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Since the mid 1980s, federal aid has diminished, and college tuition has soared.
Thanks President Reagan.
It was a good start at getting the federal government out of college aid. Unfortunately, no one finished the job and we're in this strange in-between that has lead to expensive mediocre education for some.
It's a great thing she didn't go to community college if she wanted to a full college education. Community college grants college credit but that's all it does. It doesn't provide a solid college education which is primarily attained outside of the classroom (typically in research labs and opportunities). The first two years of college are critical for this but community colleges leave it out.
When did you attend college? Most public universities are huge and provide very little via research labs for undergrads, especially as freshmen and sophomores, beyond grunt work. I know, I ran a PhD lab and we had 40 undergrads in our lab that watched video and coded into an excel sheet, some of the older ones acted as "expert supervisors", but none of those were freshmen or sophomores. I attended undergrad at a 4 year state university from 2002-2006 and I didn't have a class (outside of English 101) that was smaller than 65 people until I was in my senior year. I'm sure that's different in different majors, but for most people that aren't in majors like chemistry, engineering, computer science, etc. The first 2 years are largely lecture halls today in most majors, I don't see how it's all that different from most community colleges, in fact it might be better because you're getting a teacher that is most likely a PhD graduate. Most undergrad classes where I got my PhD were taught by grad students, who would have rather been in their lab or studying, so did the bare minimum. Very few were taught by tenure track professors, it was largely "lecturers" or grad students. The tenure track profs only taught the grad classes or upper level honors courses and even many of them would buy out of their teaching obligations with grant money.
Not sure why you keep at this. I do not feel that student loans should be written off. That is what I am discussing here, that is what I posted about. I have no interest in debating with you about what I do consider to be a good use of tax dollars. Go chew that bone with someone else.
If the discussion is about good use of tax dollars it seems applicable to discuss other uses outside of one singular topic. Usually it’s avoided because it exposes hypocrisy and I understand
It's a great thing she didn't go to community college if she wanted to a full college education. Community college grants college credit but that's all it does. It doesn't provide a solid college education which is primarily attained outside of the classroom (typically in research labs and opportunities). The first two years of college are critical for this but community colleges leave it out.
I don’t think this is true at all. I went to community college for my first two years, and I wouldn’t of even gotten into my four year university without that foundation. We’re no labs are research opportunities in the first two years of my occupational therapy program regardless of where I took it. The first two years are similar everywhere, statistics, psychology, anatomy and physiology etc. I did have labs in all the science classes at CC however. I got a $6000 scholarship from my transfer university because I had the highest GPA of the incoming class. It did not matter that I got that GPA at community college. I had a great experience at community college.
It's a great thing she didn't go to community college if she wanted to a full college education. Community college grants college credit but that's all it does. It doesn't provide a solid college education which is primarily attained outside of the classroom (typically in research labs and opportunities). The first two years of college are critical for this but community colleges leave it out.
LOL As someone that hires a lot of mechanical engineers right out of universities, I can tell you most of these kids have never even built a Lego set let alone how to actually put something together. 4 years of University and all they are getting are text books. Of sure, you can learn a lot from text books, but in the real world how things actually are made and go together isn't just math and science.
We have replaced real world wisdom with book smart intelligence. There are no labs taking place. Just endless writing, reading and testing.
LOL As someone that hires a lot of mechanical engineers right out of universities, I can tell you most of these kids have never even built a Lego set let alone how to actually put something together. 4 years of University and all they are getting are text books. Of sure, you can learn a lot from text books, but in the real world how things actually are made and go together isn't just math and science.
We have replaced real world wisdom with book smart intelligence. There are no labs taking place. Just endless writing, reading and testing.
Depends on the program. Occupational therapy most definitely had labs including cadaver labs. But there were only 30 students in the class. We went to all classes together for the duration of our schooling. I will say though, they did not teach us enough real world applications much of it was theoretical and research-based which did not help once we got into a clinic. They operated under the assumption that we would learn our clinical skills in our fieldwork placements, but that is not the way the world is today. They expected us to know what we were doing in terms of clinical skills when we got there. It was a rude awakening.
My bff went to Rutgers and there were so many kids some of the classes were in auditoriums (and taught by grad students not professors). When I went up to visit her for the weekend, I would actually go to some of her classes with her and no one ever knew I wasn’t a student.
It's a great thing she didn't go to community college if she wanted to a full college education. Community college grants college credit but that's all it does. It doesn't provide a solid college education which is primarily attained outside of the classroom (typically in research labs and opportunities). The first two years of college are critical for this but community colleges leave it out.
Most 4 year schools now you get taught by graduate students for your first two years. Hardly anything special or to brag about. At least with community colleges you aren't getting taught by grad students who are mostly fresh out of their undergraduate degree themselves.
Most 4 year schools now you get taught by graduate students for your first two years. Hardly anything special or to brag about. At least with community colleges you aren't getting taught by grad students who are mostly fresh out of their undergraduate degree themselves.
From reading TexasLawyer's other comments it seems his only familiarity with undergrad is Ivy League and the like. He's not familiar with how us "common folk" get our educations, he's also likely in his 50s, so not even familiar with undergrad education in the last 20-30 years. On the other hand I just finished my PhD from a state university 7 years ago and I can confirm your statement is in fact true. Only one of our 6 faculty that were tenure track/tenured taught an undergrad course and she was tenure track. She taught a senior level honors course. Now all us grad students taught labs our first year and then moved on to being instructors of record in most of the freshmen through senior level courses for our remaining time there.
From reading TexasLawyer's other comments it seems his only familiarity with undergrad is Ivy League and the like. He's not familiar with how us "common folk" get our educations, he's also likely in his 50s, so not even familiar with undergrad education in the last 20-30 years.
Yeah it was not a realistic assessment of 4 year schools in today's world. I knew of parents who demanded tuition reimbursements because their kids were only getting taught by grad students who were in their early 20's. You can't tell me that is a benefit over getting taught by someone with 20 years or experience teaching at a community college. To paint with such broad strokes shows ignorance about the topic.
Most 4 year schools now you get taught by graduate students for your first two years. Hardly anything special or to brag about. At least with community colleges you aren't getting taught by grad students who are mostly fresh out of their undergraduate degree themselves.
I actually felt I got more attention at community college. If you were having problems in a class, you could just walk into the classroom and talk to your professor. At my transfer University, you had to request an appointment with a professor. The professors at community college seem to care more about teaching, while the professors at my university seemed to only teach because they had to in order to get research grants, and research was all they cared about.
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