Now fix the welfare system (deduction, mortgage, interest, property tax)
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... We understand that if you study conservative economics theories you'll end up believing that 'trickle down economics' works...
One other point. Please note "Trickle Down Economics" doesn't have anything to do with economics. It is a pejorative term coined by humorist Will Rogers back in the 1930s. It is a great sound bite, but isn't real economic theory. You won't find a university course called "Economics 227: Trickle Down Economics." You won't find an endowed chair in the economics department labeled, for example, "The Goldman Sachs Distinguished Service Professor of Trickle Down Economics." You won't find an elected representative who espouses "Trickle Down Economics" as a policy.
Why? Because it doesn't exist. It is really just a straw man. Sort of like "Welfare Queens." It makes for great sound bites, but that's about it.
There are more than 28 million small businesses in the US. Most by far have hired no employees at all and exist only to create favorable tax and legal situations for their owners.
I have a small business that supports my household. I have hired no employees because I don't need to. The small business owners I know in my field run legitimate businesses.
We're not rich. We get by comfortably. And we do pay taxes in spite of people constantly telling us we're in an income bracket that doesn't since we're not rich.
as they should ! you better believe if i make an investment in a property that i care about what goes on and what is approved or not in that area . renters may live in an area but they have little or no skin in the game .
if an area becomes undesirable and over crowded and values fall it may even be a positive for a renter. rents can fall as an area deteriorates . we saw that in monroe county in the pocono's as it saturated . real estate taxes soared because of all the additional infrastructure needed to support the growth and over crowding . homeowners took a beating .
So you believe it is ok to let Government get in the way to protect and inflate the value of your investments at the expense of other people, and then I bet you also want the government out of the way when it comes to what people are paid and then wonder why no one can afford housing.
Renters generally don't have ties to the community. Here's a hint: Renters dont pay Property Taxes. Municipalities listen to those whose names are on deeds.
Renters are just passing through. Show me an apartment complex where the tenants are there more than a couple of years.
Budgets can't be shaped by those here today and gone tomorrow.
BTW, I was once a drifter.
So the owners and landlords do not pass the taxes onto renters and take it out of their on wallets?
A renter in this case has it worse.
They foot the whole bill while the landlord has no skin in the game and holds all the power.
This problem could quite easily be resolved by first capping physician's salaries. Next, severe restrictions need to be placed upon the cost of both drug research and drug retail costs.
Drug research expense guidelines and retail costs should be solely based upon degree of required demand of the population.
In a sense they're already capped in that Medicaid, Medicare, and insurance have caps on what they will pay for a particular service. So they basically mark-down their prices.
I may have left you with the incorrect impression that all normative economics is liberal. Just to be clear, conservative economists who posit a "what ought to be" of less regulation and more free markets are also expressing their value judgments. Their statements are also considered part of "normative economics."...
It wasn't you, I assumed normative economics was a liberal theory due to its description. I've never heard a conservative claim that this or that profession should be paid this or that. If you have a link to a post from a conservative on CD saying anything similar to this example, I'd like read it;
...Yes, a wealthy person might have a 401K, but that wealthy person is subject to the same restrictions on contributions as regular people...
I agree, the major shareholders are the pension plans. I was just making the point that that the "top holders" are anything but "regular people".
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Originally Posted by SportyandMisty
Yes indeed. Actually, I think most economists find major flaws with BOTH parties economic policies. I know I do...
True, economics is a nebulous 'science'.
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Originally Posted by SportyandMisty
...I'm not a climate scientist. I don't have an opinion on global warming. But I *do* have an opinion about incentives regarding global warming. Governments do not have an incentive to actually, you know, solve the problem. Governments -- government employees -- have an incentive for problems to go on in perpetuity because that assures those government employees jobs. We've had a "War on Poverty" and a "War on Drugs" for half a century or more, with zero progress -- but that war has kept countless civil servants on the government payroll. If we were to win the war, there would be no reason for those bureaucrats, so those bureaucrats seek to treat the problem rather than solve the problem...
Interesting ideas on 'global warming', but we now know we're dealing with global climate change which increases the severity of droughts, but also increases the intensity of storms including tropical cyclones...
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Originally Posted by SportyandMisty
One other point. Please note "Trickle Down Economics" doesn't have anything to do with economics. It is a pejorative term coined by humorist Will Rogers back in the 1930s. It is a great sound bite, but isn't real economic theory. You won't find a university course called "Economics 227: Trickle Down Economics." You won't find an endowed chair in the economics department labeled, for example, "The Goldman Sachs Distinguished Service Professor of Trickle Down Economics." You won't find an elected representative who espouses "Trickle Down Economics" as a policy...
...It is all about incentives, and our government does not have an incentive to solve the problem. They like they idea of a Carbon Tax because it treats a problem rather than solves a problem...
Why? Because it doesn't exist. It is really just a straw man. Sort of like "Welfare Queens." It makes for great sound bites, but that's about it.
Regarding government incentives, this is what I believe is widest gulf between the two major parties. I think its due to most conservatives negative and pessimist view of human nature. The everyman for himself, screw the other guy, view of the world. If you believe that government employees have no incentive to help or solve our problems, it's understandable why they would view them with contempt.
Thankfully, liberals view our government employees, our society and how to run it much differently.
Regarding 'Trickle Down Economics', conservatives may consider it a pejorative term, but it's just another term for how conservatives would like to run our country, they call it, 'supply-side economic policies'. Trump's recent tax give away is a great example. It's based on giving the wealthy and our corporations huge tax cuts, relaying on its beneficial effect to eventually help 'regular people'. Or to put it another way, hoping its benefits eventually, 'trickle down' to regular people.
Maybe when Republicans stop calling the Democratic Party the Democrat Party or using the term welfare queens, Democrats will respond in kind. You first...
So the owners and landlords do not pass the taxes onto renters and take it out of their on wallets?
A renter in this case has it worse.
They foot the whole bill while the landlord has no skin in the game and holds all the power.
Well, yes and no. It depends on the local market.
IF it is a "landlord's market" where there is a severe housing shortage, then yes, landlords are indeed able to pass along taxes to the renters. Examples include San Francisco and Silicon Valley and Park City UT.
IF it is a "tenant's market" where there are lots of available rentals that sit empty for a long time, then landlords cannot pass along taxes to the renters. Examples might include an exurb or rural mid-sized town where industry has left. Or perhaps a major city that has fallen on hard times such as Detroit.
It is based on the "price elasticity of demand" and the "price elasticity of supply." See post #351 for details.
Last edited by SportyandMisty; 01-06-2018 at 01:37 PM..
Here's a minor piece of trivia: Famous Nobel Prize winning physicist Max Planck https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Max_Planck at an early age was interested in studying Economics, but supposedly found it too confusing and decided to study Physics instead.
Physicists and engineers tend to deal well with absolutes. Economics gets into human behavior and other inexact sciences...it's not a surprising switch for certain personality types.
In a sense they're already capped in that Medicaid, Medicare, and insurance have caps on what they will pay for a particular service. So they basically mark-down their prices.
And those prices are still INSAINLY HIGH!!!
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