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Old 06-28-2020, 06:56 PM
 
7,897 posts, read 3,846,016 times
Reputation: 20801

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My state has all employees pay into the UE system thru a tax . I feel zero, none, nada guilt for utilizing the funds I paid into.
The incentive is to live. Meaning, food, clothing, shelter.
I commence back to work , because A: our state knows quite quickly if an employee who was to be back at scheduled work , chose to ride the gravy train. My employer sends in a weekly report. And B: I need the job to keep me afloat. Despite barely covering the basics.
That 600$ was saved. Because life goes on. And wouldn't ya know....cars still need repaired so I can get to work!
Some folks actually made good use of their additional time and money. We the underlings...grunts....finally got some reprieve.
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Old 06-28-2020, 07:22 PM
 
Location: Baltimore, MD
3,992 posts, read 4,514,928 times
Reputation: 7409
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thatsright19 View Post
The pay was more to incentivize people to want to stay home because of the pandemic.

It’s also stimulus. I’m sure the initial idea was a blast of stimulus to ride it out. It’s like preventative maintenance. It’s cheaper in the long run to spend the money upfront than if you let catastrophic failure happen.

But the horse is in the next county now, so closing the gate doesn’t have much use. Our economy is trashed.


This whole unemployment thing was pretty eye opening to me. I was helping my dad who makes 6 figures. My state is capped at $360 a week, which is nothing to people with good jobs. I had no idea it was so low. Even with this so called bonus of $600 extra, it just starts to reach the level of reasonable supplement. It certainly makes me rethink my emergency fund because normal unemployment is basically a mortgage payment.
I hear ya! My state has the highest median income in the U.S. and our UE benefit is capped at $430/wk.
OTOH, I am retired, receive an average SS Benefit and have adequate retirement savings. I cannot think of one good reason why I and other non-working retirees should have received a $1200 "stimulus" check. We lost nothing.
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Old 06-28-2020, 07:26 PM
 
21,027 posts, read 15,251,014 times
Reputation: 16291
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wartrace View Post
It would be very difficult to administer a program like that.
1. I don’t care if it’s difficult and 2. Explain to me now it’s harder than th current system

Quote:
If a lessor paying job is all that's available so be it
That’s your opinion and ignore the cost if someone turning the job down and thus you carry all the cost

Quote:
if the taxpayers start subsidizing wages with a "bonus" what incentive do business owners have paying market wages?
Did you have a hard tome comprehending my outline for a temporary 3 month transition?

Quote:
Back in 2009 all the federal government (aka taxpayers) did was extend state unemployment benefits for two years. I expect the same this time. There were no provisions for supplementary income for the unemployed. Why should it be different now?
Was the prior program the best it could have been? The answer is no, so the discussion to make changes marks all the sense in the world

Quote:
It is going to be a long journey back to where we we were in 2019.
I’m not sure this statement has any value
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Old 06-28-2020, 07:26 PM
 
Location: North Beach, MD on the Chesapeake
35,260 posts, read 45,269,076 times
Reputation: 45654
Quote:
Originally Posted by K12144 View Post
I don't understand how people are supposedly not going back to work when called back because they make more on unemployment... I thought a person loses unemployment payments if they refuse employment that they're offered?
Granted it's been forty years almost since I collected Unemployment but if someone back then refused to return to work when called two things happened-you got fired and your Unemployment ceased.
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Old 06-28-2020, 07:45 PM
 
14,218 posts, read 5,869,934 times
Reputation: 17021
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wartrace View Post
Explain why the taxpayer should be paying MORE than an unemployed person was making by working.

If this continues the unemployed should be getting 20 to 30% less than they made working. There should be no incentive.

I agree with that but cutting it off altogether is worse. The initial FPUC was flawed but it had to be implemented quickly with no time to negotiate and modify. They have had plenty of time to fix the flaws but it appears they have squandered that time and aren't likely to address it until the deadline expires then may throw out something else with deep flaws because there was "no time".
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Old 06-28-2020, 07:57 PM
 
5,809 posts, read 2,558,287 times
Reputation: 11309
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thatsright19 View Post
The pay was more to incentivize people to want to stay home because of the pandemic.

It’s also stimulus. I’m sure the initial idea was a blast of stimulus to ride it out. It’s like preventative maintenance. It’s cheaper in the long run to spend the money upfront than if you let catastrophic failure happen.

But the horse is in the next county now, so closing the gate doesn’t have much use. Our economy is trashed.


This whole unemployment thing was pretty eye opening to me. I was helping my dad who makes 6 figures. My state is capped at $360 a week, which is nothing to people with good jobs. I had no idea it was so low. Even with this so called bonus of $600 extra, it just starts to reach the level of reasonable supplement. It certainly makes me rethink my emergency fund because normal unemployment is basically a mortgage payment.
The pay was also to keep the economy from completely collapsing. You had some places where insane numbers of people were furloughed- like Orlando. FL has unemployment benefits at $275 a week, which is below minimum wage level. While people in hospitality/tourism don’t typically have huge salaries, we’re talking people in a variety of roles, from higher paid folks like the mechanics, plumbers, electricians who won’t have as much work to do when resorts aren’t active, down to the housekeeping and retail staff who don’t tend to make as much.
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Old 06-28-2020, 08:06 PM
 
22,423 posts, read 9,043,622 times
Reputation: 10536
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wartrace View Post
Explain why the taxpayer should be paying MORE than an unemployed person was making by working.

If this continues the unemployed should be getting 20 to 30% less than they made working. There should be no incentive.

agreed.
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Old 06-28-2020, 09:40 PM
 
23,448 posts, read 16,149,372 times
Reputation: 16930
Quote:
Originally Posted by K12144 View Post
I don't understand how people are supposedly not going back to work when called back because they make more on unemployment... I thought a person loses unemployment payments if they refuse employment that they're offered?
Much would depend upon local labor market I suppose.

Many of those supposedly not wanting or refusing to return are low wage sector employees. There are many of those jobs open; Amazon, Walmart and others are begging for workers, even offering various inducements.

Mid-tier workers who have a nest egg, and it grew with all this recent free money may have taken these past several months off to reevaluate their priorities. If you didn't like your old job, and feel can do better elsewhere, why not simply don't go back. You got three months of UI + $600 per week, and in many instances one or more stimulus checks of $1200 for each adult in household. For those that were able to be careful with that money it could last a very long time after UI benefits end.

All this being said it is mainly low wage workers who aren't jumping at returning. Rather than find out reasons why and working to solve issue (such as raising wage, and improving working conditions), businesses are leaning on republicans and DT to force people back.
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Old Yesterday, 05:10 AM
 
Location: Tennessee
27,676 posts, read 20,664,451 times
Reputation: 33553
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wartrace View Post
It would be very difficult to administer a program like that. If a lessor paying job is all that's available so be it; if the taxpayers start subsidizing wages with a "bonus" what incentive do business owners have paying market wages?

Back in 2009 all the federal government (aka taxpayers) did was extend state unemployment benefits for two years. I expect the same this time. There were no provisions for supplementary income for the unemployed. Why should it be different now?

It is going to be a long journey back to where we we were in 2019.
There may be additional stimulus targeted toward businesses, but I think we're done on any additional stimulus geared toward individuals unless Congressional Republicans deem more relief in their best electoral interests. If the Democrats take the Presidency and both houses of Congress, we'll likely see more action, but that will be late winter before we see anything.

There's going to be a huge wave of evictions in late summer/early fall, and foreclosures in the coming months beyond that. The only thing keeping a lot of people in their homes and fed right now is the $600/week supplemental. Once this goes, you're going to have real American carnage.

I work for a very large enterprise. We were in a fairly aggressive hiring pattern before COVID in my division. All of that was put on hold due to COVID, and a fair number of people were furloughed. Some were brought back, but I anticipate that a lot of these furloughs are going to end up as permanent layoffs.

There have always been few professional employers hiring in my field. That's basically dried up to zero now. Sure, you could probably get a job at Target or a restaurant, but that's a far cry from a $50k+ IT job.

Out of my family who are in the labor force, it goes like this.

1) Uncle 1 - business owner. Business is about half of what it was. Most of his guys are half time or less. His income is likely to be halved this year, but he is 64 and a multimillionaire, so he'll be fine.

2) Dad - mechanic at a pharmaceutical plant. No income disruption.

4) Aunt 1 - career job moved from small town TN to Charlotte, took dramatic income decline before COVID. Still working.

5) Uncle 2 - works for uncle 1, dramatic income decline.

6) Aunt 2 - business owner. Unlikely to reopen - her customers are closed indefinitely or out of business. On unemployment.

7) Aunt 3 - works for aunt 2, unemployed.

8) Cousin 1 - mental health tech at hospital, furloughed. Has a lot of health issues and will likely end up unemployed.

9) Cousin 2 - working at a factory, no income disruption as far as I know.

10) Cousin 3 - daughter of aunt 2, works for her. Unemployed.

11) Cousin 4 - still working HR job at a small company.

12) Cousin 5 - works for aunt 2, nephew. Unemployed and leaving town. Has some small alternate income streams.

13) Cousins 6/7 - worked at two different retail stores in the small mall. Unemployed.

Out of these fifteen people, including myself, only five of us (me, one aunt, two of my cousins, dad) are in the same shape we were at the first of the year. There is a bit of weirdness with the two of the family members employing some of the others, but I don't think these numbers are all that unusual among large families. People are lining up across the country with similar numbers.

Out of the people 25 or younger, only one is working. All were working at the start of the year.

I graduated in 2010 and should have graduated in 2008. It wasn't anywhere nearly this severe. Even so, the safety net back then (99 weeks of UI comes to mind) was far better than what we have now.
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Old Yesterday, 06:43 AM
 
Location: Tennessee
27,676 posts, read 20,664,451 times
Reputation: 33553
Quote:
Originally Posted by BugsyPal View Post
Much would depend upon local labor market I suppose.

Many of those supposedly not wanting or refusing to return are low wage sector employees. There are many of those jobs open; Amazon, Walmart and others are begging for workers, even offering various inducements.

Mid-tier workers who have a nest egg, and it grew with all this recent free money may have taken these past several months off to reevaluate their priorities. If you didn't like your old job, and feel can do better elsewhere, why not simply don't go back. You got three months of UI + $600 per week, and in many instances one or more stimulus checks of $1200 for each adult in household. For those that were able to be careful with that money it could last a very long time after UI benefits end.

All this being said it is mainly low wage workers who aren't jumping at returning. Rather than find out reasons why and working to solve issue (such as raising wage, and improving working conditions), businesses are leaning on republicans and DT to force people back.
They are stupid for not returning. I'd rather have a job now than take a gamble on looking after everyone else is also back in the market.
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