U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Happy Independence Day!
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 06-19-2020, 06:01 PM
 
Location: Wartrace,TN
6,200 posts, read 9,705,063 times
Reputation: 12199

Advertisements

No way could student loan forgiveness work. Unless you offer EVERY American taxpayer the payment it is unfair.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 06-19-2020, 06:12 PM
 
1,989 posts, read 510,658 times
Reputation: 3196
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wartrace View Post
Unless you offer EVERY American taxpayer the payment it is unfair.
The way all American taxpayers get the breaks for being married? The way all taxpayers get breaks for having six kids? The way all taxpayers pay a flat 15% rate on incomes into the millions?

Sure. I can get behind that.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-19-2020, 06:16 PM
 
1,989 posts, read 510,658 times
Reputation: 3196
Quote:
Originally Posted by blisterpeanuts View Post
Yes definitely the universities are responsible for this mess.
You're determined to point the finger at everyone except who is actually to blame.

Ever seen/read Murder on the Orient Express?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old Yesterday, 08:45 AM
 
110 posts, read 20,048 times
Reputation: 224
Quote:
Originally Posted by Therblig View Post
I don't know. Maybe something is owed all those who took on huge debt to complete a degree, whether they've been lucky/successful enough to pay it off or not.

But in general (and not necessarily addressing you), the "I succeeded and they didn't and I am thus more worthy" argument doesn't fly in the Empire of Therblig. Any argument that boils down to "I am worthy and they are not" — which is epidemic in the discussions here — marks the poster as an entitled fool in my book. Individuals succeed to varying degrees as much to nonrandom distribution of assets (including privilege) and plain luck as to all those cherished 'Murrican verities.

So an argument that you paid off your debts is neither here nor there on the larger problem, and implying that if you could do it, they can, too... lead balloon, there.

(For reference, we put six kids through college, including a couple of expensive ones. Some grants and scholarships, no loans. This last one may have to self-fund part of a very expensive and demanding senior year, but will likely go from that into a very small pool of very elite positions on sheer ability alone. My ex and I both paid for our own educations, more or less.)
It is not always an issue of "I'm worthy" but rather those who made bad decisions get to live with the consequences. When I was graduated from high school, I had the option of attending several different universities. Whilst I was offered several scholarships, none provided a complete tuition/board package. I come from a working class background in which debt is abhorred; my parents could not provide any assistance nor did I expect them to. So I decided not to go to those universities, but rather live at home and attend a local college. Maybe not as prestigious, but far cheaper. No debt. Good solid education. Financially successful.

My decision saved me from have burdensome debt upon being graduated from university. That option is available to most students.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old Yesterday, 08:47 AM
 
Location: Riverside Ca
20,897 posts, read 23,295,749 times
Reputation: 32190
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheArchitect View Post
Could a cancelation or significant reduction in student debt over the next couple of years for working adults, effectively provide a boost to the housing market and also spur entrepreneurship on the heels of the economic effects of the Covid shutdown?

Curious to hear some of the pros/cons of this idea.




WSJ article below:

"Student loans prevented 400,000 young Americans from buying homes, Fed says in paper covering 2005 to 2014"


https://www.wsj.com/articles/fed-say...et-11547657473


https://www.businessinsider.com/stud...nership-2019-7


https://hbr.org/2019/04/student-debt...-entrepreneurs
Talk about a discriminatory practice

I wonder who is gonna get stuck making the bank whole. I doubt the banks are just gonna say ok we will just shred this balance owed number. Click highlight backspace 0. Okey dokey. . You’re debt free
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old Yesterday, 08:49 AM
 
11,790 posts, read 13,670,947 times
Reputation: 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheArchitect View Post
Could a cancelation or significant reduction in student debt over the next couple of years for working adults, effectively provide a boost to the housing market and also spur entrepreneurship on the heels of the economic effects of the Covid shutdown?

Curious to hear some of the pros/cons of this idea.




WSJ article below:

"Student loans prevented 400,000 young Americans from buying homes, Fed says in paper covering 2005 to 2014"


https://www.wsj.com/articles/fed-say...et-11547657473


https://www.businessinsider.com/stud...nership-2019-7


https://hbr.org/2019/04/student-debt...-entrepreneurs

no no no.............The idea was "invest" in your education and it will pay you back by having a lucrative career. Dopey kids with bad degrees and huge debt was simply a bad investment. Releasing them from the debt still won't allow them to buy anything if they are working at Starbucks for $10 an hour.

How many Dr's are making strong incomes (albeit with heavy debt in some cases).........so should they get their debt forgiven? That seems wrong if they are making big money.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old Yesterday, 08:56 AM
 
11,790 posts, read 13,670,947 times
Reputation: 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lillie767 View Post
It is not always an issue of "I'm worthy" but rather those who made bad decisions get to live with the consequences. When I was graduated from high school, I had the option of attending several different universities. Whilst I was offered several scholarships, none provided a complete tuition/board package. I come from a working class background in which debt is abhorred; my parents could not provide any assistance nor did I expect them to. So I decided not to go to those universities, but rather live at home and attend a local college. Maybe not as prestigious, but far cheaper. No debt. Good solid education. Financially successful.

My decision saved me from have burdensome debt upon being graduated from university. That option is available to most students.
This is me^^^^^^^, slightly different beginning.

Parents had 4 kids, saved NOTHING for college. Solid middle class, both parents were college graduates/paid their own way. I was told from the early high school that I was not going off to college on their dime. I got into UNC, it was kind of a joke in our house since there was no way I was going there.

Worked from age 13, regularly made $400 a week in high school (it was a lot back then). Started community college (cheap!!! $100 a class!), worked full time. Associates degree in 3 years, transferred to a state university (hated it), dropped out and enrolled in the best private university in the state. Graduated in 3.5 more years with a bachelors degree in business. The tuition was $2500 a class and I paid it every semester and never took $1 in loans.

No loans
No debt
Solid education
Financially secure.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old Yesterday, 09:03 AM
 
5,752 posts, read 2,534,024 times
Reputation: 11165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Therblig View Post
You're determined to point the finger at everyone except who is actually to blame.

Ever seen/read Murder on the Orient Express?
To some extent, universities are responsible. I think it got much worse when the federal GradPLUS loan was started, which was the first year I was in grad school. To get approved for private loans, students had to have decent credit and the rates were variable. People who couldn’t qualify would choose cheaper schools or might not go at all until they got their credit together.

The first year, there was no forgiveness program of any sort, so most people in my class who could qualify for private loans were recommended not to take the GradPLUS. Most of my friends and I have been plodding away paying our private loans, which are at a pretty low interest rate (mine are at below 3%).

I have friends who started after me who took out GradPLUS, have insane loans that have just ballooned while they are in the loan repayment programs. Most do all sorts of things to avoid repaying, like putting more into tax-deferred retirement, etc. To be honest, I think most of my friends planning to do loan forgiveness have not many any dent in their debts and it is possible that the overall balance has gone up. I don’t really support this creative approach.

I think it is fine to forgive a reasonable amount, like the amount it would cost to get an undergraduate degree- maybe $50-60K, but not the six-figure debt many people take out and never pay for graduate degrees. For example, someone going to medical school can start paying in residency and then work for a public/non-profit hospital for a few years and get all their debt forgiven. They may not pay that much because they were only making $60K or so in residency for 3-6 years.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old Yesterday, 11:40 AM
 
6,816 posts, read 3,754,930 times
Reputation: 3955
Why is it the responsibility of the US taxpayer to help students buy houses and start businesses?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old Yesterday, 12:50 PM
 
1,989 posts, read 510,658 times
Reputation: 3196
We can probably cut a lot of minor side-squabble by assuming that there would be some controls on the effort — not that everyone who has had a student loan in the last 30 years will get a refund. For one thing, it should be entirely opt-in with a sufficient hurdle that few people do it 'just cuz it's free money.'

But I think the important point is getting lost in what-iffing neurosurgeons who spent $250k to now make $5M a year, and so forth.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2020, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top