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Old 12-30-2014, 12:50 PM
 
4,538 posts, read 6,414,581 times
Reputation: 3481

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One thing I do notice about younger workers (mainly under 30) they lack the same drive and ambition as the over workers mainly over 50 did when they were the same age.

For instance back in my mid 20s I would say pretty much my entire dept of 40 nearly everyone under 30 who did not have an MBA was going to school after work. Also they were joining trade organizations, networking, keeping resumes fresh and willing to job hop if they could not get a promotion.

Now most companies the level of folks going to grad school part time at night has significantly falling and participation in trade groups and business related organizations have fallen among the under 40 crowd.

Facebook, twitter, spin classes, shopping, starbucks and Chipolte are alot of fun but bad for your career if you are still a junior person with only a college degree, no certifications and a non-existant network of business people who can help your career
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Old 12-30-2014, 12:55 PM
 
18,493 posts, read 15,458,741 times
Reputation: 16150
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Gordon View Post
Obviously it is very general. Not all millennials are like this but a significant portion are. In my generation almost everyone proved to be effective and honest members of society.
The problem is that these sorts of stereotypes arise from knowing only a few people. Your firsthand experience likely arises from people in one area, with limited personality types.

A good sample, statistically speaking, must be RANDOMLY chosen and should consist of at least 1000-10000 people.

Personal anecdotes and impressions are never vigorous, and stereotypes are rarely justified.
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Old 12-30-2014, 12:57 PM
 
1,629 posts, read 2,615,262 times
Reputation: 3510
The older generation is fully responsible for the plight that millenials find themselves in today. It's a cop out for the older generation to assume that all, or most, millenials have been handed things on a silver platter for most of their lives. That's simply not true. Life is more challenging today than anytime since the Great Depression.

The cost of college has gone up tremendously, leaving many millenials, even those with professional jobs, with insane amounts of debt that they will not pay off until their 40s, 50s, or later. Why has the cost of college risen so precipitously? Why hasn't the older generation done more to keep the cost in check? So many people from "older" generations will talk endlessly about how they worked their way through college. Yes, when college was several hundred dollars a semester, I am sure that was more than doable. College can now reach into the tens of thousands of dollars a semester. Few, if any students, are going to be able to work, attend school, and cover that entire amount. We are no longer in a time where most can expect to make a decent living without a college degree either.

When saddled with tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars in student loan debt, home purchasing becomes unattainable. Instead of the older generation chiding a growing chunk of millenials for living with mom and dad well into their 20s, the older generation should recognize that this isn't because millenials want to be coddled. It's because some millenials simply can't afford to pay Sallie Mae $1000/month, eat, and afford rent. Some millenials also want to get out of debt quickly and living rent free is a way to fast track out of student loan debt. Why the older generation seems fine with bailing out banks, but not the next generation, is a question I have had for a long time.

We are coming out of the worst job market since the Great Depression. Instead of the older generation retiring between 55-65 like they have in past decades, a large chunk of older folks are now deciding to work until the wheels fall off, preventing the natural movement of people in middle management positions from being promoted into higher management positions, people from entry level positions being promoted into middle management positions, and college graduates from being hired into entry level positions. While many older folks continue to work because they can't afford to retire, there are many older people who just refuse to leave the workplace and let this natural progression occur.

Older folks have also been responsible for electing the people who have destroyed our economy. As their senility deepens, so do their terrible political choices. They are selfish in thinking about their quality of life for the relatively short time they have left on this earth, while the younger generation is left to pick up the pieces after they're six feet under.

I am not bitter at the older generation, as much as I am just frustrated at the smugness and aloofness of many older people who fail to recognize that life is not as simple as it was in the 50s-90s.
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Old 12-30-2014, 01:23 PM
 
4,538 posts, read 6,414,581 times
Reputation: 3481
What Do Great Bosses Do?
I've had a bunch of "bosses" but my very first one was by far the best. He was an old-fashioned IBM manager (I only remember him taking his jacket off once in ten years). He played golf, shmoozed with clients, and was generally a formal but very nice guy. His name was Bob, and here is what he did.

1. He always listened and always had time for me.
It didn't matter how busy he was, Bob would always stop what he was doing when I walked in his office. Somehow he knew that when I took the time to come in, it was worth his time to listen.

2. He rarely gave criticism but always helped.
His philosophy was to give great advice, help us succeed, and always work as a team. I looked up to him and always "copied" what he did to make myself better. The few times he gave me specific advice, I really listened.

3. He would take an arrow for me or our team.
In those days IBM was a very successful company (IBM in the 1970s and 80s was the Google of today). His job, as a sales executive, was to battle other IBM managers for our quota, territory, bonuses, and many other things. He always put us and our customer first, often being be the "bad guy" and pushing management to make changes we needed. I remember walking into his office one day when he was preparing an account review for a bunch of execs and I could see he was really exhausted and dejected. Many in the organization considered him a bit of a "pain in the rear" because he pushed so hard. I knew he was arguing with management to do what was right for us and our customer, and I never forgot that vision of him sweating away worrying about what he needed to accomplish for us.

4. He always put our customer first.
We were in a sales office, and our customer was a very large, demanding, complex organization. Bob was best friends with all our customer executives and they adored him. He would always push us to get out of the office and go meet with people before we made any decisions about anything. That "customer first" culture I learned at IBM made me successful in every job I had over the last 35 years.
5. He took us with him.
Bob was the type of manager who would always take someone junior with him on the big customer call. He drove an Oldsmobile (he was an engineer and to him, the Olds was "the engineer's car.") and he would grab me in the office, we'd throw on our coats (we wore suits and ties every single day) and our briefcases (yes we all carried briefcases) and we'd head out to see the customer. I often just sat and listened, but I learned so much by just watching him in action, taking the follow-up notes, and then taking the next call by myself.
6. He took care of us.
Bob was the kind of guy who always worried if someone wasn't in the office or had a problem with a client. He wasn't interested in our personal lives that much, but he sure cared if we had any problems. When one of our team-mates developed cancer, Bob spent the better part of his remaining life (our team-mate eventually died from it) taking care of him and helping his family.

7. He was fun.
Bob really was a fun-loving guy, and even though he intimidated almost everyone (he always had is coat on and he looked you right in the eye), he always told a joke at just the right time. He knew that even though we had a huge quota and a million problems to solve every day (our team was over 100 people all over California), it was all part of the game. He took work very seriously, but he also knew it was only a job.

8. He went home on time, usually.
Believe it or not, in those days we worked incredibly hard but we rarely stayed in the office past 6. We had an enormous job but we got it done in 50-55 or so hours a week, and Bob would just "disappear" somewhere around 6pm. It set the tempo that we were all expected to get stuff done without staying all night.

9. He made sure we all had a good role.
One of Bob's amazing strengths was his ability to value every single member of the team. He realized that some of us were more technical, some were more salesy, and some were more administrative. He made sure we shifted work around so people did things we were good at.
I worked for IBM for ten years in the 1980's and we accomplished many amazing things. But for me personally, having the opportunity to work for Bob is the one thing that stuck with me for the rest of my life. And when he died (about 10 years ago), his wife came up to me and said "he always loved you young people, he thought about you like his own kids." If you're a manager, remember you can "be Bob." Consider it an awesome responsibility. You could possibly impact someone for the rest of their life.
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Old 12-30-2014, 01:35 PM
 
Location: Omaha, Nebraska
10,313 posts, read 7,899,473 times
Reputation: 27642
Quote:
Originally Posted by new2colo View Post
I am not bitter at the older generation, as much as I am just frustrated at the smugness and aloofness of many older people who fail to recognize that life is not as simple as it was in the 50s-90s.
Life was never simple, kid.
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Old 12-30-2014, 01:36 PM
 
Location: southern california
61,289 posts, read 87,144,090 times
Reputation: 55550
millenials have been fed by the boomers for the last 40 years, what did they ruin, their diet?
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Old 12-30-2014, 01:40 PM
 
14,336 posts, read 14,137,407 times
Reputation: 45585
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Gordon View Post
Their inner feelings of inferiority and their belief they won't live up to our goals or accomplishments?
-Dr Gordon PhD Clinical Psychology Class of 1963.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallysmom View Post
Yes -- but what do we expect when everything has been handed to them with little or no effort? You raise kids with the belief that showing up gets you a trophy, that the way to an "A" is to browbeat and threaten the teacher, that their widdle pwecious num-num should never ever have to work hard at all....

You end up with whiny adult incapable of achieving anything on his own because WE NEVER TAUGHT THEM TO. They have no coping skills, except for whining it isn't fair.

Guess what? Life isn't fair. The first time I made spaghetti sauce, it was pink because I didn't know to brown the meat(it wasn't listed in the recipe, as you were supposed to put cooked meatballs in, and that fact didn't sink in). I now make great spaghetti sauce. The first time I made Pineapple Upside Down cake, I blew up the Pyrex dish, because I didn't know you shouldn't use that on the flame. I now make great cakes.

My mother let me fall down in the cooking department, and I've learned from that. We decided our children weren't allowed to fail. Dumbest thing I ever witnessed.

This message is brought to you by the "Get Off My Lawn" council.
Both of you are pitifully wrong.

For starters, I am not a whiny Millennial. I'm a 55 year old, late baby-boomer. Life has been good to me and I make an income that puts me in about the top 5 percent of income earners in the state in which I live. I state these facts, not to brag, but just so I don't across as a "failure" complaining about the unfairness of life.

The simple reality is that the younger generation doesn't have the same opportunities and breaks that we got. Its a function of today's world. In no particular order, I can list these events:

1. A major recession that started in 2008 and is only now, beginning to get back to normal.
2. Downsizing and outsourcing that has created a dearth of white collar jobs for college grads.
3. Saturation of many professions that has resulted in difficulty finding an entry level position for the majority of new grads.
4. Outrageous college tuition prices that our generation allowed to happen. We should have really put the pressure on state supported colleges to hold the line on these increases and we didn't. As a result, a college education is becoming as expensive as a new mortgage would be for young people.
5. The burden of excessively high student loans.

Yes, things are different than they were in the 1960's and the 1970's. There may not be much that individuals can do about it. However, we can at least be honest and acknowledge the reality of the situation. It isn't that the new generation is lacking. They are no more lacking that we boomers were when we graduated. Its simply that the same opportunities are not available today.

My goodness, if I hear one more word about how well one individual has done and how he expects the majority of the younger generation to do the same thing, I think that I may vomit. Whoopee-do. Big Deal. There will always be exceptions to rules and just because one person was fortunate enough to be that exception doesn't prove a thing. The proof isn't in "exceptions". The proof is in taking a sample and determining how the majority of a group are doing. The answer is they aren't doing well right now. The problem is when one group doesn't do well in America that it spills over to other groups. If young people have poor earnings, they contribute less to the social security trust fund that many boomers will draw checks from. People with poor earnings need government handouts in the form of Medicaid, food stamps, and earned income tax credits. It would be smart for us to realize that like it or not, we sink or swim together as a nation. Perhaps, than we might try to fix some of the problems affecting other generations than our own.

Than there is this nonsense that the real problem is young people today aren't "tough enough" because they always got a trophy when they are young. If someone is really silly enough to believe this is the problem, rather than a worse national economy. Wow, talk about taking leave of your senses....The problem is far deeper than that. Until that fact can at least be acknowledged a productive discussion will not result.

Life has always presented a challenge for each generation. I submit though that some groups have it harder than others and this Millennial Generation has been hit very hard.

The focus needs to be on improving the economy. Playing some kind of silly blame game isn't going to do any good at all.
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Old 12-30-2014, 02:16 PM
 
18,493 posts, read 15,458,741 times
Reputation: 16150
Quote:
Originally Posted by new2colo View Post
The older generation is fully responsible for the plight that millenials find themselves in today. It's a cop out for the older generation to assume that all, or most, millenials have been handed things on a silver platter for most of their lives. That's simply not true. Life is more challenging today than anytime since the Great Depression.

The cost of college has gone up tremendously, leaving many millenials, even those with professional jobs, with insane amounts of debt that they will not pay off until their 40s, 50s, or later. Why has the cost of college risen so precipitously? Why hasn't the older generation done more to keep the cost in check? So many people from "older" generations will talk endlessly about how they worked their way through college. Yes, when college was several hundred dollars a semester, I am sure that was more than doable. College can now reach into the tens of thousands of dollars a semester. Few, if any students, are going to be able to work, attend school, and cover that entire amount. We are no longer in a time where most can expect to make a decent living without a college degree either.

When saddled with tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars in student loan debt, home purchasing becomes unattainable. Instead of the older generation chiding a growing chunk of millenials for living with mom and dad well into their 20s, the older generation should recognize that this isn't because millenials want to be coddled. It's because some millenials simply can't afford to pay Sallie Mae $1000/month, eat, and afford rent. Some millenials also want to get out of debt quickly and living rent free is a way to fast track out of student loan debt. Why the older generation seems fine with bailing out banks, but not the next generation, is a question I have had for a long time.

We are coming out of the worst job market since the Great Depression. Instead of the older generation retiring between 55-65 like they have in past decades, a large chunk of older folks are now deciding to work until the wheels fall off, preventing the natural movement of people in middle management positions from being promoted into higher management positions, people from entry level positions being promoted into middle management positions, and college graduates from being hired into entry level positions. While many older folks continue to work because they can't afford to retire, there are many older people who just refuse to leave the workplace and let this natural progression occur.

Older folks have also been responsible for electing the people who have destroyed our economy. As their senility deepens, so do their terrible political choices. They are selfish in thinking about their quality of life for the relatively short time they have left on this earth, while the younger generation is left to pick up the pieces after they're six feet under.

I am not bitter at the older generation, as much as I am just frustrated at the smugness and aloofness of many older people who fail to recognize that life is not as simple as it was in the 50s-90s.
I still think this is largely a result of inconsistent principles of how college is to be paid for, as I explained in the other thread:

Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
Also, either you are an adult at 18 or at 24. Right now we have a garbled and incoherent system where 18 is old enough that your parents are not required to chip in, yet their income can stop you from getting need-based aid. This is totally bizarre - money YOU HAVE NO ACCESS OR RIGHTS TO (parents' income and assets) can make you ineligible.

How would you feel if your ex-spouse's income counted against you for tax purposes even though you were not getting alimony? This is the same thing - someone else's money, which you cannot spend, is being held against you. This is wrong and needs to end.
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Old 12-30-2014, 02:24 PM
 
Location: OC/LA
3,830 posts, read 4,642,047 times
Reputation: 2214
Quote:
Originally Posted by markg91359 View Post
Both of you are pitifully wrong.

For starters, I am not a whiny Millennial. I'm a 55 year old, late baby-boomer. Life has been good to me and I make an income that puts me in about the top 5 percent of income earners in the state in which I live. I state these facts, not to brag, but just so I don't across as a "failure" complaining about the unfairness of life.

The simple reality is that the younger generation doesn't have the same opportunities and breaks that we got. Its a function of today's world. In no particular order, I can list these events:

1. A major recession that started in 2008 and is only now, beginning to get back to normal.
2. Downsizing and outsourcing that has created a dearth of white collar jobs for college grads.
3. Saturation of many professions that has resulted in difficulty finding an entry level position for the majority of new grads.
4. Outrageous college tuition prices that our generation allowed to happen. We should have really put the pressure on state supported colleges to hold the line on these increases and we didn't. As a result, a college education is becoming as expensive as a new mortgage would be for young people.
5. The burden of excessively high student loans.

Yes, things are different than they were in the 1960's and the 1970's. There may not be much that individuals can do about it. However, we can at least be honest and acknowledge the reality of the situation. It isn't that the new generation is lacking. They are no more lacking that we boomers were when we graduated. Its simply that the same opportunities are not available today.

My goodness, if I hear one more word about how well one individual has done and how he expects the majority of the younger generation to do the same thing, I think that I may vomit. Whoopee-do. Big Deal. There will always be exceptions to rules and just because one person was fortunate enough to be that exception doesn't prove a thing. The proof isn't in "exceptions". The proof is in taking a sample and determining how the majority of a group are doing. The answer is they aren't doing well right now. The problem is when one group doesn't do well in America that it spills over to other groups. If young people have poor earnings, they contribute less to the social security trust fund that many boomers will draw checks from. People with poor earnings need government handouts in the form of Medicaid, food stamps, and earned income tax credits. It would be smart for us to realize that like it or not, we sink or swim together as a nation. Perhaps, than we might try to fix some of the problems affecting other generations than our own.

Than there is this nonsense that the real problem is young people today aren't "tough enough" because they always got a trophy when they are young. If someone is really silly enough to believe this is the problem, rather than a worse national economy. Wow, talk about taking leave of your senses....The problem is far deeper than that. Until that fact can at least be acknowledged a productive discussion will not result.

Life has always presented a challenge for each generation. I submit though that some groups have it harder than others and this Millennial Generation has been hit very hard.

The focus needs to be on improving the economy. Playing some kind of silly blame game isn't going to do any good at all.
Couldn't agree more.
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Old 12-30-2014, 02:25 PM
 
13,389 posts, read 6,385,266 times
Reputation: 10022
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aredhel View Post
Life was never simple, kid.

Really lol. Where does this idea come from? If Boomers are to blame for anything, it is for sheltering, pampering, over providing and being too permissive with their kids.

They simply cant remember that most of us struggled to get what we have because they were too young when the struggle was taking place to recall it.

All I have to do is look at our kids to see that they expect to live the lifestyle or better that it took my H and I 10 or more years to establish.

We on the other hand were thrilled to be poor and struggling if it meant being free from the rules and strictness and walked 10 miles uphill to go to school attitude of our silent generation parents who met our needs, but still counted every penny when it came to wants.
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