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Between the shooting in NY, the cop shooter in PA, the murder suicide in WA state, and this Five dead in apparent murder-suicide | TimesDaily.com | The Times Daily | Florence, AL (http://www.timesdaily.com/article/20090407/NEWS/904079990/1011/NEWS?Title=Five-dead-in-apparent-murder-suicide - broken link) , are we starting to see the unraveling of society? I tend to look at economics as the study of group psychology. Society is nothing more than a group of people that have consciously or unconsciously decided to be a part of a system due a perceived benefit. When people can no longer see that benefit, we get social malaise. Our consumer/debt/fiat culture is clearing coming to an end. I fear more unrest as we transition to whatever direction the international money lenders decide to take us (NWO?). It's times like this however, that we have to be there for each other. Get involved in the community. Help others become self reliant. Teachers others the skills they need to get by. Time to get back to the basics and enjoy the simple things. Let go of all the crap you want and be happy with what you've got. This thread is dedicated to keeping a fellowship, highlighting more unfortunate social consequences of an apathetic society, and helping each other out, doing whatever we can to help a board member.
No'things have gone on for years but we now days see all the big drama.It is a violent soicety but in the end this is just a increase of things already.I guesss since we don't have to constantly think about survival;people begin thinking they are somehow not getting what they deserve. Has nothing to do with lenders or any conspriacy but about individauls doing these horrible things. Heck;we have had genertions having to face things like the great depression ; WWI;WWII that put a real hardship on most people.Many now days think they are stressed because they have to work hard;but in relity people wroked harder in ther past;faced loved ones in those wars etc. People IMO need to buckup and stop feeling sorry for themselves.;and that somewhere ;somehow there is a conspiracy that is working against them.I do believe that morally this country has gone downhill but all you have to do is turn on the TV to see that.
You're right, there have been a rash of mass murders/shootings going on...I think there was some study recently cited on TV news about the relationship between the economy and violence, so I do think that's definitely a part of what's going on...some people don't have strong social networks to help them defuse their frustration and feelings of futility..very sad to end a situation this way and take innocent people along with you...
We have people who have *never* not had. They've grown up with anything they wanted, married, worked for good money, pretended you owned what you bought with your credit cards and may have teens or up who know the same. Thus are clueless.
Those who were effected by other recessions of the past, who lost the apartment or figured out how many days the food would stretch are doing better because they have skills, and most importantly know they can. Those who have been homeless look at less money as nothing. We can see what the real basics are.
Some people when faced when sudden reversal click off into survival mode. You see what matters and what doesn't. Some learn to cope while spending most of their energy moruning, and suck all that energy into feeling sorry. Some just can't. The people who have killed family and such are the ladder.
Expect to see more. We still have major bubbles yet unburst which are going to make the last ones look minor. The difference in society now and in the 30's is that they knew hardship and weren't married to credit cards. They bought what they could afford. They could garden to eat. Now we have a generation or more of people who see themselves as having so much when most of it was bought on credit, so when you subtract that they see the reality. You have people programmed to get what the neighbors have. I would guess that boats are dropping in value right now along with homes.
In short we have a lot of people who simply are not prepared for less. And many are coping. They are discovering that simplicity and being frugal arent' all that bad. But some just can't. Or the internal problems they had are just too much to add loss of a job and all the family problems losing that income brings.
Add the atmosphere of anger that is growing and you have things primed for many sad moments.
But this is reality. We can't always have good times. In the end people have to depend on their own internal resourses and if they are lacking, or were never taught its sink or swim time. Those who can offer help can ease the burden but cannot do it for them.
Even something like the new frugal living forum is a help. Its amazing the people who see basic suggestions as new because they had never had to deal with that before. In the end we will come out better. When people learn that credit isn't an endless wishing well, and spending just to impress isn't going to help down the road, and that you can indeed live on much less than you think we will be a better society. That was what we were before we threw out all the soft cushions and that is what we will be.
But not everyone will make it. We should reach out and try to help, but help is only as good as the real deep down desire to confront reality that you need to make use of it.
Many people are fragile in the best of times. Add some stressors, and it gets worse. Not everyone pulls together, finds community, stays home with family more, etc. If someone was on the edge of things before, there's that final straw.
My neighbor, a very very hard-working carpenter/contractor, has seen his work dry up. What does his wife do? Berate him because he can't pay for $34,000 for the second year of daughter's private high school.
I think he should inform her that she can bloody well go out and find some ridiculous amount of money for private high school (and the local public one is quite good). Instead, he feels bad that he isn't providing at a high level. No pulling together there.
I imagine our nostalgic "memories" or thoughts about the 1930s are often that, nostalgic. Hard times might make people who are already well wrapped pull together, learn, etc. But it won't make less functional people more functional.
That said, I think those who hose down a room of strangers before committing suicide are either mentally ill (clearly so) or have badly deranged personality disorders, where they want others to suffer along with them. Selfish, as ever.
I also think people are more isolated now. The Internet and TV did that to us. We need to break away from those things once in a while and get out and about. Interact. Get outside.
I do believe that constant layoffs culture of our corporations now is detrimental psychologically. I now have PST and I wake up at night panicked and have other physical stress related manifestations - because I am so scared I am going to lose my job again. I have experienced 3 layoffs in 11 years.
And I also believe that the govt. needs to address the problems with mental illness in this country. It seems to be increasing.
And I also believe that the govt. needs to address the problems with mental illness in this country. It seems to be increasing.
The US ruling classes themselves are mentally ill, so it is like the fox guarding the chicken coop.
Social malaise sets in when the ruling classes lose the creativity and the work ethic necessary to rule effectively.
I'll be your mirror (reflect who you are)
TexianPatriot has it right, we regenerate by focusing on the basics: family and local community.
In part, that may mean ploughing over golf courses and cultivating plants useful for food and fiber, using the fruits of the labor of our own hands to eat and manufacture clothes like it used to be, instead of waiting for these things to be shipped from overseas through a chain of strangers.
Location: Sitting on a bar stool. Guinness in hand.
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I would expect more suicides because of the economic conditions than mass murders. the pressures one is put under when one is behind the 8 ball money wise is tremendous. It is not just that your credit is ruined, Your paycheck garnished, Your assets are taken away.
It's those calls from hounding creditors basically threating you to pay up or else. It those letters that brow beat you and basically insult you when your behind. And most people that have been in or have know someone in these situations know that this goes on day after day, month after month. It's just that cumulative effect of being psychologically and intellectually beat up and bullied every day that may drive some to take drastic actions to escape or lash out against their persecutor.
Add on top of this the stigma our society put on those who are unable to pay their debt. I mean (at least in my experience) these folk are basically treated like lepers. No one want to touch these folk. It like there radioactive or something. Granted I think a bit of it has to do with the general negativity those folk exude because of the situation. But I also liken it to the those kids back in high school considered losers or misfits. You don't hang around them because you can run the risk looking bad yourself. At least that what think I've observed.
Now with the mass murders. I think that something deeper. I think that a situation of just anger at our society in general and less about economic situations. Granted there maybe some murder done in the name of money. But I think most would be more motivated by mental illness, religious beliefs, belief of a decadent society, and being generally bullied. I'm sure there are plenty of more reasons why, but I don't really economics.
^^^ I think some of these shootings are MK-Ultra influenced.
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