U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Thread summary:

GM bailout: taxes, interest, pension, making money, market.

Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 11-17-2008, 03:04 PM
 
Location: Yes
2,660 posts, read 6,280,172 times
Reputation: 899

Advertisements

Forgive me if someone has already brought up this idea. To my knowledge, I have not seen this point-of-view on the forum regarding the bailout (of course, I have not read every post).

Anyways, I was on my lunch break - and I started to think about this bailout from a one-person perspective ... and it really brings up an interesting question.

Based on the general assumption that the 700 billion bailout will cost the average taxpayer appx. $2300 (which, of course, if the investment comes through, will hopefully cost the taxpayer $0 or even be a profit for the taxpayer), the proposed $25 billion GM bailout will cost somewhere around $80 per taxpayer. By the way, feel free to correct me if I assumed wrong.

So here is the question:

Are you, as a person, willing to take the risk of losing $80 of your money in order to keep thousands of your fellow Americans in their jobs during this tough economy? Or, are you idealogically opposed to the thought of a taxpayer bailout to the point that you are okay with the cuts of thousands of employees from auto manufacturing along with many other auto-related services?

I don't mean for that to be a loaded question, and I know there are other issues such as "it was supposed to go to banks" and "failure has to happen in healthy capatalism" ... but that is the best way I could think to word it. Maybe I am a bit skewed in my answer, as I work in a separate industry that will be greatly impacted by a failure of our main auto industry leaders ... at least in today's economy. But, personally, (and I would like to think I would be this way no matter what job I had) I am okay with risking a mere $80 of my tax money in order to avoid this big ripple ... even if it is a catch22 theoretically. But, I also understand the other point of view. I do not like the philosophy of "failure is not an option" in general (cough - NCLB). But, I have to say in the same respect, I do not think socialism is an evil word as many portray. I guess I'm caught in the middle, and hoping for the best from my $80.

Your thoughts?

Last edited by Azalea City Man; 11-17-2008 at 03:25 PM..
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 11-17-2008, 03:07 PM
 
Location: Kansas
3,855 posts, read 12,279,712 times
Reputation: 1722
billions...with a 'b'.....not millions...with an 'm'
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-17-2008, 03:16 PM
 
31,371 posts, read 33,886,974 times
Reputation: 14934
I think that there is a more fundamental question beyond simply protecting jobs. The US is ever increasingly becoming a non-productive economy. When I say that what I mean is that 70% of GDP is based upon consumer spending. To my way of thinking, the US has to pursue a policy of protecting basic industry, folks who actually make things of value. If we can understand the dangers of being dependent on foreign oil, why can we not gain the same understanding when it comes to basic industry, which auto manufacturing is a major part?
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-17-2008, 03:24 PM
 
Location: Yes
2,660 posts, read 6,280,172 times
Reputation: 899
Quote:
Originally Posted by drjones96 View Post
billions...with a 'b'.....not millions...with an 'm'
whoops

That's what happens when you are dovetailing
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-17-2008, 03:41 PM
 
Location: Rockland County New York
2,984 posts, read 5,440,761 times
Reputation: 1295
What worries me about the Auto bailout is that GM, Ford and Chrysler will be able to recoup their losses and open up plants in China. Just think they can and probably will use tax payer money to build their cars in Asia.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-17-2008, 03:58 PM
 
Location: Oak Point, TX
7,616 posts, read 12,567,385 times
Reputation: 4608
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stac2007 View Post
What worries me about the Auto bailout is that GM, Ford and Chrysler will be able to recoup their losses and open up plants in China. Just think they can and probably will use tax payer money to build their cars in Asia.
Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Mitsubishi...they all do that here.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-17-2008, 04:19 PM
Rei
 
Location: Los Angeles
494 posts, read 1,674,812 times
Reputation: 233
@oscottscotto
I don't know where you got the numbers ($2300, $80) from.

Quote:
Are you, as a person, willing to take the risk of losing $80 of your money in order to keep thousands of your fellow Americans in their jobs during this tough economy?
The problem is not the $80. The issue here is at what point are we gonna stop bailing "your fellow Americans?"
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-17-2008, 04:24 PM
 
Location: Texas
4,937 posts, read 7,163,965 times
Reputation: 5512
This isn't a bail out. This is a big labor extortion of the American taxpayer. Greed and mismanagement of union pensions. Why do you think Pelosi and Obama are pushing so hard for this? So union fat cats can meet their obligations to the UAW members and people can continue making $30 an hour on an assembly line, doing work that someone out of middle school could do.

We are getting shafted by just about every single special interest out there. Time for the revolution.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-17-2008, 04:41 PM
Status: "Retired and happy about it" (set 9 days ago)
 
Location: WA
5,542 posts, read 22,679,213 times
Reputation: 6303
Giving GM money will just prolong the downward spiral... when you have a friend that is going broke because of behavior problems do you give him/her money to continue or insist that a change in behavior is required?
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-17-2008, 04:52 PM
 
28,461 posts, read 76,491,239 times
Reputation: 18553
Tell you what, the IRS has not finalized the tax forms for this year. Let's put a check box on there so that people can just send in more dough to help out the automakers. Think they'll raise $25B, hmm?
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2021, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top