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Old 02-18-2015, 06:59 PM
 
615 posts, read 724,349 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greywar View Post
Arguably they should be cheaper. BUT....while the actual cost of the building isn't much different, the cost of the lot itself has increased a lot.
Because property, as in physical landmass, is a zero-sum game now that everything that isn't a national park is owned and used by a person or business. I would say it's an objectively worse standard of living if half the people can only afford to be cooped up in an apartment with ever-increasing rent. All my acquaintances who are Asian immigrants love it here because there's so much more space --- for the time being.
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Old 02-18-2015, 07:05 PM
 
18,512 posts, read 15,494,002 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidRudisha View Post
And then there's the issue of debt. I'm 25 and most people my age have tens of thousands of student loan debt that isn't going away anytime soon. It adds up to over $1 trillion that this nation could've alternately invested and created jobs with. What a colossal waste.
How do you know it's a waste? The relevant issue is that you have to consider what the alternatives are. Higher education could have been paid for by other means than student borrowing - by parents, by federal government, by state government, by student current income, or other sources. Whatever source of funds is used to pay for the education, will have that much less money to go towards something else.

To label student debt a "waste", you are implicitly assuming that whatever else this money is used for (rather than paying for higher education so that student borrowing would not be used) is somehow less "worthy" or "fruitful" than the spending of college graduates. I'm a little curious why you think this to be so. I would agree with you for some of the possibilities but not necessarily all.
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Old 02-18-2015, 07:05 PM
 
3,792 posts, read 2,373,824 times
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Originally Posted by jrkliny View Post
I have no idea why this forum seems to attract the whiners of the world. That is too bad because coming here to exchange ideas and learn would be a whole lot more valuable.
That is why I am here.
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Old 02-18-2015, 07:07 PM
 
3,792 posts, read 2,373,824 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
How do you know it's a waste? The relevant issue is that you have to consider what the alternatives are. Higher education could have been paid for by other means than student borrowing - by parents, by federal government, by state government, by student current income, or other sources. Whatever source of funds is used to pay for the education, will have that much less money to go towards something else.

To label student debt a "waste", you are implicitly assuming that whatever else this money would be used for is somehow less "worthy" or "fruitful" than the spending of college graduates. I'm a little curious why you think this to be so. I would agree with you for some of the possibilities but not necessarily all.
The return on the investment is quite often very low.
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Old 02-18-2015, 07:10 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ContrarianEcon View Post
The return on the investment is quite often very low.
But the investment is in what? Entitlement spending? Tax breaks for the rich? Vacations for parents who don't pay for their kids to go to college?
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Old 02-18-2015, 07:11 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
But the investment is in what? Entitlement spending? Tax breaks for the rich?
debt for getting an education.
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Old 02-18-2015, 09:34 PM
 
Location: West Hollywood
3,190 posts, read 3,173,882 times
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Substantial, perpetual growth was always a pipedream. It's not realistic at all. Food and water aren't the only limited resources.
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Old 02-18-2015, 09:49 PM
 
7,898 posts, read 7,088,773 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidRudisha View Post
Only a limited number of students can get CS degrees: that's why they have value. For instance, the admission rate for the CS program at my college was 3%. Calculus and Physics at any worthwhile university are graded on a curve. This idea that "There is opportunity for everyone because everyone can get a CS degree from Cal Tech" ignores the fact that the track into good jobs is structured like a competitive tournament where only a small number can possibly come out on top.
You are certainly correct. Many people have the opportunity to try for a CS degree, or to succeed as a high paid athlete or to become a corporate executive or a lawyer or whatever....

Unfortunately, as the saying goes, the world is full of losers. The winners figure out how to achieve their goals. The losers find excuses and complain. Neither of which will help them succeed at anything. In fact both of those will like lead to more future failures. If you understood for sure that every time you complain about something, you will fail in the future, then you might stop complaining.
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Old 02-18-2015, 10:19 PM
eok
 
6,684 posts, read 4,228,753 times
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All this arguing about the economic pie. The issue is really much simpler than it seems. It's like a simple cherry pie, growing slowly, while the population grows too. But the real issue is that it has fewer cherries. And fewer every year. Now it's reached the point where it has no cherries at all, but just cheap cherry jelly. And if it grows too fast, it will burst, and get cherry jelly all over the place. Then there will be plenty of cleaning jobs for unemployed people. And that's the essence of what the economic pie is really all about.
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Old 02-19-2015, 12:17 AM
 
Location: West Hollywood
3,190 posts, read 3,173,882 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eok View Post
All this arguing about the economic pie. The issue is really much simpler than it seems. It's like a simple cherry pie, growing slowly, while the population grows too. But the real issue is that it has fewer cherries. And fewer every year. Now it's reached the point where it has no cherries at all, but just cheap cherry jelly. And if it grows too fast, it will burst, and get cherry jelly all over the place. Then there will be plenty of cleaning jobs for unemployed people. And that's the essence of what the economic pie is really all about.
That metaphor really got away from you.
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