U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 03-04-2015, 05:25 PM
 
13,085 posts, read 10,431,657 times
Reputation: 10152

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by SOON2BNSURPRISE View Post
rruff, OK so this is the economics forum. True. All I know is what I see. All I know is what I lived thru. I was in high school when Reagan was elected, by a landslide I might add. He is the last President to have a true majority of the nation behind him. He took nearly every state during both the 1980 and 1984 elections. I remember that interest rates were in the double digits back then. Try and buy a house back in 1980. No wonder property values were low, no one could afford the interest rates. LOL

I remember people talking about how great this nation was back in the early to late 1980's. Things were happening, people were starting new business operations and many of those people made very good money. My dad started his business back then as well and did very well for himself.

You mention people prior to 1980 getting good jobs where the employer would take care of them. Amazing benefits that these employers offered employees. What happened? Capitalism is what happened.
And Reaganomics, the decline of unions, the offshoring of manufacturing, the transition to at-will, more transient employment, the decline of defined benefit pensions, and now the decision that the super-rich such as Koch Brothers can buy the government out. And lest I forget to mention, skyrocketing education and healthcare costs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SOON2BNSURPRISE View Post

The market spoke. The owners took those jobs and offered them to people that would work for less. That is how the market works. If a business can get more value from someone else than the business will gravitate to the higher profit margin. But what happened to people that lost jobs? Many started their own companies, becoming capitalists themselves.
And many are STILL underemployed and struggling through no fault of their own.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SOON2BNSURPRISE View Post

realize that if you are a worker that has no equity in a company than you have no say in what happens to your job. If the company sends your job somewhere else than you are out of luck. Capitalism never failed. The rules of capitalism worked and the owners fought for a higher profit margin. Employees have no control over that. The market has all of the control.
And why is this a good thing?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 03-04-2015, 05:44 PM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
5,436 posts, read 5,286,331 times
Reputation: 4497
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
And why is this a good thing?
Isn't it obvious? Become a capitalist and get rich.

As SOON2BNSURPRISE stated earlier, even someone with his meager talents can do it. Why not everyone?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-04-2015, 06:24 PM
 
13,085 posts, read 10,431,657 times
Reputation: 10152
Quote:
Originally Posted by rruff View Post
Isn't it obvious? Become a capitalist and get rich.

As SOON2BNSURPRISE stated earlier, even someone with his meager talents can do it. Why not everyone?
If only it were that simple...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-04-2015, 06:25 PM
 
Location: Living on the Coast in Oxnard CA
16,242 posts, read 27,511,934 times
Reputation: 21547
Tell me what is holding you back from doing your own thing. I would love to hear how you are being held back.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-04-2015, 06:27 PM
 
13,085 posts, read 10,431,657 times
Reputation: 10152
Quote:
Originally Posted by SOON2BNSURPRISE View Post
Tell me what is holding you back from doing your own thing. I would love to hear how you are being held back.
Lack of research funding...does that answer your question?

It's really a larger issue than what is holding me back. It is an issue of economic opportunities and justice. As has been pointed out the gap between the rich and poor has grown. Please point to a good thing which exists now, that could not exist in a society with less inequality.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-04-2015, 06:35 PM
 
4,035 posts, read 3,975,604 times
Reputation: 5318
Quote:
Originally Posted by SOON2BNSURPRISE View Post
I just saw a chart that showed that Capitalism works. Why else would all those people be getting richer? .
Perfect point to demonstrate that the crucial question is: capitalism works for whom? For whom should it work? Only the rich? Or the whole of society? Has capitalism really failed, or has it only failed the middle and lower classes? Do we want a system that fails the majority of people? Is that justifiable?

Also important to examine is--why has it failed? Before the tax system was undermined by big tax cuts, nd before deregulation of many industries, it worked fine. So, therefore, it's not capitalism that failed. Capitalism, when equitably taxed and regulated, works great.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-04-2015, 06:37 PM
 
4,035 posts, read 3,975,604 times
Reputation: 5318
Quote:
Originally Posted by SOON2BNSURPRISE View Post
rruff, OK so this is the economics forum. True. All I know is what I see. All I know is what I lived thru. I was in high school when Reagan was elected, by a landslide I might add. He is the last President to have a true majority of the nation behind him.
Wrong. Only 25% of the electorate voted. He won a majority of that 25%.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-05-2015, 10:04 AM
 
13,085 posts, read 10,431,657 times
Reputation: 10152
Quote:
Originally Posted by NewbiePoster View Post
Perfect point to demonstrate that the crucial question is: capitalism works for whom? For whom should it work? Only the rich? Or the whole of society? Has capitalism really failed, or has it only failed the middle and lower classes? Do we want a system that fails the majority of people? Is that justifiable?

Also important to examine is--why has it failed? Before the tax system was undermined by big tax cuts, nd before deregulation of many industries, it worked fine. So, therefore, it's not capitalism that failed. Capitalism, when equitably taxed and regulated, works great.
Very well said. Also, to take the position that everyone should just chase more money ignores the value of art and music. I'm willing to guess that SOON2BNSURPRISE would not actually want to live in a world where everyone just chased more money and there was no art or music. It would be a much less enjoyable world. Yet by taking the position that it is acceptable to just let people in lower paid professions be worse for it, that is exactly what is being promoted, albeit indirectly.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-05-2015, 11:05 AM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
5,436 posts, read 5,286,331 times
Reputation: 4497
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
Very well said. Also, to take the position that everyone should just chase more money ignores the value of art and music.
Not just art and music... EVERYTHING.

It's really sad the way everyone in the US is bombarded with greed meme. More, more, more! It is the goal of advertising and marketing to get us hooked and addicted on stuff they sell. It never ends, we never arrive, we always need more. One quick fix followed by another and another.

An addicted person is never happy and at peace. Always anxious, agitated. Is it any wonder all the people who are taking anti-depressants just to cope with day to day life? What insanity! We need a new *life* not a new pill to numb us out.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-05-2015, 11:11 AM
 
Location: Living on the Coast in Oxnard CA
16,242 posts, read 27,511,934 times
Reputation: 21547
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
Lack of research funding...does that answer your question?

It's really a larger issue than what is holding me back. It is an issue of economic opportunities and justice. As has been pointed out the gap between the rich and poor has grown. Please point to a good thing which exists now, that could not exist in a society with less inequality.
So no one will invest in your research funding? How many people did you approach to see if any investors could be found?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2020, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top