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Old 04-09-2008, 09:27 PM
 
Location: America
6,993 posts, read 16,068,339 times
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Great read

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Old 04-09-2008, 09:31 PM
 
Location: Wouldn't you like to know?
9,115 posts, read 16,267,675 times
Reputation: 3705
Funny how this article says nothing of the materialistic habits of americans today. That is the biggest problem. Many people are overloaded w/unnecessary debt.


Money burns a hole in people's pockets for a majority of americans.
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Old 04-10-2008, 06:12 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles Area
3,306 posts, read 3,665,045 times
Reputation: 592
These class warfare pieces are getting a bit old. Looking at the median family income in this case doesn't exactly say much. It doesn't track what happens to individual families incomes and the data is consistent with say 45% of Americans making double in the boom. That would hardly imply people didn't fell it. The author seems to think its significant because it hasn't happened before, pretty silly.

I wish articles like this would use data that is actually useful in drawing the sorts of conclusions they want. Then again, if they looked at this data many of their conclusions would not follow.
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Old 04-10-2008, 06:24 AM
 
Location: Sitting on a bar stool. Guinness in hand.
4,429 posts, read 5,958,134 times
Reputation: 1713
Default Opinion

Quote:
Real median family income more than doubled from the late 1940s to the late ’70s. It has risen less than 25 percent in the three decades since. Statistics like these are now so familiar as to be almost numbing. But the larger point is still crucial: the modern American economy distributes the fruits of its growth to a relatively narrow slice of the population. We don’t need another decade of evidence to feel confident about that conclusion.
Well let take a close look at history here. Why was America kicking A$$ from the late 1940's until the 1970's? Well a big factor was that the U.S. was basically the only industrialized nation not to be touched physically by WWII. Europe and Japan were basically devastated for the next 20 - 30 years. China was in the throws of a communist revolution, Russia communisms just did cut the mustard when it came to production and output. Basically We were the only guys on the block that could produce the items everyone needed. Now with being the only game in town means that the U.S. companies that made the goods needed American workers to make those goods. And those American workers had the leverage to ask for good wages for there labor (mostly represented by labor unions). But since the 1970's until now Europe and Japan have been rebuilt, Russia and china are become Quasi-capitalist nations, and India has educated it population and has become a player on the world stage. Some of these countries now are producing good that we use to make at a cheaper rate and the U.S. and other countries multi-corporations are moving production away from the expensive U.S. worker to the cheap labor (mostly china). As consequence of this those once needed American worker have lost their leverage (and their unions) to allow for those high wages. This is why I believe that we (most Americans) are losing ground in our income. Granted Coupon Jack is correct in that American can't save a dime. We have gotten to use to getting what we want NOW.

Quote:
Now, though, we appear to be out of bubbles.
Ummmm........ he missed the Commodity bubble in Oil, Gold, Wheat, Rice, and Corn we are having right now.

Quote:
Fortunately, there is an obvious model waiting to be dusted off. The income gains of the postwar period didn’t just happen. They were the product of a deliberate program to build up the middle class, through the Interstate highway system, the G. I. Bill and other measures.

It’s easy enough to imagine a new version of that program, with job-creating investments in biomedical research, alternative energy, roads, railroads and education. On the campaign trail, Hillary Clinton, John McCain and Barack Obama all mention ideas like these.
It the right concept.......But.......I not putting faith in the next president or next Congress or any Corporations to put these plans into action. Basically folk we are on our own. We have to make it happen either by forcing our government to implement some of the "work programs" and we that are small business owner/Entrepreneur need to make the industries and products of the future.
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Old 04-10-2008, 06:48 AM
 
1,009 posts, read 2,079,462 times
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I love hearing that we are "on our own." It makes the future seem so... Exciting. A new age of prosperity? Armageddon? Who can say. Sounds like fertile ground.
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Old 04-10-2008, 08:02 AM
 
Location: America
6,993 posts, read 16,068,339 times
Reputation: 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by baystater View Post
Well let take a close look at history here. Why was America kicking A$$ from the late 1940's until the 1970's? Well a big factor was that the U.S. was basically the only industrialized nation not to be touched physically by WWII. Europe and Japan were basically devastated for the next 20 - 30 years. China was in the throws of a communist revolution, Russia communisms just did cut the mustard when it came to production and output. Basically We were the only guys on the block that could produce the items everyone needed. Now with being the only game in town means that the U.S. companies that made the goods needed American workers to make those goods. And those American workers had the leverage to ask for good wages for there labor (mostly represented by labor unions). But since the 1970's until now Europe and Japan have been rebuilt, Russia and china are become Quasi-capitalist nations, and India has educated it population and has become a player on the world stage. Some of these countries now are producing good that we use to make at a cheaper rate and the U.S. and other countries multi-corporations are moving production away from the expensive U.S. worker to the cheap labor (mostly china). As consequence of this those once needed American worker have lost their leverage (and their unions) to allow for those high wages. This is why I believe that we (most Americans) are losing ground in our income. Granted Coupon Jack is correct in that American can't save a dime. We have gotten to use to getting what we want NOW.



Ummmm........ he missed the Commodity bubble in Oil, Gold, Wheat, Rice, and Corn we are having right now.



It the right concept.......But.......I not putting faith in the next president or next Congress or any Corporations to put these plans into action. Basically folk we are on our own. We have to make it happen either by forcing our government to implement some of the "work programs" and we that are small business owner/Entrepreneur need to make the industries and products of the future.
Good post. I agree that we have to force our politicians to step up to the plate. I think heavy, heavy, heavy investment in infrastructure is whats needed. As has been stated previously, extensive mass transit systems in metro areas, fast rail commuter trains between metro areas and fast rail freight trains would put a lot of people to work. Investment in pebble bed nuclear plants. Also roads, but i am not so concerned with that as much. Also I say heavy investment in renewable fuels but not bio fuels, I find those repugnant. Only thing I don't 100% agree with is the Oil prices necessarily being 100% driven by speculative bubble. I believe most of it is peak oil
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Old 04-10-2008, 08:15 AM
 
Location: Atlanta
738 posts, read 699,706 times
Reputation: 279
All I had to do was place my mouse over the link to see that I wouldn't believe it - it came from the New York Times, the bastion of east-coast liberalism.
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Old 04-10-2008, 09:08 AM
 
Location: America
6,993 posts, read 16,068,339 times
Reputation: 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckhead_Broker View Post
All I had to do was place my mouse over the link to see that I wouldn't believe it - it came from the New York Times, the bastion of east-coast liberalism.
extremely intelligent observation and comment!
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Old 04-10-2008, 10:33 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,068 posts, read 77,001,116 times
Reputation: 27653
That commodity bubble may not be a bubble..we are low on inventories.

Are Rising Commodity Prices a Sign of a Bubble or Demand

From that article:
*** Russia's Agriculture ministry has slapped tariffs on mineral fertilisers containing nitrogen, phosphorous, and potassium. The tariffs are designed to make more fertiliser available local grain growers in the face of high global grain prices.


*** China's government raised spending on agriculture by 36% over last year in an effort to curb politically destabilising rising food prices. The government raised wheat and rice prices by ten percent to encourage local production and prevent hoarding. China's Premier Wen Jiabao called agriculture the "priority of priorities."


*** Indian rice traders have begun hoarding rice from sale, banking on much higher prices. "Rice prices are likely to increase...with major rice exporters Vietnam and India yesterday confirming that they will curb overseas sales in an effort to combat food inflation," according to arabnews.com


*** And from today's Herald Sun, "Global food prices, based on United Nations records, rose 35 per cent in the year to the end of January, markedly accelerating an upturn that began, gently at first, in 2002. Since then, prices have risen 65 per cent. In 2007 alone, according to the UN Food and Agriculture Organization's world food index, dairy prices rose nearly 80 per cent and grain 42 per cent."
When countries start imposing export tariffs on key commodities, it has two consequences. First, prices rise as the global tradability of the commodity declines. Second, it highlights the essential physical nature of key commodities: you either have them or you don't. If you don't have enough of them, you limit their export abroad.
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Old 04-10-2008, 09:07 PM
 
Location: San Diego California
6,797 posts, read 6,653,283 times
Reputation: 5180
Good article but I don't see things in the US getting any better. The last boom was a pyramid scheme based on falsly inflated real estate values and borrowed money. By the time we get throught this ressesion the amount of wealth loss for the American public will be devestating. I do not see how recovery to anything close to our former level is possible due to the fact that we have dissasembled our indusrial base (the basis of real wealth) and exported it. People talk about investing in High Tech but to be honest we do not have enough intellegent people for that to work. Our ecucational system is a joke. The truth is when it comes to competing in the world market we are going to get our butts kicked. At least until we get our heads on straight.
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