U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Covid-19 Information Page
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 08-01-2008, 05:02 AM
 
Location: Sitting on a bar stool. Guinness in hand.
4,429 posts, read 5,811,944 times
Reputation: 1708

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by BankREO View Post
We seem to confuse real money that is made off of making real things compared to interest earned in the form of a double-book entry on a bank ledger. Interest and Real Money are not the same thing but we treat them as such so that we are in a position where we keep spending beyond our means and borrowing to pay our bills.
What are "real things"?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 08-01-2008, 11:07 AM
 
Location: Seattle, WA
209 posts, read 549,246 times
Reputation: 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by baystater View Post
What are "real things"?
IMHO it is anything that is produced and tangible. What I don't consider real is interest on financial instruments. I am not saying we should not have interest at all, what I am saying is we should treat it differently than actually money that brought into existence through production.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-01-2008, 11:17 AM
 
Location: Seattle, WA
209 posts, read 549,246 times
Reputation: 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Humanoid View Post
Blah blah. I will repeat, the money supply is weakening. All measures (and even estimates of M3) show weakening in the money supply over the last few months. This is not what you'd expect if the environment was becoming highly inflationary. Copying and pasting form wikipedia is all keen and all, but the recent data can be found at the fed:

FRB: H.6 Release--Money Stock and Debt Measures--July 31, 2008

First off I was posting the definition for anyone who would be reading this post and not know what M0-3 meant. Second, M3 would be what U.S. Treasuries would fall under and we are issuing more of those then we ever have and it is safe to say some more bailouts are on the way. Lastly, our environment is inflationary, I am not sure where you are shopping but prices are going up and food boxes are decreasing in size to make it look like they are not raising prices. Proof is in the pudding.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-01-2008, 11:39 AM
 
Location: Sitting on a bar stool. Guinness in hand.
4,429 posts, read 5,811,944 times
Reputation: 1708
Quote:
Originally Posted by BankREO View Post
IMHO it is anything that is produced and tangible. What I don't consider real is interest on financial instruments. I am not saying we should not have interest at all, what I am saying is we should treat it differently than actually money that brought into existence through production.
What other than Food, Steel, and some medicines does America really produce anymore in any significant quantity to justify the dollar being as strong as it is now?
To be honest nothing really tangible makes the dollar worth that much. It more of faith by U.S. citizens and world citizens that make the dollar worth anything at all. Actually it's faith in America that makes the dollar worth anything. Unfortunately I got this bad feeling that in the short term the faith in the dollar is not that strong, so we will be weak for while.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-01-2008, 04:17 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles Area
3,306 posts, read 3,560,378 times
Reputation: 592
Quote:
Second, M3 would be what U.S. Treasuries would fall under and we are issuing more of those then we ever have and it is safe to say some more bailouts are on the way.
The rate of growth in M3 estimates is slowing, see:

Alternate Data Series

Quote:
Lastly, our environment is inflationary, I am not sure where you are shopping but prices are going up and food boxes are decreasing in size to make it look like they are not raising prices. Proof is in the pudding.
So, after I show you the money supply is weakening you resort to this... Price increases is not a measure of inflation, rather its a possible effect of inflation. Prices can increase for other reasons and given that the money supply is weakening and credit contracting the price increases are unlikely to be caused by true inflation.

Quote:
What other than Food, Steel, and does America really produce anymore in any significant quantity to justify the dollar being as strong as it is now?
Cars, trucks, planes, industrial robots, farm equipment, software, computers, mainframes, routers, clothes, tools etc etc. The list is rather long. The idea that the US doesn't "make anything" is very inaccurate.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-01-2008, 04:24 PM
 
94 posts, read 303,208 times
Reputation: 45
I am in general support of the bill. However, the bill removes the provision for capital gains exclusion where the homeowners have lived in the house for at least 2 years before turning it into a rental property and prior to the sale of the property. That is, you will be taxed on the capital gains if you rent out the house at any point, unlike in the past where there is no tax on capital gains on the first $250 - $500K. This is effective January 1, 2009.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-01-2008, 05:03 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles Area
3,306 posts, read 3,560,378 times
Reputation: 592
Quote:
That is, you will be taxed on the capital gains if you rent out the house at any point, unlike in the past where there is no tax on capital gains on the first $250 - $500K. This is effective January 1, 2009
My understanding of this provision is that it removes the 2 year rule and instead you will be taxed on your capitals gains based on the ratio of the years it was rented/primary residence. So if you have lived in a place for 10 years and rent it out for 2, you won't pay tax on the entire capital gains rather 20% of it.

I liked this provision. Real estate investors have gotten a free lunch way too long. Now if they would just fix the mortgage interest deduction.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-01-2008, 05:13 PM
 
Location: Chino, CA
1,458 posts, read 3,008,453 times
Reputation: 553
Quote:
Originally Posted by Humanoid View Post
My understanding of this provision is that it removes the 2 year rule and instead you will be taxed on your capitals gains based on the ratio of the years it was rented/primary residence. So if you have lived in a place for 10 years and rent it out for 2, you won't pay tax on the entire capital gains rather 20% of it.

I liked this provision. Real estate investors have gotten a free lunch way too long. Now if they would just fix the mortgage interest deduction.
Interesting... it only applies for rentals and investment properties not on the principal home someone lives in. So people can still "move" and still get the tax benefit. This section, I guess, is to thwart those "flippers" and "investors" which is good/bad for some. On the flip side, it'll provide Uncle Sam with some more tax revenues.

The Hidden Tax Traps In The Housing-rescue Bill - FOXBusiness.com (http://www.foxbusiness.com/story/markets/industries/media/hidden-tax-traps-housing-rescue/ - broken link)

-chuck22b
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-02-2008, 06:28 PM
 
706 posts, read 1,188,477 times
Reputation: 438
This Paulsen and Bernanke are like carnival barkers. They go on TV every week and talk about how they are for the strong dollar. Then they set about to do everything in their power to destroy it. Paulsen is totally beholden to Goldman Sachs and wall Street.

As Georgie Bush likes to say, "God Bless America" , we're gonna need it the next few years.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-02-2008, 06:33 PM
 
Location: Washington State
389 posts, read 967,647 times
Reputation: 251
Oh good. Maybe this means housing prices won't go back down to a reasonable and affordable level.

/Sarcasm
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:23 AM.

© 2005-2020, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top