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Old 05-25-2020, 11:03 AM
 
1,270 posts, read 761,756 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Therblig View Post
And mine: Of five children, the two with no significant college had successful careers but no children. The other three married, had at least one Ph.D. in the couple, and had twelve children, including one Ph.D., one LL.D., four lower degrees, one formal trade education, and four still pursuing secondary education (including one who interrupted his for a stint on Broadway).

Simple stats often obscure reality as much as they present it.

Okay.

I’ll be even more specific: those mention were in engineering, biological (microbiology, biochemistry, biophysics, molecular and cellular), and medical sciences. Non-religious, or nominal.

TBH, sharing similar temperament and traits with some of them, I probably would have opted not to have any had I stopped and thought about it intellectually. But luckily I did not, being more influenced by the residual effects of ‘old society.’ (We married in a church, after all.) No regrets.
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Old 05-25-2020, 11:04 AM
 
1,963 posts, read 503,478 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrRational View Post
And then there are the anecdotes used as a substitute for statistics.
Yes, two anecdotes were swapped to show that the cooked'n'shook "stats" thrown out before are stats, odds, percentages — not laws of nature.
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Old 05-25-2020, 11:17 AM
 
Location: The Triad (NC)
30,209 posts, read 66,715,215 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Therblig View Post
Yes, two anecdotes were swapped to show that the cooked'n'shook "stats" thrown out before are stats, odds, percentages — not laws of nature.
I see no meaningful distinction between the two exampled anecdotes.
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Old 05-25-2020, 11:24 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrRational View Post
I see no meaningful distinction between the two exampled anecdotes.
It's a holiday morning and the thread went stale pages ago. I amuse myself (and probably a few others who don't have a case of the Mondays).

But the argument that dumb people have lotsa kidz and smartt peepul don't is... not nearly as universally true as is assumed, no matter how long it's shelved next to the Cadillac Welfare Queen trope. Just offhand, I could list about thirty couples with nearly sixty degrees between them, many Ph.D.s, who have a least two kids, and a goodly number of po' folks who don't.

But that would be anecdotal.
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Old 05-25-2020, 11:24 AM
 
Location: La Mesa Aka The Table
7,986 posts, read 8,647,548 times
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I was on a far right website yesterday, and this same topic came up. The thread slowly went from, why aren't more people are not having Kids too, to why aren’t more white woman having babies.
Crazy times
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Old 05-25-2020, 11:29 AM
 
1,963 posts, read 503,478 times
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Originally Posted by hitman619 View Post
I was on a far right website yesterday, and this same topic came up. The thread slowly went from, why aren't more people are not having Kids too, to why aren’t more white woman having babies.
Crazy times
Not really. Studies show that 92.7% of the time, that's what the real question/discussion is.* Whether it's raw racism at the alt-right level, pure intellectual abstraction at the university level or carefully masked bias at the mainstream level, it nearly always boils down to "why are people — you know, good people... I mean worthy people... okay, okay, white people — having fewer kids?"


* Therblig University of the Mind Online Journal, 2020.
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Old 05-25-2020, 11:31 AM
 
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Why aren’t more women having kids in those countries where they are incentivized with economic subsidies and generous parental leave policies?

Apparently, in Japan the birth of a ‘native’ child is cause of community celebration, and some even get a personalized, custom-made chair by a famous local architect/designer.
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Old 05-25-2020, 11:33 AM
 
1,963 posts, read 503,478 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mingna View Post
Why aren’t more women having kids in those countries where they are incentivized with economic subsidies and generous parental leave policies?

Apparently, in Japan the birth of a ‘native’ child is cause of community celebration, and some even get a personalized, custom-made chair by a famous local architect/designer.
Do you understand the current situation in Japan? It's not terribly far from that in "Children of Men." Of course each child's birth is cause for community celebration, over and above traditions.
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Old 05-25-2020, 12:43 PM
 
Location: The Triad (NC)
30,209 posts, read 66,715,215 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Therblig View Post
But the argument that dumb people have lotsa kidz and smartt peepul don't is...
That's not the argument... just the reality of a common correlation.
(and why it shows up in anecdotes)

The argument is about what ELSE those smartt peepul (as you phrase it) are doing.
Doing instead of, doing in addittion to, doing in productive sequence and ...(a few more)
that the other cohort aren't doing much of or worse not at all and leaving the responsibility for
and the costs of those children (frequently clamoring for UBI now) to the others.

ps: And it's not about race it is as it always has been... about poor choices and economics.
The viability aspect (family level or nationally) does seem to be even more acute than ever before.

pps: After the first page or two there is no telling which weeds a thread might stray off into.

Last edited by MrRational; 05-25-2020 at 12:56 PM..
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Old 05-25-2020, 12:47 PM
 
3,627 posts, read 1,487,361 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mingna View Post
Why aren’t more women having kids in those countries where they are incentivized with economic subsidies and generous parental leave policies?
I listened to a BBC podcast on this and it's in line with what we've observed before, maybe a bit more extreme. Japanese parents tend to load their kids with extra classes, music lessons, tutoring, etc. so raising one kid takes major resources. Housing in the cities is also extremely expensive so they may not have the room for another one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JPrzybylski07 View Post

Stop having children, it’s the most egotistical thing someone can do.
It's a very personal decision and I would never try to persuade someone who didn't want children to have them, but I think having kids is pretty unselfish when you think of what it takes to raise them. It's also a bit of a crapshoot I know plenty of parents who did the best they could and, to all appearances didn't do anything particularly bad but ended up with a dysfunctional kid anyway.

Quote:
I would vote for a law to be passed on at least limiting the number of births women can have, with the world being over populated being able to freely just have children should no longer be a right but regulated.
I do wish we could stop giving additional government benefits for, say, the 3rd and subsequent kids. I think it's been tried but you end up with kids who have even less of the basics. Maybe that's when you take Baby #3 to an orphanage.
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