Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Len Penzo is all into gold. I know many say it's where to be at right now.
What I don't understand is what the hell are you supposed to do with a gold coin if the S hits the F?
My husband went out and bought a couple coins during the Great Recession and it ended up being a dumb and inefficient asset to hold. I don't want to repeat the experience, but people who are smarter and more experienced than me still own gold.
But in practical matters... suppose everything is difficult.. no jobs, food scarcity... is a gold coin (or 30) really going to save you? Seems like at most it will continue your suffering just a little while longer..
Len Penzo is all into gold. I know many say it's where to be at right now.
What I don't understand is what the hell are you supposed to do with a gold coin if the S hits the F?
My husband went out and bought a couple coins during the Great Recession and it ended up being a dumb and inefficient asset to hold. I don't want to repeat the experience, but people who are smarter and more experienced than me still own gold.
But in practical matters... suppose everything is difficult.. no jobs, food scarcity... is a gold coin (or 30) really going to save you? Seems like at most it will continue your suffering just a little while longer..
I agree with you.I know a lot of goldbug friends and some dont even dont believe in the stock market.I agree with you.I dont get the appeal of gold either because no store or gas station is going to accept a gold coin.Also, if i really was preparing for the end of the world as we knew it.I would buy lots of guns,MREs, non-perishable food,water,land and ammo, fuel etc.
everyone in my church frind group thinks im a idiot for trusting index funds,stocks over gold.
It's supposed to be a "hedge against inflation". Well, an ounce of Gold sold for $1,121.00 on January 4, 2010. The DJIA was at 10,600.
Today Gold is at $1,787. The DJIA is at 25,827. If you went all in on Gold you missed the biggest stock market rally in history.
Gold in a SHTF situation won't feed you. Who else would want it?
My opinion: There's nothing wrong with holding some gold. The coins are pretty. You'd be better off investing in index funds and buying guns/ammo.
1. don't cherry pick dates.
2. inflation did happen. all the money went straight into the stock market last go around. give it more time and you'll see it hit main street soon enough.
3. gold is the most liquid asset with the greatest demand worldwide
4. gold has no counterparty risk
5. no one says you can't hold gold and stocks and ammo.
Money in some form will always be relevant... Gold/silver are the purest and most honest forms of money.
Gold and silver represent stored energy. Paper assets are a future promise to burn energy to produce economic activity which may or may not happen... That's why gold/silver are high quality stores of value.
I think all paper assets (stocks, bonds, real estate) will be eviscerated as we reach the limits of "growth" and debt expansion..... The precious metals will preserve your wealth.
I would look into silver rather than gold. Silver right now is obscenely undervalued.
gold is tightly linked to the dollar as well as a fear asset at times . it is NOT linked to inflation unless inflation weakens the dollar .
gold has held a positive real return in 98% of all major stock market downturns .
the last 20 years has seen gold become a totally different asset class once it became accessible to investors easily via etf's .
it became an active part of portfolio's more and more .
the last 20 years has seen gold beat the s&p 500 and the total market
in fact a simple mix of 25% gold , long term treasuries , short term treasuries and equities has done very very well with very very low volatility .
plus remember , in a down turn or fear scenario when equities drop and gold rises , you buy a whole lot more equities with that appreciated gold when you rebalance vs buying more equities with a total market fund or cash rebancing .
that is a different animal all together than gold sitting as a static lump .
if we were to measure from highs , stocks always win ... but we typically spend 80% of our investing time somewhere in between the last low and last high .
that makes a big difference between what should play out and what does play out .
the last 20 years have been quite mixed and quite different , in fact even the assets used have shifted as assets like gold became main stream and no longer the asset of choice of the doomers and gold bugs ...as well as more and more lazy type portfolios use assets like gold and long term treasuries unlike prior days .
once we have these more diverse outcomes the assets we think will outperform and what does is changing ...
i did a little comparison on portfolio visualizer of what transpired the last 2 decades since to go back further has gold a non main stream , difficult asset to deal with as well as its virtues in a portfolio were pretty much unknown yet . ..
one thing was certain and that is for the volatility 100% equities gave you , the reward was certainly not up to par.....
so here is what it showed .
portfolio 1 is 25% gold , short term treasuries , long term treasuries and 25% equities ...it is as low volatility and bullet proof as one can get .
portfolio 2 is 100% us stock market
portfolio 3 100% long term treasuries
portfolio 4 100% gold .
last 20 years ... portfolio#1- 7.12% , portfolio #2- 5.87, portfolio #3 - 7.94%--portfolio #4-8.79%--- winner gold,long term treasuries 2nd , equities last place
last 15 years----port#1 ----7.43----------port#2 ---8.35%------port#3--7.32%------prt#4----6.89%---winner equities, long term treasuries 2nd
last 10 years-----port#1---7.03-----------port #2-----12.11%------port#3---8.44%----port#4---4.09#---winner equities ,long term treasuries 2nd
last 5 years -----port#1-----6.49----------port#2-------9.02--------port#3-----7.31% ----port#4-----6.89%---winner equities , long term treasuries 2nd
last 3 years------port#1-----9.63---------port#2-------10.69%------port#3-----11.95%----port#4--12.03%--winner gold, long term treasuries 2nd , equities last place
last 1 year ------port #1----8.19% ------port#2 -----minus 5.59 ----port #3 ----20.97-----port #4 23.18%.---winner gold , long term treasuries 2nd , equities last place
ytd ------------port#! 1: up 15% -------port#2---minus 2.50% -------port#3-------22%------port#4----17% ---winner long term treasuries -gold 2nd place , equities ,last place
so it shows what we think should be and what is can be all over the map as well as the longer you hold a portfolio the more time we spend in between highs and lows of equities so comparisons are very different then just measuring equities at their peaks .
Last edited by mathjak107; 07-05-2020 at 04:06 AM..
Money in some form will always be relevant... Gold/silver are the purest and most honest forms of money.
Gold and silver represent stored energy. Paper assets are a future promise to burn energy to produce economic activity which may or may not happen... That's why gold/silver are high quality stores of value.
I think all paper assets (stocks, bonds, real estate) will be eviscerated as we reach the limits of "growth" and debt expansion..... The precious metals will preserve your wealth.
I would look into silver rather than gold. Silver right now is obscenely undervalued.
silver is NOT like gold
silver acts like an industrial metal first and foremost ...it can not be counted on to do its job in an equity down turn .
2008 saw gold rise , silver plunged along with every other commodity .
back in 1987 i believed silver was a good investment . i bought 2-100 ounce bars from my bank which sold them for 9.73 an ounce ... well 3 decades later it has not even doubled ... luckily i ditched them decades ago .
if you want portfolio protection there is no replacement for gold ... if you want speculation on a commodity , well silver is in that category or bitcoin.
Last edited by mathjak107; 07-05-2020 at 04:10 AM..
silver acts like an industrial metal first and foremost ...it can not be counted on to do its job in an equity down turn .
2008 saw gold rise , silver plunged along with every other commodity .
back in 1987 i believed silver was a good investment . i bought 2-100 ounce bars from my bank which sold them for 9.73 an ounce ... well 3 decades later it has not even doubled ... luckily i ditched them decades ago .
if you want portfolio protection there is no replacement for gold ... if you want speculation on a commodity , well silver is in that category or bitcoin.
Silver is a monetary metal first, for over 5k years, and an industrial metal second. In fact, silver has been used as money longer and more often than gold. Yes, silver is unloved and neglected, right now, but I believe silver will provide immensely more value than any other financial asset- even gold.
To get an idea of how obscenely undervalued silver is, consider this: if you divided the entire annual global production of silver among everyone on earth, each person would get slightly more than a tenth of an oz. Yet an oz of silver can be purchased for the cost of a pizza.
Silver is nothing like bitcoin whatsoever. Bitcoin is a digital token, silver is real tangible wealth
Silver is a monetary metal first, for over 5k years, and an industrial metal second. In fact, silver has been used as money longer and more often than gold. Yes, silver is unloved and neglected, right now, but I believe silver will provide immensely more value than any other financial asset- even gold.
To get an idea of how obscenely undervalued silver is, consider this: if you divided the entire annual global production of silver among everyone on earth, each person would get slightly more than a tenth of an oz. Yet an oz of silver can be purchased for the cost of a pizza.
Silver is nothing like bitcoin whatsoever. Bitcoin is a digital token, silver is real tangible wealth
silver has sucked at supporting portfolio's the last few decades . unless you are talking about a zombie Apocalypse currency , silver has no reliable history of holding positive real returns in market downturns like gold does .
so far it has proved useless in portfolio hedging . it is a speculation at best , used outside of a portfolio environment in my opinion .
i would only bet on it as a speculation .
i would never recommend anyone turn to silver for portfolio hedging .. it has failed to demonstrate any reliability in market downturns .
just look at silver now , it' is flat ytd , while gold is up 17% ytd
so if you are talking a zombie Apocalypse currency that is one thing , a core investment , that is quite another.
the investment world consists of investments and speculations and they are not the same.
most all weather portfolio's use gold , not silver for a reason . if anything they lump silver in with commodities and buy a commodities etf . but gold always is it's own investment
Last edited by mathjak107; 07-05-2020 at 04:48 AM..
silver has sucked at supporting portfolio's the last few decades . unless you are talking about a zombie Apocalypse currency , silver has no reliable history of holding positive real returns in market downturns like gold does .
so far it has proved useless in portfolio hedging . it is a speculation at best , used outside of a portfolio environment in my opinion .
i would only bet on it as a speculation .
i would never recommend anyone turn to silver for portfolio hedging .. it has failed to demonstrate any reliability in market downturns .
just look at silver now , it' is flat ytd , while gold is up 17% ytd
so if you are talking a zombie Apocalypse currency that is one thing , a core investment , that is quite another.
the investment world consists of investments and speculations and they are not the same.
most all weather portfolio's use gold , not silver for a reason . if anything they lump silver in with commodities and buy a commodities etf . but gold always is it's own investment
As we reach limits of growth and debt expansion, paper assets will see their real value devastated. In such a financial environment, silver will be the place to be.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
