc are in extreme demand in North Dakota and northwestern Minnesota. At recent job fairs, these employers lament that some young adults dont want to get into that profession as it can be hard work, but they are very much desperate for skilled young workers in these fields. Just in my local area Grand Forks ND.... there is a large nitrogen ammonia plant that will be built starting in 2015 and over the two year period they will need 2,000 construction workers. They dont know how they will get that many due to the competition from the oil fields in western ND. There are several other large projects such as that scheduled in the next few years in the state or already in progress.
That's because we are irritated by all the whiners who think they should be an instant success just because they went to college. If you picked an actual productive major and managed to graduate in the top 25% of your class, that should buy you an entry level job at the bottom of the pay scale, somewhat below the US median income. If you just managed a C average, good luck finding a job. Everybody knows just how mediocre that is. Mediocre in school means mediocre at work, which means more trouble than you are worth.
As they used to say when we really milked cows before heading to work, the cream rises. There are millennials who are doing great. They excel. The top 10% will always do well. The vast mass of spear carriers will never make a mark, and when it's time to downsize they will be discarded. That's the way it has always been. You may not be able to make a living in your chosen field. Your chosen field may not even exist ten years from now. If you are not doing well, it's not society's fault, it's your fault. Do something different.
In defense of the young- I'm sorry but they didn't have the opportunities that the boomers had. You can't just get a job and pay for school -its too expensive now. Even the cheaper State schools you would still have to take out loans if you don't have a family that is in the position to help you.
Yes, some of the millennials are lazy (my mother who is in her 60's produces the equivalent of what it takes 3 of her coworkers in their mid 20's to do). Maybe if they weren't raised by people who told them how special they were every 5 minutes they would have more drive.
Mediocre in school doesn't always mean mediocre in work- esp. if you have to work 3 jobs while in college. That is a hasty generalization.
Also, I agree that people who think they should be making over 100k by their mid 20's are unrealistic.
My spouse and I sometimes talk about how we got to where we are today (we are gen x) and it wouldn't be possible for a 19 or 20 year old to do what either of us did because everything is just too expensive now. And don't get me started on being forced to have health insurance. I would have been livid if I had to do that at 25 because my employer at the time didn't provide it.
We worked hard and weren't lazy but that only goes so far. The place that I rented at that age is now 2,000 times more than what I paid.
I know a kid that lived in a tent on campus for 4 years in San Diego because he couldn't afford housing.
That's because we are irritated by all the whiners who think they should be an instant success just because they went to college. If you picked an actual productive major and managed to graduate in the top 25% of your class, that should buy you an entry level job at the bottom of the pay scale, somewhat below the US median income.
done and done. not sure why you wanna generalize again but ok. every generation has their whiners, trust me. in 2008, I was starting college in the depths of the great recession. I decided to pick a major that would be in demand. worked hard, picked up internships, worked three jobs. 6 years later, I am gainfully employed. not sure why you wanna lecture someone about entitlement when you have no idea who you're dealing with....
Quote:
As they used to say when we really milked cows before heading to work, the cream rises. There are millennials who are doing great. They excel. The top 10% will always do well. The vast mass of spear carriers will never make a mark, and when it's time to downsize they will be discarded. That's the way it has always been. You may not be able to make a living in your chosen field. Your chosen field may not even exist ten years from now. If you are not doing well, it's not society's fault, it's your fault. Do something different.
if you say that's the way it has always been, then chances are that the silent generation got sick of your whining too
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