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Old 05-19-2009, 12:47 AM
 
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
12,460 posts, read 20,087,251 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by POhdNcrzy View Post
1. Inflation is much, much worse than 90% of the population seems to think it is. (And sort of as a corollary point, the US dollar is actually worth much, much less than 90% of the population seems to think it is.) (And the powers that be in the US are responsible for these misconceptions.)

2. We may have debts being destroyed and asset deflation. But the idea that the relative purchasing power of the US dollar is increasing or going to increase in any significant way is ludicrous in the extreme.
1.) Okay, how do you know this? How are you measuring inflation?

2.) Why?

Also, the difference in prices at grocery stores (or any retail store) is a product of price discrimination. Ideally the retailer would know exactly how much each person is willing to spend on a product and sell it to them for that price. But of course, people do not willing give up that information. Instead the retailer will use tricks to weed out that information. The cheaper products are made to look....well cheaper and of less quality. Despite the fact that they are often made in the same factories. This way only the people that can't afford the more expensive product buy them, the people with more money will continue to pay more. Its a way to selling the same product to two different people for two different prices.
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Old 05-19-2009, 08:10 AM
 
28,453 posts, read 85,379,084 times
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Default Really? What is the basis for this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by user_id View Post
1.) ... The cheaper products are made to look....well cheaper and of less quality. Despite the fact that they are often made in the same factories. This way only the people that can't afford the more expensive product buy them, the people with more money will continue to pay more. Its a way to selling the same product to two different people for two different prices.
I have heard / seen others say this and I have my doubts. I mean I have been in plants (on tours, mostly) where they make grocery items and I generally don't see anything other than "Tide" being made at Proctor & Gamble plants, "Dorito" nacho chips being made at the Frito-Lay plant,"Budwieser" being bottled at the Anheuser-Busch Plants", "CoffeMate" being made at Nestle plants and Kraft Macaroni & Cheese being made at the Kraft plant. I don't doubt that the companies that make some ingredients are "sold" to competitors {like Kraft selling the powdered cheese to companies that make store brand Mac N' Cheze} but that is not what you are suggesting.

Any examples?
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Old 05-19-2009, 03:27 PM
 
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
12,460 posts, read 20,087,251 times
Reputation: 4365
Quote:
Originally Posted by chet everett View Post
I have heard / seen others say this and I have my doubts. I mean I have been in plants (on tours, mostly) where they make grocery items and I generally don't see anything other than "Tide" being made at Proctor & Gamble plants, "Dorito" nacho chips being made at the Frito-Lay plant,"Budwieser" being bottled at the Anheuser-Busch Plants", "CoffeMate" being made at Nestle plants and Kraft Macaroni & Cheese being made at the Kraft plant. I don't doubt that the companies that make some ingredients are "sold" to competitors {like Kraft selling the powdered cheese to companies that make store brand Mac N' Cheze} but that is not what you are suggesting.
They don't make both at the same time, so going to a factory one day and only seeing X being made does not tell you much. But, I don't know of another product that Budweiser, etc makes under a cheaper label. I don't think the generic Mac & Cheese is made by Kraft as there is a bit of a difference in taste, although one is not better than the other.

The products that are often made in the same factories are things like canned foods, frozen vegetables, etc. But really, whether its made in the exact same factory or not is not that important. The quality of the products are the same. But there are many sorts of price discrimination, retailers have to rely on indirect discrimination. As the products are on the shelve together and there is no way to control who comes into the store when.

There are also cases where the products are different, but the difference in no way justifies the price differential. For example, the standard coffee vs the fancy coffee at Starbucks. The fancy coffee is more than double, yet the cost differential between the two is rather small. This is a way for Starbucks to push those with low price elasticity into purchasing the more expensive "fancy" drink where they make more money while still offering an option for those with high price elasticity. They segment the market by adding some flavor and whipped cream!
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Old 05-20-2009, 02:18 PM
 
Location: Rhode Island (Splash!)
1,150 posts, read 2,699,505 times
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I know that in the nutritional supplement industry, all kinds of players are making each others products and ingredients.
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Old 05-20-2009, 02:45 PM
 
28,453 posts, read 85,379,084 times
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Default I agree with that...

Quote:
Originally Posted by user_id View Post
They don't make both at the same time, so going to a factory one day and only seeing X being made does not tell you much. But, I don't know of another product that Budweiser, etc makes under a cheaper label. I don't think the generic Mac & Cheese is made by Kraft as there is a bit of a difference in taste, although one is not better than the other.

The products that are often made in the same factories are things like canned foods, frozen vegetables, etc. But really, whether its made in the exact same factory or not is not that important. The quality of the products are the same. But there are many sorts of price discrimination, retailers have to rely on indirect discrimination. As the products are on the shelve together and there is no way to control who comes into the store when.

There are also cases where the products are different, but the difference in no way justifies the price differential. For example, the standard coffee vs the fancy coffee at Starbucks. The fancy coffee is more than double, yet the cost differential between the two is rather small. This is a way for Starbucks to push those with low price elasticity into purchasing the more expensive "fancy" drink where they make more money while still offering an option for those with high price elasticity. They segment the market by adding some flavor and whipped cream!
The availability of alternatives is a GOOD THING when it comes to food and many other expenditures. I believe these alternatives tend to MODERATE or tamp-down price inflation.

I wonder how such thinking might get "tossed aside" when it comes to GENIUS plans like single payer health care and such which I fear as having the potential to both be decidedly ANTI-consumer friendly and lead to MASSIVE price inflation...
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Old 05-21-2009, 01:48 PM
 
20,724 posts, read 19,363,240 times
Reputation: 8288
Quote:
Originally Posted by chet everett View Post
I have heard / seen others say this and I have my doubts. I mean I have been in plants (on tours, mostly) where they make grocery items and I generally don't see anything other than "Tide" being made at Proctor & Gamble plants, "Dorito" nacho chips being made at the Frito-Lay plant,"Budwieser" being bottled at the Anheuser-Busch Plants", "CoffeMate" being made at Nestle plants and Kraft Macaroni & Cheese being made at the Kraft plant. I don't doubt that the companies that make some ingredients are "sold" to competitors {like Kraft selling the powdered cheese to companies that make store brand Mac N' Cheze} but that is not what you are suggesting.

Any examples?

Hi chet everett,

As someone who had his own private labels as well as buying from manufactures on location I can verify this is very often the case. This does not always mean the same thing. The company may have specs that the sub contractor follows which differ from their own band or the brand of another that they also subcontract.
Of course it can matter. When Sears went to Exide for its Diehard batteries a slimy insider arragement developed where used batteries ended up in the line. Criminals do not always follow the specs.

Can-X may have 3 different proportions of CAS numbers and you may have a label that has a different proportion or even one for another. Chem companies may easily reverse engineer many of the mixes which are not proprietary For example doing 45% CAS # and 55% CAS #2 is not proprietary. So they can just private label that up with a sample of brand-X. I was told by one company I bought from that WD-40 was just a paper company. They farmed out their canning of the formula. Heck AMD was a sub for Intel for awhile.
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Old 05-21-2009, 02:36 PM
 
28,453 posts, read 85,379,084 times
Reputation: 18729
Default Maybe ...

WD-40 Company and Product History

MarketWatch.com Story

Sears Settles DieHard Batteries Case - Los Angeles Times

Quote:
Originally Posted by gwynedd1 View Post
Hi chet everett,

As someone who had his own private labels as well as buying from manufactures on location I can verify this is very often the case. This does not always mean the same thing. The company may have specs that the sub contractor follows which differ from their own band or the brand of another that they also subcontract.
Of course it can matter. When Sears went to Exide for its Diehard batteries a slimy insider arragement developed where used batteries ended up in the line. Criminals do not always follow the specs.

Can-X may have 3 different proportions of CAS numbers and you may have a label that has a different proportion or even one for another. Chem companies may easily reverse engineer many of the mixes which are not proprietary For example doing 45% CAS # and 55% CAS #2 is not proprietary. So they can just private label that up with a sample of brand-X. I was told by one company I bought from that WD-40 was just a paper company. They farmed out their canning of the formula. Heck AMD was a sub for Intel for awhile.
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Old 05-23-2009, 10:04 AM
 
Location: Rhode Island (Splash!)
1,150 posts, read 2,699,505 times
Reputation: 444
Last night at big local supermarket, Friendly's ice cream $5.49 a carton, on sale for $1.49 a carton. Okay now, that's odd!!!

Curious to see now how things play out, but I think the Fed is waaaaaaaaay too active going the other way for any real deflation to set in.
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Old 05-23-2009, 10:13 AM
 
12,867 posts, read 14,914,172 times
Reputation: 4459
i suspect that inflation is on the horizon. here is an interesting chart on the cost of the plans:
John's Corner of the World: Massive inflation over the horizon?
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Old 05-23-2009, 10:24 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,481,831 times
Reputation: 27720
Quote:
Originally Posted by floridasandy View Post
i suspect that inflation is on the horizon. here is an interesting chart on the cost of the plans:
John's Corner of the World: Massive inflation over the horizon?
Ben and Timmy say it's gonna be alright..they got this under control
They can easily avoid massive inflation.
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