U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 02-12-2020, 02:09 PM
 
619 posts, read 106,447 times
Reputation: 929

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by travis t View Post
By 'poor minimum' I assume you mean low minimum wage.

The minimum wage as currently implemented in the US declares a fiat level under which wage rates become illegal. You can't help low wage workers just by declaring such a fiat. To actually help them you would provide subsidies, as is done with agricultural prices supports. Generally you don't get something for nothing. The fiat minimum wage is a something-for-nothing scheme..

Denmark and Sweden have NO minimum wage. But they also have heavy unionization, so that workers have professional negotiators in their corner to negotiate a reasonable wage for them.

Thats great, so the right wing is going to encourage unionization of low end jobs now? After tearing unions down for decades? Unions really arent effective at this point in history. Death by thousand cuts of Republican laws and regulations.


Hey be nice if country was run for the benefit of the WHOLE country and not just the billionaires. But you know, what you gonna do.


As to subsidies, are the low end employers going to pay those subsidies, you know the ones that profit from low wages... Or are we all going to pay through higher taxes? Why should I subsidize McD and Walmart? Let them pay living wages and I will then decide if I want to pay what they are asking for their product/service. Its their job to have a business plan that doesnt require govt subsidies to make it work.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 02-12-2020, 04:03 PM
 
3,977 posts, read 2,542,279 times
Reputation: 3071
Quote:
Originally Posted by GreggT View Post
Maybe in your area but certainly that is not the norm!
Please elaborate.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-12-2020, 04:19 PM
 
3,977 posts, read 2,542,279 times
Reputation: 3071
Quote:
Originally Posted by HJ99 View Post
For sure even China uses some automation, but the jobs that still do exist, exist THERE, NOT HERE. Here the only low end jobs are McD jobs that pay diddly and dont usually give regular 40hr work week. Nor cooperate with scheduling for employee's need for second or third McD job to make a living. This with rents rising exponentially as the greedy decided we need another bubble in economy.... Rule of thumb, house of stacked cards is prone to collapse. So is an economy built of stacked cards. We have an economy dedicated to wealthy skimming off the cream and sending the skim milk over seas.
You keep alluding to the US economy as it was years ago. Economies evolve over time, that is just part of reality. The US service based exports are still increasing. It’s certainly not a perfect process. Government, businesses and citizens need to work together to solve all sorts of problems stemming from the inefficiencies involved in this transition.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-12-2020, 04:20 PM
 
3,977 posts, read 2,542,279 times
Reputation: 3071
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mircea View Post
I'll tell you why:





Don't expect him to ever post a single shred of evidence to support any of his ridiculous claims.


On a thread on GDP, he couldn't even find the US government website that provides GDP data.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-12-2020, 04:32 PM
 
1,333 posts, read 631,898 times
Reputation: 1514
Quote:
Originally Posted by Supposn View Post
Minimum wage rate does not increase the rate of unemployment.
Minimum wage rate does not increase the unemployment rate of unskilled workers.

(Minimum wage rate’s relative to the rate of unemployment):
Reduced purchasing power, (i.e. the “real value”) of the minimum wage enables commercial performance of tasks that previously did not justify the costs of minimum rate wages; paradoxically, it doesn’t reduce the rate of unemployment.
Minimum’s lesser purchasing power provides employment for those who previously couldn’t obtain employment among jobs that justified paying at least the “real” current value of the minimum rate. There are always some that cannot perform in a manner that would justify the minimum wage rate.
When we permit reduction of the minimum wage rate’s purchasing power:
(1) More jobs than otherwise may be created at pay scales of lesser purchasing powers; also, due to employers’ wage differential practices, purchasing powers of other wage rates are also to some extents reduced).
(2) Lesser desirable or able workers are enabled to join the pool of employees and applicants.
(3) Lower rate workers and applicant pool sizes increase, but they exceed the numbers of additional lower rate jobs created.
(4) Unemployment rates for lower rate workers are not reduced.
(5) Additional products and services that previously did not justify the cost of the minimum wage rate and do not justify wages losses of purchasing powers effects upon the nation’s GDP.

Respectfully, Supposn
The rain in Spain falls mainly on the plain.

Respectfully, SuiteLiving
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-12-2020, 04:38 PM
 
6,239 posts, read 2,788,354 times
Reputation: 18962
I'm not sure where the OP gets his or her thesis, but the jury is most certainly out on the subject. For every study that claims increasing minimum wage does not cause unemployment, there are others that claim the opposite:


https://mises.org/library/yes-minimu...e-unemployment


https://www.forbes.com/sites/adammil.../#4a3c10e31e7d


https://www.epionline.org/oped/o76/


In truth, if you want a surefire way to raise wages in this country, then you have to create scarcity of labor. With lower corporate taxes, we've seen strong job creation, which in turn has meant stronger wage hikes.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-12-2020, 04:55 PM
 
1,513 posts, read 784,087 times
Reputation: 396
Quote:
Originally Posted by travis t View Post
By 'poor minimum' I assume you mean low minimum wage.

The minimum wage as currently implemented in the US declares a fiat level under which wage rates become illegal. You can't help low wage workers just by declaring such a fiat. To actually help them you would provide subsidies, as is done with agricultural prices supports. Generally you don't get something for nothing. The fiat minimum wage is a something-for-nothing scheme..

Denmark and Sweden have NO minimum wage. But they also have heavy unionization, so that workers have professional negotiators in their corner to negotiate a reasonable wage for them.
Travis T, I do consider inadequate purchasing power as to be “poor” wages. To the extent of its purchasing power, the federal minimum wage rate does reduce poverty among USA’s employees and their dependents. That’s of “help” to USA’s employees and to our entire economy.

Our government could do a great deal more to improve our economy.
(Other than those on public assistance), our population segment earning the least incomes are (statistically) entirely composed of employees, or retired employees, or their dependents.

Those of lesser incomes would gain more (in proportional to their incomes), from any general improvement of our economy.
But the actual dollar values of such benefits would of course be gained in proportion to their incomes; (i.e. those who of greater incomes, greater gain from any of our general economic improvements).

I suppose EVERY major industrial nation have somethings performing our federal minimum wage rate’s purpose. If that were not the cases, occurrences of our median wage rates’ purchasing powers drastically plunging would not be unusual among all our major national economies. USA’s minimum wage rates our enforced and managed by our federal and additionally by our state and local governments. Such things in all major economies are enforce and manages by their governments and/or quasi-government organizations. Labor organizations influence and power in many major industrial nations exceed those in the USA.
Respectfully, Supposn
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-12-2020, 11:00 PM
 
Location: Las Vegas & San Diego
1,354 posts, read 244,013 times
Reputation: 1239
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddm2k View Post
It seems like movements such as "teach kids to code" are trying to make sure this never happens.
Really?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-13-2020, 12:27 AM
 
7,617 posts, read 7,097,221 times
Reputation: 3538
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwynedd1 View Post
That wages have nothing to do with real estate valuations would be where in the article?
These days even high-paid tech workers — the very people often blamed for driving up home prices — have to stretch to buy a house, according to a study by Los Angeles real estate start-up Open Listings.

Do you think minimum wages have anything to do with other wages? Do you think that people will be happy to work close to the minimum wage for greater hazards, responsibilities and expense to maintain their employable status? I'll sell T-shirt on the beach for 300k a year rather than waste my time and expense in medical school. How about you?




The solution will be to increase other wages.
Where in the article does it state that MW increases has anything to do with RE valuations?

Whether or not the solution to Bay Area housing is to increase the other wages has nothing to do with MW increases. Finding a "solution" to the Bay Area housing crisis has nothing to do with MW increases.

Why does there even need to be a solution to it? Its the price. This is free market with some regulations.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-13-2020, 10:14 AM
 
17,919 posts, read 16,084,250 times
Reputation: 6540
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ Brazen_3133 View Post
Where in the article does it state that MW increases has anything to do with RE valuations?

Whether or not the solution to Bay Area housing is to increase the other wages has nothing to do with MW increases. Finding a "solution" to the Bay Area housing crisis has nothing to do with MW increases.

Why does there even need to be a solution to it? Its the price. This is free market with some regulations.



If you don't know that people are willing to pay more for a house when their wages increase I may as well debate with one of my pets.





Stock Report| | NYSE Symbol: February 08, 2020MAA| is in the S&P 500MAAMid-America Apartment Communities, Inc.
New job growth and higher wages are important measures to rising rental revenue, but rate increases have subsided in 2018. Affordability may also be an issue with new Class A roperties in coastal markets that ask high rental rates. In the Sunbelt markets, we see more stability in Class B properties that are older apartment complexes with fewer amenities then the high-priced Class A new apartments in urban markets.

Last edited by gwynedd1; 02-13-2020 at 10:24 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2020, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top