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Old 12-15-2019, 10:18 AM
 
57 posts, read 14,524 times
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I don't see a problem with "McJobs." I hate that phrase because it demeans the people who work whatever jobs you deem "McJobs." A more relevant topic would be why minimum qualifications for a lot of these jobs have become so stringent. For example, you do not need a 4 year degree to be a store manager at Target or Walmart; an associate's degree is sufficient. In college I worked up to asst. manager of a retail store at the mall and it is a job that can be done by any competent person with a 2 year degree or some training in basic accounting/bookeeping. I currently have an advanced degree because it's actually needed in my work but, if i want to get to the top level, the jobs all require a doctorate which ridiculous because a master's with 10 or more years of experience is sufficient. It eliminates a lot of great candidates. I am not paying for (in money or time) an unnecessary degree. I will just stay at my level and invest my money instead.
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Old 12-15-2019, 10:53 AM
 
Location: Chandler, AZ
2,717 posts, read 1,378,536 times
Reputation: 6467
Quote:
Originally Posted by OtterTrees View Post
I don't see a problem with "McJobs." I hate that phrase because it demeans the people who work whatever jobs you deem "McJobs." A more relevant topic would be why minimum qualifications for a lot of these jobs have become so stringent. For example, you do not need a 4 year degree to be a store manager at Target or Walmart; an associate's degree is sufficient.
What qualifies you to determine what these jobs "need"? Why a two-year degree? Why any degree? Why not a Masters?

The owners of those stores have, apparently / according to you, determined that they want a four-year degree for store managers, and they also apparently have no problem finding enough people who fit their requirements and who will accept and keep the jobs as well as perform adequately.

You're certainly free to open a competing store and set whatever requirements you believe are appropriate. But neither you nor anyone else has any business dictating to them what they do to operate their businesses.
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Old 12-15-2019, 03:59 PM
 
Location: Silicon Valley
4,075 posts, read 1,858,657 times
Reputation: 6831
Quote:
Originally Posted by pittsflyer View Post
Sweet that will employ electrical engineers and technicians. when the rubber meets the road these sleazy business owners won't pony up for the automation. The automation has been available for years now and these crap bags just are too greedy to pay.

So I say bring it on if you can provide a fully automated restaurant that would be awesome. This is the same tired argument worthless business owners with tired sad business models have been bringing up for years.

I am a big-time CNC guy and I am all about automation ... so do it, oh wait electrical engineers wont pander to your sorry a$$ they would rather see you fold up shop and starve because of your a crap bag human being who is not really a business owner but a charlatan.

I want to see municipalities start ferriting these people out and ensuring they end up loosing thier busniness and having their assets seiezed in total in forclosure and bankruptcy including their personal assets and even tried for human rights violations.
You're kidding right? McDonalds has already cut over half of their worldwide workforce as their automation capital is deployed. The rate at which their franchisees deploy has differed, but it didn't take long here locally for $15/hour to be introduced and suddenly the kiosks for in-house were there for ordering, the lobby hours were cut and the drive-through expanded.

Everyone sees what's happening....
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Old 12-15-2019, 04:49 PM
 
4,934 posts, read 3,013,803 times
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In my area, some labor laws apply to larger businesses but not smaller ones, either permanently or in how quickly new laws are applied. For example paternal leave and the timing of increased minimum wages. A McDonalds (including franchises) has a tougher job than a company with a few stores. This has definitely helped the local stores.

That's good for a bunch of reasons. One is that it's helpful to have a lot of business owners, particularly ones who aren't beholden to a mothership. Another is that the staff will often get creative input at a small company. When I was a cook (long ago) I could make up specials and order random supplies despite not being a manager.
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Old 12-15-2019, 09:05 PM
 
11,575 posts, read 9,068,854 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pittsflyer View Post
This is the crux of the issue, I dont believe that 60% of the american people are derilict and retarded and deserve a wage less than $20/hr. Yes I believe that there is a 5% subset of usless people that deserve less than $20/hr but I think greedy business are a MUCH larger threat to communities who are exploiting people who have few options.
If you believe this, why not advocate for a higher federal minimum wage?

By the way, people go into business to make money...for the owners. Very few businesses are opened as benevolent enterprises for the hired staff. If business "greed" didn't exist, there would be no incentive to open the business in the first place.
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Old 12-15-2019, 11:44 PM
 
7,657 posts, read 3,367,239 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheerbliss View Post
Or the buildings stay boarded up because restaurant workers have to be paid more than twice the previously going rate.



Citation?
Cities can pass blight laws and make the fines unbearable to obtuse owners. It’s starting to happen now and while the fines are sickeningly low it would not take much to amp up the fines do get the desired behavior.
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Old 12-15-2019, 11:48 PM
 
7,657 posts, read 3,367,239 times
Reputation: 4889
Quote:
Originally Posted by lieqiang View Post
False equivalency. A position that pays less than $20/hour isn't implying someone is "derillict and retarded" (irony) it just means that position is easy to fill and requires little training or skills.


You're greatly underestimating how much employees (even minimum wage ones) cost. I can assure you that as soon as the cost of automation looked better than hiring someone and was considered acceptable to customers a business will make that investment if they have the capital or credit to do so. Just look at the level of automation that already exists in a typical fast food kitchen.
I have not seen any significant automation in the sorts of fields you speak of. The automation tech exists he owners are just to cheap to buy it, but there is never any shortage of arrogant beligerant behavior on the part of the employer to try to get munis to stand down on min wage laws and other laws that don’t make the owner richer.

Yet not surprisingly it’s very rare for these types of employers to go out and truely automate their shop, they might buy a better mixer or some other appliance and pass it off as automation but it’s not.
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Old 12-15-2019, 11:50 PM
 
7,657 posts, read 3,367,239 times
Reputation: 4889
[quote=sheerbliss;56864704]
Quote:
Originally Posted by HJ99 View Post

According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, 21% of minimum-wage jobs are filled by teenagers. Almost half are filled by people 16 to 24. https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/min...ome.htm#table1

I agree that too many jobs have ridiculous requirements and some employers are abusing the H1B system. But well paying blue collar jobs are going begging for lack of skilled workers. When I lived in Denver, my mechanic had a one-month wait list, it took ten phone calls to find someone to fix my roof, and my mother couldn't find anyone to fix her power wheelchair. Mike Rowe says it's getting harder and harder to give away scholarships training people for blue collar work. https://www.mikeroweworks.org

You think that any job that doesn't pay enough for rent on an apartment doesn't need to be done? Even if it can be done by a mom, a student or retiree who only wants to work part-time? Even if it's a full-time job, yes, floors need to be mopped, dishes need to be washed, garbage needs to be collected, buses need to be driven, packages need to be delivered, patients need to be bathed, lawns need to be mowed, and burgers need to be flipped.
Because real estate in Denver is over priced so no new enterants can go there and actually make money.
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Old 12-15-2019, 11:55 PM
 
7,657 posts, read 3,367,239 times
Reputation: 4889
Quote:
Originally Posted by lieqiang View Post
There is no complex test to verify if someone is a business owner. Do they own a business? If yes, then they are indeed a business owner and don't need to try to pass themselves off as such since paying a wage some resentful guy on the internet thinks is appropriate isn't a requirement.

Interesting the dramatic "sell out their fellow man" comment, do you not patronize any businesses that pay less than minimum wage? Do you not buy any products that were assembled by workers making less than $20/hour? Open up whatever device you're typing this on, where do the parts come from? What about the clothes you're wearing? Were the veggies in your fridge picked by someone named Juan who worked in the sun for $9/hour to pick so you could buy them cheaply?
Yep, that’s because computers made in the USA no longer exist because they were ran out of business. The person that employs Juan gets away with it becayse immigration has not been enforced in decades

Most people are evil and will sell out their fellow countryman so the only way any of this works is for govt to hold the boundaries in place that everyone must play by.

Because if your the lone guy trying to buy american made lap top it will be impossible or prohibitively expensive.
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Old 12-16-2019, 12:01 AM
 
7,657 posts, read 3,367,239 times
Reputation: 4889
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thatsright19 View Post
Pay them more, how? Raise prices? Raise prices...and wow...what do you know...the people at the bottom of the economic ladder are still struggling to buy things with their “higher pay”. additionally, businesses can’t just raise prices without losing market share, or they may not be in a position at all to do so relative to their suppliers. So basically, your idea would force companies to slash staff and become more efficient or automated. Then you find out that the true minimum wage is zero.

You have no idea how business works. You have no idea how value is created. You have no idea what the difference between demanding a salary and commanding one is.

If an adult hasn’t moved up and progressed after 5, 10, 15 years, that’s on them. If they’re being passed over for promotions by part time teens, don’t you think they may share some of the blame, if not all?
Don’t have an uninspiring crappy buisness model that requires the creativity of a knat?
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