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Old 01-01-2009, 07:44 PM
 
Location: Lafayette, Louisiana
14,089 posts, read 24,217,395 times
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According to Bernard Goldberg of CBS Evening News, the press did the same thing to Bush senior. When he was running for re-election there were nightly news stories about lines at the soup kitchens. Once Clinton was elected, those soup kitchen stories ceased but the lines never went away.
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Old 01-02-2009, 07:04 AM
 
Location: NJ/NY
13,011 posts, read 10,978,967 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sailordave View Post
The recession of the Carter years included over 11% unemployment and double digit inflation and yet some in the press were saying this is the worst recession since the great depression. They overhyped this recession because of their hatred for President Bush but once Obama is sworn in as President then their stories about the recession will virtually disappear.
You are right about the press and their blatant anti-Bush/pro-Obama stance, and I'm not a big fan of Jimmy Carter either, but unemployment didn't hit it's peak of 10.8% until the end of the recession. In fact, we were well into the Reagan years when we had that type of unemployment. When Carter left office it was still around 7-8% which was right where it was when he took office. This is not to say it was Reagan's fault. He inherited the mess, I am just saying that the recession is still in it's beginning phases, and it may well be the worst since the depression. That remains to be seen. We are in a pretty severe downward spiral, and debt was much lower and savings were much higher back in the Carter years, but cheap gas and cheap mortgages make for a pretty good stimulus package. So who knows?

I do know that the media cant make it go away no matter how much they like Obama. They can try to hype up the market again, but people still have to walk past all the empty storefronts with for rent signs from main street to Madison Avenue. And they cant hide rising unemployment rates either. The same way people knew we were in a recession long before they announced it, people will know when it is over, regardless of what the media says.
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Old 01-02-2009, 08:17 AM
 
Location: Charlotte, NC (in my mind)
7,946 posts, read 15,388,737 times
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Anybody think the recession itself is a self fulfilling prophecy? The media was talking about how bad the economy was when GDP was still topping 4 percent. The banks may have been in trouble but the consumer didn't collapse until mid-Sept when media coverage of the bailout sent the country into panic.
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Old 01-02-2009, 09:56 AM
 
Location: Orlando, Florida
43,857 posts, read 45,493,767 times
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I don't know if I can word this thought correctly, but it seems to me that recession is a word for economic reality. There are years we live within that reality and then there are the years that we live outside of reality (frenzied home building constantly bigger better and over appraised, all the dot-coms, living on credit, etc). The problem with living outside of reality is that it eventually folds up and we are faced living back within the reality of things again. So in a weird way, recession can ground us and catch our attention before we spin off in some magical financial thinking that just doesn't work.
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Old 01-02-2009, 12:45 PM
 
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GloryB:

Despite your feelings, the fact that construction workers were paid with REAL money when there was HUGE employment in the home building sector and now that has all dried up is big chunk.

There is NOTHING WRONG with responsible lending, expansion of the housing market, wealth creation through new technology or any of the other realities of the past decade.

Right now there is HUGE uncertainty about the near term prospects of the US economy coupled with the whole switch-over from non-stop administrations with a very pro-investment bias from a period that started more than 20 years ago to an administration that has picked some people that seem LIKELY to continue down that broad path, but without ANY overt statement of the same. Toss in the HOLE that many consumers have dug for themselves are OF COURSE things are not rosy.

Don't let those things obscure the fact that a RECESSION is NEVER A GOOD THING. When the economy shrinks NO ONE ought to be happy. If the recession is deep REALLY BAD THINGS happen and consequences are that FAR MORE PEOPLE lose ground.

There is nothing 'magical' about the proper use of credit. When people have a future orientation that is realistic and appropriate they will behave in ways that see expansion that helps MORE people have a better life.

If you've read or seen anything about "micro lending" in the DEVELOPING world the principles are pretty much universal -- give people ACCESS to capital so that they can start a business/ provide a service and in short order others BENEFIT.

Of course there were abuses of credit in the US housing market, and the economy has responded harshly. My feeling is TOO MUCH of this reaction is overblown, and if the right SENTIMENT again is fostered by the new administration there is an excellent possibility that people will behave in a more rational way.

Whenever you are talking about something that is so driven by emotion and "good feelings" it is really hard to predict how long it will take to turn around...
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Old 01-02-2009, 02:34 PM
 
Location: NJ/NY
13,011 posts, read 10,978,967 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bchris02 View Post
Anybody think the recession itself is a self fulfilling prophecy? The media was talking about how bad the economy was when GDP was still topping 4 percent. The banks may have been in trouble but the consumer didn't collapse until mid-Sept when media coverage of the bailout sent the country into panic.
I think you are right. The recession IS a self fulfilling prophecy, which in itself is the problem. Do we really want the economy to be that unstable? Wouldn't it be less prone to the whim of confidence driven reaction if it was made up of more real capital and less debt?
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Old 01-02-2009, 06:10 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles, Ca
2,884 posts, read 5,287,974 times
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Is Obama going to continue Bush's era of fear and paranoia?

I think it's been a very interesting coincidence...

-The 9/11 scare
-Remember all the fear in 2001-2003? The colored alerts. The Bin Laden videos that "conveniently" showed up at opportun times? They were popping up like once every 9 months.
-Then the fear continued for awhile. They'd raise the alert level to orange. Then the dirty bomb fear. Padilla? What happened to him? Domestic terrorism.

Then that story ran dry. Then the Iraq WMD's. And mushrooms clouds.

Then there were no WMD's. The public started to catch onto the Iraq story....hmmm....and just as that ended. Now it's the economy!

Economic doom and gloom! You could be next!

This recession has been so bizarre. It took a year for a panel of "experts" to tell us what everyone knew all along.

The economy will eventually turn around. But they'll continue to jiggle with the unemployment numbers, cpi, etc. MSM are the last people to look to gauge the state of the economy.

My prediction. More media bias/propaganda. But people will turn to the internet for the truth. Hopefully MSM media influence will continue to decline.
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Old 01-02-2009, 10:50 PM
 
Location: Marietta, GA
7,858 posts, read 15,192,827 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John23 View Post
The 9/11 scare
Ah...so terrorists flying two airplanes into the WTC, one into the Pentagon, and crashing one in PA was just a "scare." Tell that to the families of the nearly 3000 Americans who lost their lives. People in this country have really let their ideology cloud their judgement, and their memories are waaaay too short. Those who don't learn the lessons of history are doomed to repeat its mistakes.
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Old 01-02-2009, 11:07 PM
 
Location: where you sip the tea of the breasts of the spinsters of Utica
8,299 posts, read 12,532,100 times
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I think it's good that the media and stock market investors are wildly optimistic in the face of continuing economic bad news .... look at the stock market soaring every time there's bad news about unemployment or manufacturing orders, or when Obama vows to throw trillions at the problem .....maybe that exuberance will cushion the fall somewhat.

I guess we'll have a better idea of what's in store for us by about April or May, which seems to be when the pollies think things will turn around, and when I predict that the stuff will start hitting the fan harder.
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Old 01-02-2009, 11:27 PM
 
4,711 posts, read 11,168,262 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neil0311 View Post
Ah...so terrorists flying two airplanes into the WTC, one into the Pentagon, and crashing one in PA was just a "scare." Tell that to the families of the nearly 3000 Americans who lost their lives. People in this country have really let their ideology cloud their judgement, and their memories are waaaay too short. Those who don't learn the lessons of history are doomed to repeat its mistakes.

I think he was referring to all the nonsense that occurred AFTER the 9/11 attacks, not the attacks themselves. We even attacked a country that had nothing whatever to do with it.

PS: I was at my desk in the Pentagon at 9:38 am on Sept 11, 2001. I lost several close friends. I still don't buy a lot of the rhetoric that was spewed afterwards...
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