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Old 07-13-2017, 11:18 AM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
5,667 posts, read 6,595,121 times
Reputation: 4817

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pub-911 View Post
By that, you mean static and poorly understood populist economics.


It's as simple as addition and subtraction. Rhetoric and belief aren't viable substitutes.

 
Old 07-13-2017, 11:35 AM
 
4,224 posts, read 3,017,738 times
Reputation: 3812
Quote:
Originally Posted by skeddy View Post
there are so few full time workers earning the federal minimum wage it gets way more attention than it deserves. Here's the deal
//unskilled labor = poverty
simple concept
want more money, learn a marketable skill
People do that very thing in droves, and lo and behold, they move on to better jobs. But the demands of their old jobs still exist, and sure as shootin', new people will move in to meet those demands.

How is it so difficult to grasp the fact that the topic is actually the JOBS that define low-wage labor, not the PEOPLE who currently work at minimum-wage jobs
 
Old 07-13-2017, 11:59 AM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
5,667 posts, read 6,595,121 times
Reputation: 4817
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pub-911 View Post
We do not currently have a reliable understanding of how even basic neural networks do what they do.
Good discussion of neural nets and AI here if you are interested: https://www.quora.com/Are-neural-net...e-future-of-AI
 
Old 07-13-2017, 12:20 PM
 
4,224 posts, read 3,017,738 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greywar View Post
We have a pretty good understanding of how neural networks do what they do. In fact you can use a language called tensor flow,and make your own right now. Today.
TensorFlow and TensorBoard are platforms on which machine-learning games of whatever complexity can be played out. They do not allow one to encode and see carried out what one does not yet understand to begin with.
 
Old 07-13-2017, 01:28 PM
 
Location: Raleigh
8,166 posts, read 8,525,471 times
Reputation: 10147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pub-911 View Post
<>How is it so difficult to grasp the fact that the topic is actually the JOBS that define low-wage labor, not the PEOPLE who currently work at minimum-wage jobs
I was thinking about this very part of the labor market today. Many people came here to work in the fields. Once they could communicate in English they could move up to a much better environment and work inside. The women learned this first, probably, and became servants, or worked for a friend who started something like a cleaning service. Then they discovered they could work in a restaurant like a Burger Joint and have a really nice indoor job.
It is sort of, the American way.
But these jobs are not supposed to be the height of a career, like the person celebrated in the poster at MacDonald's. completing 10 years on the job.
 
Old 07-13-2017, 01:52 PM
 
4,224 posts, read 3,017,738 times
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Jobs aren't "supposed" to be done for any particular purpose or by any particular group of people. Low-wage labor is a continuing part of the production functions in many industries. The questions are over how far employers facing no countervailing force in opposition should be able to go in creating slaves and serfs out of those working in such positions.

By the way, minimum wage workers today are nearly as apt to have a spouse living in the home as they are to be teenagers working for spending money. That's not an expression of anyone's intent, it's just how things have come to be.
 
Old 07-13-2017, 03:02 PM
 
7,899 posts, read 7,111,289 times
Reputation: 18603
Quote:
Originally Posted by rruff View Post
I've never lived in a trailer. And I only lived in the desert in winter. And I don't live in a "remote area" now, but rather in a house I own in the middle of a busy town. And I don't drink.

I didn't call it expertise either. I called it thinking for yourself. Remember, I told you what my IQ was? Thinking, and reasoning how complex systems interact isn't difficult for me. I do it for fun.

You don't have to be smart, but you do need the right attitude. You have to want to know the truth more than you want to hang onto any beliefs that interfere with it. And you need to be willing to "not know" for a long time, and willing to change direction as new information comes in.



Oh, I'm sure there are. But how narrow is their view? The few who are tasked with planning holistic long term strategies regarding AI, economics, sociology, and politics, are not reporting those findings to the public.

Sorry, I should have said you lived for years in a camper, not a trailer. Now you live in a "busy town". Really? According to City Data, Ruidoso has a population of under 8000, is close to 400 miles from the nearest city, and has basically no industry, no manufacturing, and no electronics or high tech businesses.


This is how you can believe that others have a "narrow" view. Those would include the people I referred to who are educated, have experience and contacts in industry, manufacturing and computer sciences.


It is a waste of time to discuss anything with you. You don't have a clue. Instead you have a bunch of crazy ideas you concocted sitting out there meditating in the middle of nowhere.
 
Old 07-13-2017, 04:27 PM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
5,667 posts, read 6,595,121 times
Reputation: 4817
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrkliny View Post
This is how you can believe that others have a "narrow" view. Those would include the people I referred to who are educated, have experience and contacts in industry, manufacturing and computer sciences.
I'm educated. If you go back a little farther in history I was an aerospace engineer. Graduated with high honors from one of toughest schools in the country. And the town where I live relies on tourism, and business is booming. Albuquerque and El Paso don't qualify as "cities"?

Your line of inquiry is a great example. You insinuate a lot based on irrelevancies. No interest in the truth.

People who work in any industry have a narrow view. They are very busy focusing on one particular task. They aren't paid to understand how their work will effect the overall economy and society, let alone how the many other disciplines will interact. I certainly didn't have time to wonder about any of this when I was working 60 hrs/wk as an engineer.
 
Old 07-13-2017, 07:53 PM
 
34,053 posts, read 17,064,521 times
Reputation: 17212
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crashj007 View Post
I was thinking about this very part of the labor market today. Many people came here to work in the fields. Once they could communicate in English they could move up to a much better environment and work inside. The women learned this first, probably, and became servants, or worked for a friend who started something like a cleaning service. Then they discovered they could work in a restaurant like a Burger Joint and have a really nice indoor job.
It is sort of, the American way.
But these jobs are not supposed to be the height of a career, like the person celebrated in the poster at MacDonald's. completing 10 years on the job.
Correct.

These are good entry level jobs for non bread winners. It is not the employer's fault when those who should be miles past these jobs take these jobs, nor does it change their Fair Market Value.
 
Old 07-13-2017, 10:01 PM
 
6,326 posts, read 6,590,027 times
Reputation: 7457
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobNJ1960 View Post
Correct.

These are good entry level jobs for non bread winners. It is not the employer's fault when those who should be miles past these jobs take these jobs, nor does it change their Fair Market Value.
And what sacred scrolls of Economics say that exactly? Or you just made up that job ranking? Do you realize how arbitrary it is?
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