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Old 04-18-2020, 10:00 PM
 
100 posts, read 78,262 times
Reputation: 330

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oklazona Bound View Post
I get what you are saying but that is just a way to create fear and mislead people. What really tells you what is going on is how many new cases. The way CNN is doing just means it takes a while to recover. If cancer was calculated that way you could have a big drop in new cancer cases but because treatment takes years in some cases the overall case could would be still rising. Which has little to do with successfully fighting cancer. The length of time a illness takes to recover skews the numbers.

But i get it if you are CNN you want to look at this from the angle that looks the worst. Especially if you are trying to make the point that red states that did not do stay at home orders were wrong. Not the fact that things are getting better in states like Oklahoma if you go by new cases.

I look at the leading indicator on this which is new cases. Total people hospitalized and deaths will lag that indicator. And when you look at flattening the curve its flatting new cases.
OF COURSE IT LOOKS THE WORST. THAT IS THE PROBLEM WITH THIS ILLNESS. They are tracking positive results/total current hospitalizations (all admissions minus discharges) regardless of when they happened, because how full the hospitals are is the thing everyone is so concerned about! If they become too full, the patients can't be properly cared for! What sense does it make to say, "Hey look everyone, new cases are down 4% this week! Isn't that great? Let's ignore the fact that if we get only 725 new cases next week and another 675 new cases the week after, we will have run out of hospital beds to put patients in!"

Last edited by mcsangel2; 04-18-2020 at 10:45 PM..
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Old 04-19-2020, 04:45 AM
 
Location: Guadalajara, MX
7,501 posts, read 3,646,083 times
Reputation: 14295
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oklazona Bound View Post
But i get it if you are CNN you want to look at this from the angle that looks the worst.
This is the problem.

You're looking at this with a political conclusion already in hand that you are now shaping your viewpoints to pursue.
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Old 04-19-2020, 04:59 AM
 
Location: Texas
246 posts, read 125,004 times
Reputation: 645
I don't think any governor should be judged as "vindicated" or not. They have probably done the best they could with what they know and their personalities. The type "A pluses" who feel we are incapable of making our own decisions tried and are still trying to run everyone's lives. Those governors who have a large constituency of small business owners are probably willing to back off this panic, and some governors appear to be expecting their constituents to use good judgement and decide for themselves. Although we may either support the decision of our governor or bristle at his/her bossiness I don't think we should consider this aa an adversarial thing as far as who was right and who was wrong. Ultimately it is OUR decision through contacting our government officials or changing them out during elections. They are not our masters.
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Old 04-19-2020, 08:43 AM
 
Location: Saint John, IN
11,576 posts, read 4,696,966 times
Reputation: 14675
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lowexpectations View Post
One of the points being made though is that if there was a stay at home order in place the first person who spread the virus within the meat processing place might not have ever contracted it. No one knows where it’s stated but a stay at home order certainly could have prevented this scenario, might not have but certainly could have
Another Smithfield Plant in N.C has Coronavirus cases!



https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/an...cid=spartanntp
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Old 04-19-2020, 09:09 AM
 
8,734 posts, read 2,423,231 times
Reputation: 5615
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcsangel2 View Post
OF COURSE IT LOOKS THE WORST. THAT IS THE PROBLEM WITH THIS ILLNESS. They are tracking positive results/total current hospitalizations (all admissions minus discharges) regardless of when they happened, because how full the hospitals are is the thing everyone is so concerned about! If they become too full, the patients can't be properly cared for! What sense does it make to say, "Hey look everyone, new cases are down 4% this week! Isn't that great? Let's ignore the fact that if we get only 725 new cases next week and another 675 new cases the week after, we will have run out of hospital beds to put patients in!"
No. Its the problem with spreading fear beyond what is actually happening. Hyperventilating using all caps does not help the situation. I know people personally who are severely disturbed over this. Deep, deep depression. And odds are they are not going to get seriously ill or die from the virus. They are deathly afraid of going outside. With them I would worry more about suicide or other health problems coming from their state of mind.

Reality is we are not running out of hospital beds. That was the chatter early on. Almost like it was a certainty. You can attribute the lower numbers to us doing a great job social distancing or simply the estimations being way off.
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Old 04-19-2020, 09:15 AM
 
8,734 posts, read 2,423,231 times
Reputation: 5615
Quote:
Originally Posted by lieqiang View Post
This is the problem.

You're looking at this with a political conclusion already in hand that you are now shaping your viewpoints to pursue.

CNN has the political conclusion. I am not a D nor R. I was curious to see how states that took less action than others would fare. Overall they seem to be doing about the same as states with more draconian measures. As a Libertarian I would prefer us to keep some civil liberties in place instead of hastily destroying them. If some D states had done that I would look at all of this the same as I do the R states now. Its amazing how supporting civil liberties is considered wreck-less or partisan by some now.
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Old 04-19-2020, 09:25 AM
 
8,297 posts, read 2,381,113 times
Reputation: 7157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elliott_CA View Post
No.

California 23 deaths per 1 mil
Indiana 66
Florida 31
Georgia 57
Louisiana 237

Florida's death toll is probably under-reported because many nursing homes won't report COVID deaths because they have policies preventing the release of patient medical information (and they have an incentive to not report for marketing reasons, plus fear of liability).

New York, NJ and Conn are all bad because infected Europeans came in through the international airports before the distancing orders came into effect. The important lesson here is that distancing is most effective before the cat is out of the bag.

Texas has a strong stay-at-home order but the governor doesn't use that label. They've done well to hold it at 13 deaths per million. They are getting ready to lift the order soon, which could be a serious mistake if it results in the virus running wild in cities like Houston or Dallas.
This is horseshi$. There is no way they could get away with this.

As I understand it, hospitals are attributing pretty much ANY death to Covid, even if it was caused by a comorbidity.
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Old 04-19-2020, 09:28 AM
 
8,297 posts, read 2,381,113 times
Reputation: 7157
Quote:
Originally Posted by bufflove View Post
You meant to say "helps DELAY transmission." Even with the extra time to ramp up a proper federal response, in all likelihood you're going to ultimately see higher mortality rates in red counties/states, on average, for the same reasons why flu deaths are so much higher in red counties/states (higher obesity and smoking rates, older population, poorer access to medical care, fewer people with health insurance, etc.).
lol. Are you serious? Have you seen NYC, Detroit, New Orleans, Chicago? You people just spout nonsense.
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Old 04-19-2020, 10:00 AM
 
Location: Saint John, IN
11,576 posts, read 4,696,966 times
Reputation: 14675
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grlzrl View Post
This is horseshi$. There is no way they could get away with this.

As I understand it, hospitals are attributing pretty much ANY death to Covid, even if it was caused by a comorbidity.
No, they are not doing that!
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Old 04-19-2020, 10:27 AM
 
4,097 posts, read 1,361,451 times
Reputation: 3239
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oklazona Bound View Post
CNN has the political conclusion. I am not a D nor R. I was curious to see how states that took less action than others would fare. Overall they seem to be doing about the same as states with more draconian measures. As a Libertarian I would prefer us to keep some civil liberties in place instead of hastily destroying them. If some D states had done that I would look at all of this the same as I do the R states now. Its amazing how supporting civil liberties is considered wreck-less or partisan by some now.
Exactly. I'm sad that it became such a partisan thing. Being skeptical of a year long lockdown somehow makes me a brainwashed Trump supporter?
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