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Old 07-03-2008, 11:24 PM
 
Location: State of Superior
8,632 posts, read 14,227,470 times
Reputation: 2777

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bchris02 View Post
I bet you're a teenager living at home that doesn't have to worry about this economy. I know that if gas prices keep rising like they have been doing, MUCH of the country will soon be out of work. Yes we need to get off oil, but not if it means economic collapse. Raising taxes in a severe recession like this is a VERY dangerous thing. Consumers are strapped enough as it is, adding more taxes on gasoline will destroy whats left of the economy. You liberals hate chain retailers, but they are a huge part of our economy. Think of all the families that will be affected if they go under. Plus, you want to tax gasoline to $9/gallon to encourge use of alternatives, but as of now, there ARE NO practical alternatives available. When people have another option, we'll talk. Right now, our economy depends on oil.
We will someday inherit this mess you old guys got this Country into . Dad says Regan started it , He was the worst President ever. Ether way , we are where we are now, like it or not. Couldn't be a better time than now to start fixing the problem. The extra tax money, for now , could go towards fixing the housing problem. The Oil companies should kick in also , and at the end of the year everyone gets a tax rebate for energy expenses.We also need a windfall profit tax on the oil giants that would go directly to retiring the war debt. Bush said oil will pay for the war , so , here is his chance to prove it.
My car runs on used cooking oil, me and my buddies got AG. class credits for the conversion, it was simple to do , and the VW gets 40 mpg , always did , I was told, and , its 30 years old !, We are doing our part !
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Old 07-04-2008, 12:30 PM
 
Location: Charlotte, NC (in my mind)
7,946 posts, read 15,390,015 times
Reputation: 4544
Quote:
Originally Posted by darstar View Post
We will someday inherit this mess you old guys got this Country into . Dad says Regan started it , He was the worst President ever. Ether way , we are where we are now, like it or not. Couldn't be a better time than now to start fixing the problem. The extra tax money, for now , could go towards fixing the housing problem. The Oil companies should kick in also , and at the end of the year everyone gets a tax rebate for energy expenses.We also need a windfall profit tax on the oil giants that would go directly to retiring the war debt. Bush said oil will pay for the war , so , here is his chance to prove it.
My car runs on used cooking oil, me and my buddies got AG. class credits for the conversion, it was simple to do , and the VW gets 40 mpg , always did , I was told, and , its 30 years old !, We are doing our part !
Grow up and do some research. The housing problem will correct itself. Any further bailout will further depress the value of the dollar. 95% of Americans are paying their mortgages anyways. That number will FREEFALL if we see 25-30% unemployment. That is what will happen if gas is taxed to $9/gallon. I work for a major retailer in the corporate office and if these gas prices don't fall by the Christmas holiday season, we will probably fold in January. MANY other retailers will be doing the same, and our economy will collapse like a house of cards. Is that what you want?

Windfall profits were tried by Jimmy Carter and it didn't do any good then, so it wont work now. It will just pass the cost onto consumers. Thats great if you and your homies are running on cooking oil, but most people aren't. There isn't enough cooking oil to run the entire country on it. There isn't enough land available to grow corn for ethanol. Most people need to get to work using a gas engine, and need to have jobs. Its easy to say this stuff when mommy and daddy are giving you everything on a silver platter, but when you actually depend on this economy for your survival, your opinion changes a bit.
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Old 07-04-2008, 12:59 PM
 
Location: Ohio
21,262 posts, read 15,049,712 times
Reputation: 17676
Quote:
Originally Posted by 70Ford View Post
How can you win a war without gas?
Um, because military vehicles use diesel?

The good thing about the heavy sour crude in Prudhoe Bay, and the heavy sour crude in the ANWR and the heavy sour crude in the Bakken Field in North Dakota is that while it only produces about 6 gallons of gasoline per 42 gallon barrel, which will drive gasoline prices in the US up to $12/gallon, it produces a lot of diesel fuel and fuel oil.
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Old 07-04-2008, 03:29 PM
 
Location: State of Superior
8,632 posts, read 14,227,470 times
Reputation: 2777
Quote:
Originally Posted by bchris02 View Post
Grow up and do some research. The housing problem will correct itself. Any further bailout will further depress the value of the dollar. 95% of Americans are paying their mortgages anyways. That number will FREEFALL if we see 25-30% unemployment. That is what will happen if gas is taxed to $9/gallon. I work for a major retailer in the corporate office and if these gas prices don't fall by the Christmas holiday season, we will probably fold in January. MANY other retailers will be doing the same, and our economy will collapse like a house of cards. Is that what you want?

Windfall profits were tried by Jimmy Carter and it didn't do any good then, so it wont work now. It will just pass the cost onto consumers. Thats great if you and your homies are running on cooking oil, but most people aren't. There isn't enough cooking oil to run the entire country on it. There isn't enough land available to grow corn for ethanol. Most people need to get to work using a gas engine, and need to have jobs. Its easy to say this stuff when mommy and daddy are giving you everything on a silver platter, but when you actually depend on this economy for your survival, your opinion changes a bit.
What about the Auto companies ? I guess just let GM fail , is that your way ? What you are saying , is the same old stuff. Its time for a change , we can't go on and on like this. The dollar keeps falling , China holds a lot of paper., we are becoming a third world country right before our eyes , all the while , the old Guys that are running things, just stick their heads in the sand. The Governments roll should be to establish stop gaps, and see to it everyone is on a level playing field. The oil interest are not being controlled. Free market is great, but there are limits.
I think things have already gotten out of control, and , its too late to fix it.We will need to crash the dollar , and , start over. Wipe the debt , clean. Other Countries have done it , like Brazil , and , today they are emerging as the most progressive country in the western hemisphere. No corn for ethanol, ether. Diesel is the future , until alternative sources come on line., yet , we have the highest diesel prices in the world. ( Along with Canada , and , thats because its controlled by tariffs ) tax the gas , and people will go diesel, it gets much better mileage, and omits no carbon monoxide.The auto companies were about to come out with a full range of diesel products , but , due to the premium price over gas , they pulled back. Now , they are in the tank.
You have little to say about a fix, just throw up your hands , and complain , along party lines , and talking points,. This is serious stuff , the sooner we get off oil , the better we , and , the world will be. We need to start now, painful as it may be for a few years. I have faith in the American way, If we could all pull together , as we did under Roosevelt , for the war effort, we can do it again , as the world leader in alternative energy, the time is now !
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Old 07-04-2008, 03:46 PM
 
Location: Charlotte, NC (in my mind)
7,946 posts, read 15,390,015 times
Reputation: 4544
Quote:
Originally Posted by darstar View Post
What about the Auto companies ? I guess just let GM fail , is that your way ? What you are saying , is the same old stuff. Its time for a change , we can't go on and on like this. The dollar keeps falling , China holds a lot of paper., we are becoming a third world country right before our eyes , all the while , the old Guys that are running things, just stick their heads in the sand. The Governments roll should be to establish stop gaps, and see to it everyone is on a level playing field. The oil interest are not being controlled. Free market is great, but there are limits.
I think things have already gotten out of control, and , its too late to fix it.We will need to crash the dollar , and , start over. Wipe the debt , clean. Other Countries have done it , like Brazil , and , today they are emerging as the most progressive country in the western hemisphere. No corn for ethanol, ether. Diesel is the future , until alternative sources come on line., yet , we have the highest diesel prices in the world. ( Along with Canada , and , thats because its controlled by tariffs ) tax the gas , and people will go diesel, it gets much better mileage, and omits no carbon monoxide.The auto companies were about to come out with a full range of diesel products , but , due to the premium price over gas , they pulled back. Now , they are in the tank.
You have little to say about a fix, just throw up your hands , and complain , along party lines , and talking points,. This is serious stuff , the sooner we get off oil , the better we , and , the world will be. We need to start now, painful as it may be for a few years. I have faith in the American way, If we could all pull together , as we did under Roosevelt , for the war effort, we can do it again , as the world leader in alternative energy, the time is now !
None of this stuff makes any sense. This is why I am glad the voting age is at least 18.
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Old 07-04-2008, 04:42 PM
 
Location: America
6,987 posts, read 15,757,084 times
Reputation: 2073
Quote:
Originally Posted by bchris02 View Post
None of this stuff makes any sense. This is why I am glad the voting age is at least 18.
actually he is talking about debt deflation which is what is going on right now. You should do research on that.
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Old 07-04-2008, 07:30 PM
 
48,509 posts, read 86,088,090 times
Reputation: 18105
Well seeing as how conges is at the july 4th recess and the new democrtic congress has failed to lead on the enrgy crisis or anyhting else;not much is likely to get done until after the election.Even then it will take a compromise agreement.
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Old 07-04-2008, 08:03 PM
 
Location: State of Superior
8,632 posts, read 14,227,470 times
Reputation: 2777
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Style View Post
actually he is talking about debt deflation which is what is going on right now. You should do research on that.
Stagflation , that dreaded word , tis here NOW !
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Old 07-06-2008, 01:57 AM
 
3,283 posts, read 4,752,776 times
Reputation: 753
Quote:
Originally Posted by darstar View Post
What about the Auto companies ? I guess just let GM fail , is that your way ? What you are saying , is the same old stuff. Its time for a change , we can't go on and on like this. The dollar keeps falling , China holds a lot of paper., we are becoming a third world country right before our eyes , all the while , the old Guys that are running things, just stick their heads in the sand. The Governments roll should be to establish stop gaps, and see to it everyone is on a level playing field. The oil interest are not being controlled. Free market is great, but there are limits.
I think things have already gotten out of control, and , its too late to fix it.We will need to crash the dollar , and , start over. Wipe the debt , clean. Other Countries have done it , like Brazil , and , today they are emerging as the most progressive country in the western hemisphere. No corn for ethanol, ether. Diesel is the future , until alternative sources come on line., yet , we have the highest diesel prices in the world. ( Along with Canada , and , thats because its controlled by tariffs ) tax the gas , and people will go diesel, it gets much better mileage, and omits no carbon monoxide.The auto companies were about to come out with a full range of diesel products , but , due to the premium price over gas , they pulled back. Now , they are in the tank.
You have little to say about a fix, just throw up your hands , and complain , along party lines , and talking points,. This is serious stuff , the sooner we get off oil , the better we , and , the world will be. We need to start now, painful as it may be for a few years. I have faith in the American way, If we could all pull together , as we did under Roosevelt , for the war effort, we can do it again , as the world leader in alternative energy, the time is now !
so you think that all of this is the fault of the "FREE MARKET"???????????
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Old 07-06-2008, 07:16 AM
 
Location: State of Superior
8,632 posts, read 14,227,470 times
Reputation: 2777
Quote:
Originally Posted by 58robbo View Post
so you think that all of this is the fault of the "FREE MARKET"???????????
NO, its not that simple. People are always looking for someone , or some thing to blame for the ills of the world....problem here is , there is no free market , never has been. As a buzz word , it sounds great , however , free , should mean equal , a fair balance between countries , markets , labor , and politics. Not happening, China manipulates its currency , Japan has trade policies that only allow exports ,no imports.The US and Canada conspire to keep fuel prices high in both Countries , when , even with higher tax , Canadian producers could sell for less at the pump. The list goes on and on.........free market ? , a lota crap !
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