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Old 07-15-2008, 12:41 AM
 
Location: Chicago
38,690 posts, read 91,092,851 times
Reputation: 29523

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Quote:
Originally Posted by teatime View Post
When Starbucks sweeped into my former city of 150,000 people they did so dramatically, building five stores in less than a year. Now, it took Starbucks a while to reach our market, which had been served well by "mom and pop" coffee houses that provided 50 times the "atmosphere," good and less expensive products, and wonderful meeting places for a quiet lunch, poetry readings, and live entertainment in the evenings. My son worked at one of them in high school.

In rolls Starbucks and, within two years of opening, put all of the "mom and pops" out of business. People wanted the Starbucks name and wouldn't patronize the locally owned places unless there was a special "event," like a popular band playing. It was a huge shame! The locals' business dropped so dramatically that they lost the ability to compete in no time. In my current city, we have a popular locally owned coffee house, Peet's, Java City, and one freestanding Starbucks and another inside a store. They haven't monopolized here and I'm glad.

So, Starbucks is getting what's coming to them, IMO. The locally owned coffee places and even other chains are more reasonably priced than Starbucks. Plus, their places are cozy, soothing, and inviting. You WANT to linger, meet friends there, and relax. I've never been to a Starbucks that I couldn't wait to leave; admittedly, their prices and loud, chaotic atmosphere kept me from going there more than a few times and mostly when I wanted coffee or chai tea latte and there was nothing else nearby.
That's one way of looking at it.

Here's another: In a ton of other markets, Starbucks generated a bunch of interest in the "coffee house" concept that had been dormant since the beatnik days, spawning a secondary coffee-house market as an alternative to Starbucks that didn't exist before Starbucks came around because people didn't know they needed an alternative to Starbucks. Kind of like how virtually every radio talk show host in America owes the existence of their industry (and subsequently their jobs) to Rush Limbaugh, whether certain among them want to admit it or not.

And while you're and striking a blow for the little guy while indulging in schadenfreude that "Starbucks is getting what is coming to them," think about the fact that over ten thousand people will be losing compensation packages -- including full benefits, even for part-time employees -- that no mom-and-pop coffee house provides because they cannot afford to.

But hey, at least your looking out for the little guy! Just try not to spit out your independently brewed coffee while you're patting yourself on the back so hard.
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Old 07-15-2008, 02:22 AM
 
3,283 posts, read 4,757,208 times
Reputation: 753
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drover View Post
That's one way of looking at it.

Here's another: In a ton of other markets, Starbucks generated a bunch of interest in the "coffee house" concept that had been dormant since the beatnik days, spawning a secondary coffee-house market as an alternative to Starbucks that didn't exist before Starbucks came around because people didn't know they needed an alternative to Starbucks. Kind of like how virtually every radio talk show host in America owes the existence of their industry (and subsequently their jobs) to Rush Limbaugh, whether certain among them want to admit it or not.

And while you're and striking a blow for the little guy while indulging in schadenfreude that "Starbucks is getting what is coming to them," think about the fact that over ten thousand people will be losing compensation packages -- including full benefits, even for part-time employees -- that no mom-and-pop coffee house provides because they cannot afford to.

But hey, at least your looking out for the little guy! Just try not to spit out your independently brewed coffee while you're patting yourself on the back so hard.

i like the fact that you've taken the time to DEBATE! it's always good to consider the other side no matter how much i personally disagree with it!
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Old 07-15-2008, 07:54 AM
 
485 posts, read 1,805,467 times
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Baltimore spawned a coffee empire of it's own-Donna's.

There was one, then they were everywhere.

As I heard the story, when I briefly lived in Seattle, 1989, the origin of Starbuck's went like this:

A Boeing engineer went to Italy on vacation, and it rained the whole time.

He spent his time in the local coffee house, got to love the variety of drinks there, and decided to found a similar place when he got home.

Seattle is a coffee drinking town-the place is colder than week old penguin dung, and damp, too-and offering good coffee to people used to the acidic muck that used to be standard caught on quick.

The idea of a non-alcoholic place to sit for a while appealed to Seattle as well, it's not a big drinking town-from what I saw, it's full of dried out lushes!

From one bay in Pike Place Market, the idea spread.

Donna's similarly began and spread-an alternative to getting hammered every night was nice, even though Baltimore is the alcoholic's Disneyland.

But once the idea was entrenched, competition appeared-the equipment isn't that expensive, and it is, after all, a small scale sort of operation at heart.

Starbuck's seems to have over-reached.
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Old 07-15-2008, 09:55 AM
 
3,698 posts, read 10,393,050 times
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Starbucks was founded by two teachers and a writer, not by a Boeing engineer. Their inspiration was Peet's Coffee in San Francisco. Originally, Starbucks only sold coffee beans. Howard Schultz worked for Starbucks in the early 80s, and he went to Italy and came back with the idea that Starbucks should sell espresso, but the founders weren't interested. He started a competing coffee chain that wound up buying Starbucks after a few years, and all of those chains stores were re-branded as Starbucks and the massive expansion began.
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Old 07-15-2008, 10:14 AM
 
485 posts, read 1,805,467 times
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This is how you find thing out!

Thanks.
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Old 07-15-2008, 01:55 PM
 
Location: Papillion
2,589 posts, read 9,684,159 times
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The first round of closings listed:
July 2008 U.S. Store Closure List
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Old 07-15-2008, 02:10 PM
 
Location: in purgurtory in London
3,721 posts, read 3,625,378 times
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I'm not a coffee drinker nor do I drink tea. I just don’t do warm drinks. It's freshly squeezed juices for me in the mornings and on particularly happy Sundays even a bloody Mary with brunch. A few months back while reading my favourite music blog I came across an interesting piece about Howard Shultz by Lefsetz who blogs music with a bit of common sense politics and economics thrown in. Here is his take on a Wall Street Article about Shultz and Starbucks but using it as an example for musicians trying to establish and market themselves themselves.

But hey, what a ride the company had and Shultz is still a happy camper.

Lefsetz Letter » Blog Archive » The Starbucks Effect

Last edited by Raggy dee Ann; 07-15-2008 at 02:32 PM..
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Old 07-15-2008, 02:17 PM
 
Location: Ohio
21,311 posts, read 15,089,573 times
Reputation: 17741
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drover View Post
And while you're and striking a blow for the little guy while indulging in schadenfreude that "Starbucks is getting what is coming to them," think about the fact that over ten thousand people will be losing compensation packages -- including full benefits, even for part-time employees -- that no mom-and-pop coffee house provides because they cannot afford to.
I'm thinking about "over ten thousand people" who probably spent hours a week on the internet, but never took even 5 lousy minutes to conduct a little research into the stability of Starsucks or of the coffee commodity market.

And now they're going to whine and cry and expect me to bail them out.
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Old 07-15-2008, 02:29 PM
 
Location: Ohio
21,311 posts, read 15,089,573 times
Reputation: 17741
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Style View Post
If you knew ANYTHING about the world you would see the directo correlation between crime and social circumstances. Go crack open a book written by a notable sociologist and then come back and talk to me.
I have read numerous sociology books on crime. There is no correlation between poverty and crime. Crime is motivated by emotions like greed, lust, envy, jealousy, power and revenge and none of that is related to poverty.

If we were to accept your illogical premises as true, 3/5th of the planet would be nothing but murderous criminal anarchy. There are many cities on the planet where the average monthly wage is $30 or less, and often there's no electricity or running water, but they aren't robbing or killing each other.
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Old 07-15-2008, 02:37 PM
 
Location: Tampa Bay
1,020 posts, read 3,112,510 times
Reputation: 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by bchris02 View Post
Sad, one of the hallmarks of this decade can't even withstand the current economy. I know I haven't been to Starbucks since gas hit $4/gallon. Neverthless, Starbucks went into many markets that were NOT Starbucks markets. It repeated the mistake of Krispy Kreme. A brand like that loses its specialty when its in every hick town and every gas station in the US.
LMAO! You paid way too much for your coffee sorry. Their specialty was their price gouging.
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