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Old 11-30-2017, 09:45 PM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
5,667 posts, read 6,590,852 times
Reputation: 4817

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
Well maybe, I don't know. Robots are good at certain things, but in some things human workers can't be replaced. Did you ever have an intelligent conversation with a phone answering robot?

And machines will never be creative. The only jobs that machines can take over are very low-skill.
I suggest you read the link. There will be no havens. Current AI is below rodent level, but improving rapidly. Billions of $$$ are being invested because hardware is finally getting there. Within a few decades human level processing should be possible for a reasonable cost.

 
Old 12-01-2017, 01:02 AM
 
6,438 posts, read 6,913,630 times
Reputation: 8743
Quote:
Originally Posted by rruff View Post
1790: The mechanical loom will change everything. Weavers will never work again.

1844: The telegraph will change everything. What will all the Pony Express riders do?

1900: The car will change everything. What will we do with 60 million unemployed horses? Oh, and their drivers too. They will never work again.

1960: Computers will change everything. They will do all the work and we will have so much leisure time we won't know what to do with it.

Hmmm.
 
Old 12-01-2017, 04:40 AM
 
8,227 posts, read 3,414,544 times
Reputation: 6091
Quote:
Originally Posted by rruff View Post
I suggest you read the link. There will be no havens. Current AI is below rodent level, but improving rapidly. Billions of $$$ are being invested because hardware is finally getting there. Within a few decades human level processing should be possible for a reasonable cost.
They are just saying that, they can say anything. It is not possible to create an intelligent computer. They are good at certain kinds of tasks.

At this point, everyone's opinion is just a guess, no one can prove anything.
 
Old 12-01-2017, 07:05 AM
 
Location: Prepperland
19,013 posts, read 14,188,739 times
Reputation: 16727
If prosperity is not based on the volume and value of money tokens, nor who owns them, but based upon prodigious production, equitable trade of surplus usable goods and services, then why aren’t we all “rich” in terms of access to goods and services?

The aberration of money madness leads one to assume that automation and mass production eliminates jobs, since it takes less human labor and thus less money to produce them.

But why throttle trade with the limitation of a scarce money token?
• There is unmet need.
• There is unemployment.
• There is an abundance of unused retail and factory resources.

Why can’t those in need, unemployed, and willing to work, trade their labor for what they need?
The usual excuse is “No one has enough money!”

• Who is rationing the money?
• Who is stopping the engine of prosperity?
• Who is getting rich and powerful while not equitably trading any real goods or services?

When you figure that out, you’ll realize that “redistribution of wealth / money” has no real effect on building prosperity nor does it eliminate poverty. And that means socialism (collectivism) is wholly at odds with the reality of prosperity.

You cannot be generous to those in need, when you have no surplus to give. And when you cripple the productive capability of civilization with the burdens of parasites and predators, you can never achieve the surpluses necessary for charitable giving to the aged, infirm and incapacitated.
 
Old 12-01-2017, 09:01 AM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
5,667 posts, read 6,590,852 times
Reputation: 4817
Quote:
Originally Posted by jetgraphics View Post
Why can’t those in need, unemployed, and willing to work, trade their labor for what they need? The usual excuse is “No one has enough money!”
That's an odd interpretation.

Consumer capitalism only works (long term) if workers share equally in productivity gains. They need to be able to afford to consume what is produced. Escalating debt and financial "wizardry" can only be stretched so far.

Unfortunately there is no mechanism in capitalism that raises workers incomes, except for those with exceptional talents. Which is why labor unions, high taxes, social benefits, professional associations, etc have been used to effect a redistribution of wealth. This has been true in every developed country.

Around 1980 the US and some other developed countries suddenly changed tactics. Oligarchs used global trade, debt, and finance to greatly reduce their dependence on consumer income. Median wages have been nearly flat for 40 years, after tripling in the prior 40. The rich are taking pretty much all the economic gains.

The "investor class" has oodles of $$$. They aren't investing in production (jobs) because consumption/demand is weak. Consumers are poor. The fix for this is simple. The oligarchs simply don't want it to occur. They made it this way for a reason.

The globalization/finance/debt escalation game will continue until AI is advanced enough to phase out consumer-capitalism entirely.
 
Old 12-01-2017, 09:03 AM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
5,667 posts, read 6,590,852 times
Reputation: 4817
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Siegel View Post
Hmmm.
I suggest you read a bit more. It should be obvious why none of those situations is relevant to what is happening now.
 
Old 12-01-2017, 11:11 AM
 
698 posts, read 567,488 times
Reputation: 864
It's not obvious at all. They are all just futuristic over-claims, no different from the ones that some make today.
 
Old 12-01-2017, 11:31 AM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
5,667 posts, read 6,590,852 times
Reputation: 4817
Quote:
Originally Posted by VendorDude View Post
It's not obvious at all. They are all just futuristic over-claims, no different from the ones that some make today.
Strawman. Dismissal without study or argument is just a plea to ignorance. Or sticking your head in the sand.
 
Old 12-01-2017, 11:42 AM
 
698 posts, read 567,488 times
Reputation: 864
There is nothing at all obvious in your persistent predictions for impacts from AI. Those are just as unfounded as the others that were noted above. You have no special knowledge and no special frame of reference. You are just babbling on and on for no reason about a pet theory of yours. Pretty much what PermaBear does.
 
Old 12-01-2017, 11:48 AM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
5,667 posts, read 6,590,852 times
Reputation: 4817
Still, no argument, no study. Not even the tiniest attempt at rational discourse!

And you accuse me of babbling?
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